firefly89
Head-Fier
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2007
- Posts
- 67
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- 11
Ok, so I have some akg 701's, they're light in the bass but great for gaming (the reason I got them).
I was looking for an amp to use with them, and then also a DAC- I bought a few to test out:
so in my hands I have asus xonar u3 and u7 usb gaming cards, audio engine d1, fiio e17, fiio e12, and a creative recon that is still in the post
i'm not an audiophile, I don't care for neutrality I just want the music I listen to sound good. Perhaps that means getting new headphones, but I like these, I got them at a great price and they look great.
primary uses are gaming, music listening and also might get back into music production (so also considering a nice pro grade audio interface too)
I got into researching the odac and 02, and at first I thought 'id defintitely hate the clinical sound', but after reading his blog (and learning a lot...) I realised that a perfect DAC and perfect amp remain true to the original signal (and as a graphic designer I know all about calibrated workflows), but that the pure unadulterated signal actually sounds boring, so most amps add in some colour to 'improve' the sound. So my headphones are bass light, so I was combining them with a bass heavy amp (fiio e12), but the source that feeds them needs to be clean as possible.
my thoughts on the amps:
fiio e17- a nice warm sound, lots of bass even without EQ, slightly forward mids, seems to sound good with lots of genres, very musical, forgiving on poor quality source, but then not so revealing on higher quality sources, useful as a portable DAC/amp,
audioengine d1- clearly more detailed than the e17, much less bass, better clarity, slightly better separation, more revealing on higher quality recordings but also punishing on lower quality sources, extremely useful volume knob and looks great on my desk. no where near enough bass for me
u7- similar to d1 but much harsher sounding
u3- muddy sound, but quite bass heavy and musical, I actually liked the sound, sure it's low fi and low detail but it's rich and thich and warm
fiio e12- extreme bass, with the bass boost on the e12 pulls out deep sub bass I never thought i'd get from the k701's, fed from the xonar u3 it is the most musical, I was extremely happy with this until I got the other DAC's to compare, ultimately detail is lost on this set up but the bass is there and it sounds warm. after comparing the d1 and e17 connected to the e12, it was clear I wouldn't be happy with either one without the e12 to add the sub bass, even with the e17 bass boost it never got the sub bass, but the e17 (purely as a DAC) +e12 sounded warm, and nice, like the xonar u3+e12 but more detailed. It sounded great paired with the d1, it had detail and bass (but not a lot of it), this sounded better than the e17+e12 for some recordings, and in others the opposite was true- for the money neither really thrilled me. I did like the 2 fiios strapped together though, it looked great, and a portable SPDIF DAC is useful (or is it?). Ultimately I would keep the d1, xonar u3 (for gaming) and the e12, then I have the dirty/warm/bass set up, and also the clinical/treble set up- the fiio is too in the middle.
so if my sonic preference is
1) warm dirty u3 + sub-bass heavy e12 + bass light k701 = perfect low-mid, but lacking in mid-high
2) slightly dirty/warm e17 + e12 + k701 = perfect low-mid, better in mid-high
3) highly detailed d1 + e12 + k701 = perfect high mid, lacking in mid-low-sub bass
observations
- the d1 is techically a superior DAC, but quite a sterile listen on my headphones, either my headphones don't play back the bass, or the DAC doesn't dig it up- it needs the e12 to bring out the sub bass
- the d1 doesn't color the sound like the fiio e17
- I like the top end of the d1+e12 (this is where the extra detail the dac brings out is evident)
- I miss the low end clout of the fiio e17 and e12 combination
HERE IS MY QUESTION
1) at the moment I only listen to music on my computer, so if I set software EQ (there is a 31 band EQ built right into osx), can I bring out the missing bass/sub-bass with the d1 (removing the need for the e12), I assume that would be easier than trying to bring out the treble in the fiio combination.
