[blessingx]

Well, I picked up a 8GB Nano this weekend. It's output is less than the last iPod I had (4G/Photo - can't compare to the 5G as I never did serious listening to it). This is most noticeable when you try to stress test it (with HD650 straight, etc.). It's less full running into a Lunch Box and overall has a more 'digital' sound (though from listening to other DAPs and even headphones, this is a sound some, maybe even most, prefer). From the 2G on the iPod had a more laid back sound and this is more peppy (have not spent much time with the iPod mini or 1G nano).

That all said, all portable audio is about compromise. Anyone who claims it's "all about sound quality" and isn't walking around with a car battery and a DAT & DAC strapped to their back, is lying. I have a nice little MacBook/Lavry DA10/balanced HD650 setup. It sounds quite amazing and could fit in a backpack, but it isn't portable (as defined by nearly all the posts in this forum). I no longer own a Creative NJB, Sony R70, MobiBLU 1500i, etc. because of other compromises.

I'll need more time to fully test the Nano, but already I find the claim "SQ on iPod Nano 2G 8GB is terrible!" ridiculous. Again it may not be your cup of tea, but that isn't the same thing. For the last two days I've been listening to the KSC75s, ER4Ps, HF1s and SR71/HF1s out of it and have to say I think it's a quite decent size/performance package.

If you're anything like me, as your home system has gotten better you start to expect less out of your portable. You have to as any of the DAPs we talk about (with possible exception of iHP120) can be easily beaten when size isn't a consideration. Great sound is a shifting target. I haven't heard a DAP with great sound for a long time. So we have this tiny thin Nano. It powers most portable phones well (impedence/effecieny exceptions as always), has decent storage for what most would need on daily basis, and I think sounds quite good out of the phones mentioned above. And it has a line out if you want to take things up a notch with portable amps we all know about.

So far I'd have no problem recommending it.

EDIT: I've been testing the A900 this morning at work with the same positive results.

 

[pds6]

blessingx says:
Quote:

That all said, all portable audio is about compromise.

Well said. We are so far down the audio food chain that the claims drive me crazy!

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Anyone who claims it's "all about sound quality" and isn't walking around with a car battery and a DAT & DAC strapped to their back, is lying.

I own the next heavies thing. A Cosmic, Travel Bag and Two Red Bricks (8 "D" batteries).

Quote:

I've been listening to the KSC75s, ER4Ps, and SR71/HF1s out of it and have to say I think it's a quite decent size/performance package.

I continue to believe it is a question of taste and not quality. I like the sound of the Ety's and I don't think it is a surprise that I also think the iPod passes any test.

I like the Ety's and SuperMacro set-up more than the SR-71 match. I think the SR-71 sound better with a pair of E5's.

 

[yeeyy]

BlessingX, are you able to do a RMAA Test for your Nano 2G?

 

[blessingx]

I may at some point, but the results aren't important enough for me to learn how to accurately setup and test the prog or overcome the fact that it isn't available (as far as I can tell) for my OS (or trust the reliability of audio through Parallels). Not trying to dismiss the results any more than frequency response graphs, just don't have an easy/quick way to measure it.

 

[FA22RaptorF22]

Quote:

Originally Posted by werdwerdus Would you buy an Ipod Shuffle for $29?

pshhh NO. I will buy a 6G ipod maybe....just to see what its like....when they make it....Then i can catalog ppl's fingerprints on its screen...

 

[Jokieman31]

Quote:

Originally Posted by afobisme all i know is that i've yet to hear someone complain about the SQ of the iriver, samsung, iAudio, and rio DAPs... yet i've heard plenty of complaints on poor SQ from iPods. yeah, apple owns more marketshares, which means more exposure. hypothetically (not based on data), let's assume that apple owns 65% of the market (or better yet, 65% of portable mp3 players owned on headfi are the iPods). iriver, samsung, iAudio, and rio.. let's say 20% of the people here own one of those. well, all of the 4 previously mentioned DAPs have 0 complaints, while the iPods have a decent amount of dissatisfied users (let's say 20% based on what headfiers have reported). proportionally, this alone makes me skeptical of the iPod's sound fidelity. this is enough to convince me to never buy an overpriced iPod.

