[stason99]

Hi all,

I recently switched to Sennheiser HD600 with Sonarworks. I use the average profile for HD600. On the correcting curve there's a 2k boost (obviously on the curve before correction there's a 2k dip). The 2k boost is VERY dramatic on rock music with "guitar walls", meaning overdrive guitars. It changes the whole guitar sound as well as vocals.

My question is this... has anyone confirmed that this 2k boost for HD600 is proper corrections? Anyone compared it with another pair of Sonarworks-corrected headphones and confirmed that the boost should be there? In other words, has anyone compared Sonarworks-corrected HD600 with another Sonarworks-corrected model and found them sounding similar in the 2k region?

 

[stason99]

Anyone, please?

 

[SilverEars]

To my ears HD600 mids sound fine. I don't know if I'd boost 2k. How much of a boost is it?

You'd have to see if it's the mastering or the EQ. How the music is mastered makes a difference in how even the most neutral headphone sounds. Headphone have degree of color and so does recordings.

If you're listening is isolated set of music types or genre, you should set your EQ or no EQ to the setting most right to your ears for the music you listen to.

 

[stason99]

This is the frequency response before correction, according to Sonarworks. The average profile for HD600 is based on this curve and corrects the response to be flat. As you can see, they boost that dip around 2k to make it flat.

I need most flat, most truthful headphones for mixing. I don't need pleasant but truthful.

To my ears, after applied correction overdriven guitars sound more natural, and vocals are louder. But the change is pretty dramatic on guitars, so I must double check with other users whether they agree with this correction of HD600 by Sonarworks.

 

[stason99]

Another picture

 

[stason99]

Anyone else, please?

 

[Davesrose]

Anyone else, please?

There are debates about whether one should mix with a flat response with headphones, as that's actually un-natural and not what the consumer will be hearing with their headphones. Many brands will aim for one of the most recognized standards: the Harmon Headphone Response Curves: which is aiming to get the most "natural" balance for different types of headphones and their interaction with the ear. Speakers don't have this problem, and a flat response can be ideal (since their presentation is far enough away for a non-artifiical horizontal plane). That's one of the main reasons most sound engineers say that speakers are more ideal than headphones for mixing (where a flat response is ideal).

https://e265b8fd1ff9a586c366-1acdfa...-for-Choosing-Loudspeakers-and-Headphones.pdf

 

[340519]

I'm looking at their site. Does anyone on headfi recommend this product? Is it good?

 

[stason99]

I'm looking at their site. Does anyone on headfi recommend this product? Is it good?

Whose site?

 

[stason99]

There are debates about whether one should mix with a flat response with headphones, as that's actually un-natural and not what the consumer will be hearing with their headphones. Many brands will aim for one of the most recognized standards: the Harmon Headphone Response Curves: which is aiming to get the most "natural" balance for different types of headphones and their interaction with the ear. Speakers don't have this problem, and a flat response can be ideal (since their presentation is far enough away for a non-artifiical horizontal plane). That's one of the main reasons most sound engineers say that speakers are more ideal than headphones for mixing (where a flat response is ideal).

https://e265b8fd1ff9a586c366-1acdfa...-for-Choosing-Loudspeakers-and-Headphones.pdf

Well, I've done my research and chosen to mix in flat headphones. Monitors and proper room treatment are out of question for now. I've mixed on HD590 for 18 years. I'm very much used to how they sound but I've found mixing low end problematic in HD590. HD600 with Sonarworks have very good low end so this problem is solved. But that 2k is pretty dramatic on rock guitars and all I need to know is if that's how flat headphones should really sound.

 

[340519]

Whose site?

Sonarworks

 

[stason99]

Sonarworks

My only concern is that they don't do phase correction such as with use of FIR filters but to my knowledge no one does that for headphones yet, anyway.

 

[Davesrose]

Well, I've done my research and chosen to mix in flat headphones. Monitors and proper room treatment are out of question for now. I've mixed on HD590 for 18 years. I'm very much used to how they sound but I've found mixing low end problematic in HD590. HD600 with Sonarworks have very good low end so this problem is solved. But that 2k is pretty dramatic on rock guitars and all I need to know is if that's how flat headphones should really sound.

My point was that there really isn't a "flat" response for headphones, and if you have a target that is flat it will sound un-natural: because of the differences in HRTF with headphone setups and ear anatomy (and hence arguments for using Harmon target curves). Some engineers have said they feel a brighter headphone is better for mixing: to highlight details. Others seem to like recessed mids that can mimic some acoustics. Audeze X's are highly touted as headphones that engineers who have only used speakers will use. If you look at its FR, you'll see it has some recession in the mids/upper mids.

 

[stason99]

My point was that there really isn't a "flat" response for headphones, and if you have a target that is flat it will sound un-natural: because of the differences in HRTF with headphone setups and ear anatomy (and hence arguments for using Harmon target curves). Some engineers have said they feel a brighter headphone is better for mixing: to highlight details. Others seem to like recessed mids that can mimic some acoustics. Audeze X's are highly touted as headphones that engineers who have only used speakers will use. If you look at its FR, you'll see it has some recession in the mids/upper mids.

Well, HD600 with Sonarworks sound damn good, I would not call this unnatural. The only reason I bought HD600 after mixing for 18 years on HD590 is that Sonarworks doesn't offer profiles for HD590. HD590 sound brighter with a boost around 8k which I always considered natural but HD600 with Sonarworks shows how unnatural that 8k of HD590 is. Plus low end is poor on HD590. Even though I've made many great mixed using nothing but hd590 in spite of its limitations...

 

[Davesrose]

Well, HD600 with Sonarworks sound damn good, I would not call this unnatural. The only reason I bought HD600 after mixing for 18 years on HD590 is that Sonarworks doesn't offer profiles for HD590. HD590 sound brighter with a boost around 8k which I always considered natural but HD600 with Sonarworks shows how unnatural that 8k of HD590 is. Plus low end is poor on HD590. Even though I've made many great mixed using nothing but hd590 in spite of its limitations...

Yet you've asked about elevated levels in the 2k region: right in line with the upper mid recession most headphone transfers actually include.