[Brunni]

I wanted to post this in another section but since I'm a newbie I had to do it here; feel free to move
 
So, hey guys, new here

 Wanting a replacement for my Senn HD 238 (semi-open) that I forgot in Switzerland, I first "dumbly" went to the biggest Yodobashi store I knew, tried a bunch and ended up with the HD2.30i. What a terrible mistake; while they were very comfortable and sounded good compared to other, even more bassy models that I had tested before, once home I really hated the signature and found no instance where I could appreciate it, so I returned them and took a Grado s80e instead (slightly better educated choice, but I was limited in time to select another headset since the return was exceptional already).
 
Now the Grado s80e is a really wide open headphone

 Which is fine, although a bit disappointed compared to the semi-open HD 238 which were the perfect compromise. I also find a slight lack of bass on the Grado, or rather the treble are "too well defined", to a point they can be annoying after a while (you can't really just listen to them while working/studying), and it would (IMHO) have been perfect with a very slight V curve since it's not flat anyway. The clear advantage of the Grado is the incomparable sound stage though, and people may favor that over the more "convenient" HD 238 (comfortable, light, more modern, much less sound leak).
 
But hey this is not a review, what I'm wondering is… where have the open headphones gone? The Grado feels like from another decade (if not century), the HD 238 (or updated 239) from, well, 2012. Or even better, semi-open headphones? Is it me or the market has totally shifted away? Having started with the venerable PX100, it makes me wonder, what is "en vogue" now, and why?
 
The only explanation I can come up with is that open-back design has too much compromises, it's basically like having high quality speakers, without the positioning hassle, for a fraction of the price and some weight on your head. You'll keep them at home with the same benefits/drawbacks as speakers. And nowadays with laptops/phones producing more satisfying sound, as well as cheap very good portable speaker systems, we have less use for open headphones. People will prefer in-ear and closed-back on the go. Also people like bass, not that it has to be deep nor realistic. They want (I guess) something like that HD2.30.
 
But is that it? Is really open headsets (or better semi-open) a thing of the past? 

 
Cheers,
Brunni

 

[Monsterzero]

Simple short answer is:

Open headphones are more popular than ever before,but primarily at a higher price point than many of your mobile friendly HPs.

 

[serman005]

  I wanted to post this in another section but since I'm a newbie I had to do it here; feel free to move
 
So, hey guys, new here

 Wanting a replacement for my Senn HD 238 (semi-open) that I forgot in Switzerland, I first "dumbly" went to the biggest Yodobashi store I knew, tried a bunch and ended up with the HD2.30i. What a terrible mistake; while they were very comfortable and sounded good compared to other, even more bassy models that I had tested before, once home I really hated the signature and found no instance where I could appreciate it, so I returned them and took a Grado s80e instead (slightly better educated choice, but I was limited in time to select another headset since the return was exceptional already).
 
Now the Grado s80e is a really wide open headphone

 Which is fine, although a bit disappointed compared to the semi-open HD 238 which were the perfect compromise. I also find a slight lack of bass on the Grado, or rather the treble are "too well defined", to a point they can be annoying after a while (you can't really just listen to them while working/studying), and it would (IMHO) have been perfect with a very slight V curve since it's not flat anyway. The clear advantage of the Grado is the incomparable sound stage though, and people may favor that over the more "convenient" HD 238 (comfortable, light, more modern, much less sound leak).
 
But hey this is not a review, what I'm wondering is… where have the open headphones gone? The Grado feels like from another decade (if not century), the HD 238 (or updated 239) from, well, 2012. Or even better, semi-open headphones? Is it me or the market has totally shifted away? Having started with the venerable PX100, it makes me wonder, what is "en vogue" now, and why?
 
The only explanation I can come up with is that open-back design has too much compromises, it's basically like having high quality speakers, without the positioning hassle, for a fraction of the price and some weight on your head. You'll keep them at home with the same benefits/drawbacks as speakers. And nowadays with laptops/phones producing more satisfying sound, as well as cheap very good portable speaker systems, we have less use for open headphones. People will prefer in-ear and closed-back on the go. Also people like bass, not that it has to be deep nor realistic. They want (I guess) something like that HD2.30.
 