Ipod & Itunes has an 88% market share. Just FYI. Up several percent over last year. The Myth that apple products are better continues unabated, the truth is, Apple is as bad as Microsoft USED to be with quality control. However their pricing for their Ipods are all very much in line with other music devices (in fact I found most to be MORE expensive with much less storage space.)

And the Nano's size can't easly be beat (and the Shuffle, well, heh, you may beat it size wise, but anything smaller is too damned small.)

What pisses me off is that out of all the Ipods, the Nano has the worst SQ. Even the Shuffle has a better sound, and I'd REALLY like to know WHY. Considering you pay twice as much for the low end nano as the new shuffle.

 

[blessingx]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jokieman31 Even the Shuffle has a better sound, and I'd REALLY like to know WHY. Considering you pay twice as much for the low end nano as the new shuffle.

Control wheel, display, line out components, minimum twice the memory... several reasons the Nano is more expensive than the Shuffle.

I will agree the Nano is from my couple day perception, behind the 4G iPod and Shuffle in overall SQ.

This thread has gone off in so many silly directions which seems to be the case whenever someone goes overboard criticizing or praising any Apple products. I will say I'm not sure there is an overall myth that Apple products are better (on the iPod or Mac - though on the latter there are certainly competing, opposing myths). There's likely a myth (or maybe anti-myth as it's not really spoken) that the iPod is the only player in town. There may be a perception that the iPod is better built, not because (as is often proposed) of advertising, but because it is made of metal. That's something I think most of us apply on much we buy. The books cover and all that. But the point brought up several pages back, and Head-Fiers seems to constantly ignore, is that iTunes (initially the program, eventually the store) plays a gigantic force in this equation for the general public. I'm not saying it is justified, but I think many feel that's the element most at play in the iPods success. Jobs is even on record saying the smartest move they made with the iPod was taking the controls off the player and putting it on the computer. Again right or wrong, this seems to be successful. The resulting player is simple, if not as customizable as a Karma, etc. Simple is key in an appliance for the general public. That doesn't mean they're stupid (though many Head-Fiers seem to think they are), it just means they care enough about struggling with settings as most of you do modding your cars engine (to someone that likes to tinker there).

Every way you look at this Sony should be the Apple here. Their slow adoption of HD storage, severe DRM, horrible (and decently well known horrible) software and internal fighting between entertainment and electronics departments (at one point they were suing each other) kept that from happening.

Lastly I don't know if very many iPod owners are fanboys more than iRiver, iAudio, etc. users. There's certainly a bias towards what you own. We all see that on this site, but especially in this forum. But who in their right mind would come here hyping the iPod to seem cool? Cool [usually] is inherently connected with exposing the independent (I listen to a more obscure band than you, etc.). Who is cool you uses what 80%+ of the public does? How many girls turn their heads when I'm cruising past in my Toyota Corolla? Unfortunately, not many. It is cool to take down #1 though. While the iPod and iTunes has a ton of stuff to be critical of, I find the criticisms a bit more over the top than the positive comments. Do a search on Head-Fi. See how many state the iPod is the best sounding DAP ever? Not many. Easiest, best line-out (not much competition), nice design, etc.? Sure. How many thinks it is "horrible," "a waste," "sounds terrible," etc.? Lots. Is there a Head-Fi perception that the iPod is only successful because of advertising? Yes. Is there a perception here that you only end up with an iPod because you don't know better? Yes. Are there a lot of Head-Fiers who have an iPod after trying or owning other DAPs? Yes. Are there lots of [especially young] members in the portable forum (which financially is easier to buy the "top contenders") who define themselves by their purchase choices and most telling seem to take personally the success of the iPod? Hell yes. I was the same way with radio stations in the past. Screw WMMS. That doesn't make the majority of the criticism mute (again the iPod has its problems and as #1 will likely attract the most discussion pro and con - who's gonna really hate iAudio?), but does bring a percent of that criticism in question, and especially sometimes the scale of the criticism. Terrible sounding? Really?

Then again sometimes I think it's as simple as many (but not all) of those defending the iPod are talking to other Head-Fi members and many (but not all) of those attacking the iPod are speaking to the general public.