or is software eq a big no no- I don't care for bit perfect playback, to my ears using the eq to add the right amount of bass has more of a sound quality effect than straining my ears trying to hear and 'lost data'
one more question:
if I had hardware EQ in my portable DAC (like the fiio e17 but more complex, multi bands etc), and I set it how I liked it, would that mean every source I connected to would sound that way? i.e. if I 'correct' the missing bass on my k701, every source I connect to the eq'd DAC will be 'fixed'
I was looking for an amp to use with them, and then also a DAC- I bought a few to test out:
so in my hands I have asus xonar u3 and u7 usb gaming cards, audio engine d1, fiio e17, fiio e12, and a creative recon that is still in the post
i'm not an audiophile, I don't care for neutrality I just want the music I listen to sound good. Perhaps that means getting new headphones, but I like these, I got them at a great price and they look great.
primary uses are gaming, music listening and also might get back into music production (so also considering a nice pro grade audio interface too)
I got into researching the odac and 02, and at first I thought 'id defintitely hate the clinical sound', but after reading his blog (and learning a lot...) I realised that a perfect DAC and perfect amp remain true to the original signal (and as a graphic designer I know all about calibrated workflows), but that the pure unadulterated signal actually sounds boring, so most amps add in some colour to 'improve' the sound. So my headphones are bass light, so I was combining them with a bass heavy amp (fiio e12), but the source that feeds them needs to be clean as possible.
my thoughts on the amps:
fiio e17- a nice warm sound, lots of bass even without EQ, slightly forward mids, seems to sound good with lots of genres, very musical, forgiving on poor quality source, but then not so revealing on higher quality sources, useful as a portable DAC/amp,
audioengine d1- clearly more detailed than the e17, much less bass, better clarity, slightly better separation, more revealing on higher quality recordings but also punishing on lower quality sources, extremely useful volume knob and looks great on my desk. no where near enough bass for me
u7- similar to d1 but much harsher sounding
u3- muddy sound, but quite bass heavy and musical, I actually liked the sound, sure it's low fi and low detail but it's rich and thich and warm
fiio e12- extreme bass, with the bass boost on the e12 pulls out deep sub bass I never thought i'd get from the k701's, fed from the xonar u3 it is the most musical, I was extremely happy with this until I got the other DAC's to compare, ultimately detail is lost on this set up but the bass is there and it sounds warm. after comparing the d1 and e17 connected to the e12, it was clear I wouldn't be happy with either one without the e12 to add the sub bass, even with the e17 bass boost it never got the sub bass, but the e17 (purely as a DAC) +e12 sounded warm, and nice, like the xonar u3+e12 but more detailed. It sounded great paired with the d1, it had detail and bass (but not a lot of it), this sounded better than the e17+e12 for some recordings, and in others the opposite was true- for the money neither really thrilled me. I did like the 2 fiios strapped together though, it looked great, and a portable SPDIF DAC is useful (or is it?). Ultimately I would keep the d1, xonar u3 (for gaming) and the e12, then I have the dirty/warm/bass set up, and also the clinical/treble set up- the fiio is too in the middle.
so if my sonic preference is
1) warm dirty u3 + sub-bass heavy e12 + bass light k701 = perfect low-mid, but lacking in mid-high
2) slightly dirty/warm e17 + e12 + k701 = perfect low-mid, better in mid-high
3) highly detailed d1 + e12 + k701 = perfect high mid, lacking in mid-low-sub bass
observations
- the d1 is techically a superior DAC, but quite a sterile listen on my headphones, either my headphones don't play back the bass, or the DAC doesn't dig it up- it needs the e12 to bring out the sub bass
- the d1 doesn't color the sound like the fiio e17
- I like the top end of the d1+e12 (this is where the extra detail the dac brings out is evident)
- I miss the low end clout of the fiio e17 and e12 combination
HERE IS MY QUESTION
1) at the moment I only listen to music on my computer, so if I set software EQ (there is a 31 band EQ built right into osx), can I bring out the missing bass/sub-bass with the d1 (removing the need for the e12), I assume that would be easier than trying to bring out the treble in the fiio combination.
or is software eq a big no no- I don't care for bit perfect playback, to my ears using the eq to add the right amount of bass has more of a sound quality effect than straining my ears trying to hear and 'lost data'
one more question:
if I had hardware EQ in my portable DAC (like the fiio e17 but more complex, multi bands etc), and I set it how I liked it, would that mean every source I connected to would sound that way? i.e. if I 'correct' the missing bass on my k701, every source I connect to the eq'd DAC will be 'fixed'