But is that it? Is really open headsets (or better semi-open) a thing of the past? 

 
Cheers,
Brunni

Not sure where you got the idea that open headphones are a thing of the past. On the contrary, they are enormously popular. Sure, closed are the choice for portable solutions. But beyond that, open headphones are extremely popular, as @monsterzero asserts. Many open headphones have terrific bass response, btw.

 

[Brunni]

Interesting. I haven't seen that many as I was looking for new headphones. However, I have limited my budget pretty severely so as I understand it might be the reason
 
Terrific bass response is not the same as very "loud" bass, from my experience open-back headphones usually have more "natural" (and deep) bass, but not "boosted"/overcompensated bass as we see it a lot on closed-back headphones.

 

[Music Alchemist]

The Koss KTXPRO1 is my favorite semi-open headphone. I like it more overall than all of these semi-open models:
 
AudioQuest NightHawk
beyerdynamic DT 880 Edition 600 Ω
Fostex TH900*
Koss KSC75
Koss Porta Pro
Koss UR40
Koss UR55
Sennheiser PX 100-II
V-MODA Crossfade LP*
 
(Ones with an asterisk are almost closed but considered semi-open by some.)
 
As for open-backs...read the Buying Guide to see some good ones.
 
http://www.head-fi.org/a/head-fi-buying-guide-over-ear-headphones

 

[ProtegeManiac]

 
Now the Grado s80e is a really wide open headphone

 Which is fine, although a bit disappointed compared to the semi-open HD 238 which were the perfect compromise. I also find a slight lack of bass on the Grado, or rather the treble are "too well defined", to a point they can be annoying after a while (you can't really just listen to them while working/studying), and it would (IMHO) have been perfect with a very slight V curve since it's not flat anyway.

 

Both actually. Grados tend to roll off too early (by 70hz it's already level with 1000hz and keeps going downhill from there) but everything from 4000hz to 10000hz is louder than 1000hz, and up to 10dB louder at 9000hz.

 

  The clear advantage of the Grado is the incomparable sound stage though, and people may favor that over the more "convenient" HD 238 (comfortable, light, more modern, much less sound leak).

 

Not really though. Soundstage on Grados seem "wide" but the more apt term is disproportionate. You get strong L-C-R but weaker signals on notes that are between L-C and C-R. Drum rolls go from far right to far left, but if they're imaged as wide as the guitars if not wider, that basically makes it look like you have either Mr. Fantastic or Galactus banging on the drums vs normal size Marvel heroes for the rest of the band. You might notice that in reality we don't have building-sized drummers much less one big enough to make a solar system shishkebob. On top of that, there really isn't any sense of depth.

 

When it come to having incomparable soundstage though there's the K1000, but then that barely counts as a headphone, so there's the K701 and HD800.
 

 
But hey this is not a review, what I'm wondering is… where have the open headphones gone? The Grado feels like from another decade (if not century), the HD 238 (or updated 239) from, well, 2012.
 
The only explanation I can come up with is that open-back design has too much compromises, it's basically like having high quality speakers, without the positioning hassle, for a fraction of the price and some weight on your head. You'll keep them at home with the same benefits/drawbacks as speakers. And nowadays with laptops/phones producing more satisfying sound, as well as cheap very good portable speaker systems, we have less use for open headphones. People will prefer in-ear and closed-back on the go. Also people like bass, not that it has to be deep nor realistic. They want (I guess) something like that HD2.30.
 
But is that it? Is really open headsets (or better semi-open) a thing of the past?

 

What do you mean? They're still the most common design for audiophile headphones. K602, K612, K701, K702, K7XX, K712, Q701, K812, HD600, HD650, HD6XX, HD700, HD800, HD800S, HE-300, HE-350, HE-400S, HE-400, HE-400i, HE-500, HE-560, HE-5, HE-6, EL-8 Open, LCD-2, LCD-2F, LCD-3, LCD-4, M1060, Edition 10, Qualia, Lambda, Omega, SR60, SR80, SR125, SR225, SR325, RS2, RS1, PS500, PS1000, GH1, GS1000, AD500, AD700, AD900, DT880, T90, T1...