 

[The_Duke_Of_Eli]

Quote:

Originally Posted by blessingx (read post above, will not actually quote it because it is very long)

Well said. I think it all comes down to what kind of device you're looking for. Personally I think the 8gb nano is the top (flash-based) DAP currently on the market. Sure some companies will have a weak FM tuner or line-in recording or even voice recording (all of which is more of a novelty on such a small device). And don't even try to argue watching video on those devices. The max screen is about 1.7" now, although the Clix has a 2.2" screen. I found a 2.5" screen barely acceptable. 3" wide is the minimum for a reasonable experience. I've been told that I'm an Apple fanboy. And so be it, but not for everything Apple makes. I liked their ipod minis for their rugged desgin, I like their nanos for the same reason and I like their design of the new shuffle, truly a workout's best friend. Consider this thread hi-jacked yet again. Whoops.

 

[DDF]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dura Up to this day I still do not understand why ipods are so wildly popular (again unamed, through the hreadphone out like 99% of the people use it). And especially the older ones had very poor batterylife, scratched easily and you are as stuck with AAC as I am with Atrac. And yet, they are the DAP to have. Why?

Ipods are the new Bose.

God bless 'em, they'll get as loaded as Amar too. Amazing feat capturing brad identity the way they have.

Ipod's are the no-thought option for people uninclined to research their purchases, but who want to feel they bought quality.

This doesn't make them bad or good; its an independant but very true statement.

 

[gsansite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDF Ipods are the new Bose. God bless 'em, they'll get as loaded as Amar too. Amazing feat capturing brad identity the way they have. Ipod's are the no-thought option for people uninclined to research their purchases, but who want to feel they bought quality. This doesn't make them bad or good; its an independant but very true statement.

Quite possibly true, they also buy cheap chinese flash players of eBay (seeing these more often than iPods now).

Of course you can't deny that the iPod is also an option for people who are inclined to research their purchases, and want to know they're buying quality.

And i think you meant Apple is the new Bose, iPod is not a company.

 

[pds6]

DDF & dura et al say:
Quote:

And yet, they are the DAP to have. Why?

I will once again repeat my mantra. Someday it will sink in - I hope.

ALL daps are far down the audio food chain. If a couple of vintage tube mono-blocks are a pod of Killer Whales, the iPod ( fill in the name of ANY other player) is a minnow. You own a minnow. Deal with it!

Add to this the fact that there is very little spread between the highest rated dap and the lowest. Don't believe me, look at the reviews. I would further suggested that if you are coming line-out, the gap closes even further.

The are no Super Hero daps with magical powers. I know of no dap that is not safe around Cryptonit.

Good Luck

 

[gloco]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pds6 gloco says: Another scary iriver hippy.

I notice you've been posting a lot in this thread.

Ah, I gotta love the irrational apple fanboys who permeate this board. I find it amusing that someone bashes the SQ of an apple product and all of a sudden people take sides and the outcome is a idiotic battle to the finish. Hearing is subjective, get over it.

(hugs his rio karma

)

 

[pds6]

gloco says:
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Hearing is subjective, get over it.

Not only is hearing subjective, but there is not a whole lot, more or less, to hear!

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(hugs his rio karma )

Remember what Mr. Whipple said, "Don't Squeeze the Karma"

EDIT: Another scary rio karma hippy.

 

[DDF]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pds6 DDF & dura et al say: ALL daps are far down the audio food chain. If a couple of vintage tube mono-blocks are a pod of Killer Whales, the iPod ( fill in the name of ANY other player) is a minnow. You own a minnow. Deal with it!

I actually do own two vintage tube monoblocks (heavily modified Dynaci MKIV's.

Little fat around the midrift for a killer whale, I'll take Bryston 4BSST or Odyssey Stratos mono extremes any day.

I know good sound. I've never even heard an ipod, not even remotely interested, so I didn't diss its sound.

From a marketing perspective (answering the question asked), what I said was dead on the money.

I'm glad you enjoy your ipod. The main reason I'm not interested is that my needs are met by a flash player that runs on AAs.

 

[pds6]

DDF says:
Quote:

I actually do own two vintage tube monoblocks (heavily modified Dynaci MKIV's.

Never heard of "Dynaci".

I have heard of Dynaco.

Curiouser and Curiouser.