 

And while you're right that people will keep them at home, in terms of computer advancements, these are actually in favor of using open headphones. Higher efficiency and lower TDP means less cooling capacity, so you can sacrifice either dissipation area or airflow volume. That means you won't necessarily need an H105 on a Bulldozer and the equivalent of an H80 on the 295X anymore. You can keep using an NH-D15 or Dark Rock Pro 3 or H5 Ultimate on the CPU, but you can keep the fans spinning slowly; GPUs also come with Zero Fan Mode, and even if you're watching a concert BluRay at 1080p, it's not going to get much hotter than ambient for the fans to spin faster and interfere with what you're listening to.

And it's not even just PCs becoming more efficient. I realized at some point that I had a totally fanless music server from my mobile provider.

 
Even portable speaker systems are a totally different animal. These are for the most part BT speakers running off batteries, with low power amps driving high efficiency, but still tiny, drivers. And as much as these are speakers, building both physical channels into a single box does worse for soundstage and imaging than hanging them on your head with one ear hearing only one driver (something Crossfeed can easily fix). Even the larger ones are either still too small to provide fullrange sound or they're designed to deliver bass given some compromises, like those roller bag+guitar amp form factor PA speakers used to just fill up a backyard with bass beats for drunk teenagers.

 

 
People will prefer in-ear and closed-back on the go.

 

That's because you can more easily prevent tinnitus as well as hear the bass better just by increasing isolation rather than try to crank it up to try to drown out ambient noise.

 

 
Or even better, semi-open headphones? Is it me or the market has totally shifted away?

 

That's because they're too much of a "neither here nor there" design. Think of the short-lived era of the Battlecruiser, and no, it had less to do with how the aircraft carrier ended big gun ships in general.

At first it seemed like a great idea to have a ship that was cheaper to make that had heavy 11in to 13in guns that could go faster than a fully armoured, 14in or larger-gunned battleship. But as we can glean from Jutland, this had two problems: first, wireless communication wasn't good enough to coordinate complex pincer maneuvers, adding to that, the speed advantage of battlecruisers wasn't enough to begin with for how they basically conceived the battleships as heavy infantry (like Phalangites and Legionnaries) with the battlecruiser as the heavy cavalry (like the Companions, or Italian or German Auxilia). Then the British kind of realized this, so instead of complex maneuvers, they sent the Hood to fight muzzle to muzzle against Bismarck, which didn't even finish its second salvo (or first actual salvo, since the first was for spotting) before a plunging shell tore the Hood apart.

 

It's a similar situation with earcup design. The semi-open design still lets a lot of noise in, on top of which you have drivers that need more power compared to IEMs, which have higher sensitivity and even better isolation. Going back to the naval analogy, this is a lot like if the Hood was sunk in the Pacific. Sure, it had a lot of firepower, but one lucky hit from a Kate torpedo bomber or Val dive bomber will cripple if not tear it apart. That Japanese carrier-based bomber is like an IEM - individually costs less to operate if you don't count the carrier, small, and compact, but packs enough of a punch to tear up even Prince of Wales and Repulse. Similarly, US Marine Air Corps pilots flying similar types of planes sank Hiei and several transports off Guadalcanal.

Back to headphones again, in situations where you could use semi-open cans, you might as well have been using fully open cans anyway, and even at home when isolation is required, you might as well have used closed back headphones if not IEMs.

 

My own set ups follow these principles also. I have the Aurisonics ASG-1.3 for mobile use and the HD600 for my reference headphone rig, although I do have the semi-open Superlux HD330 on my gaming PC. That said, I didn't buy it specifically because it was semi-open. Yes, I needed some isolation from the PC fans, but since they'd only really ramp up when the temps rise while gaming, I could do with open headphones and just crank it up a little bit more. Really, I bought them more for having a 150ohm impedance (which won't be a problem for high output impedance soundcards) and the fact that they cost less than brand new HD600 earpads, which I'll end up needing more often if I used my HD600 for gaming, adding to the on-head time that they serve.

 

[Raketen]

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