[jazzy639]

Ive just bitten the bullet and ordered these, despite being WAY above my price range - hoping its an investment and i'll use them for years to come.

Should be with me on Friday

 

[BloodSugar00]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcworm /img/forum/go_quote.gif We are talking about armature here not electrodynamic loudspeaker, Armature speaker are by definition wide band some a bit more some a bit less than other. From a design point of view most IE use a vintage Knowles Acoustics CI2955 it was design 25 years ago for behind the ears earring aid, it was and still is one of the most if not the most powerful armature. It has an huge motor that resonate like hell, resonate means that at certain frequency get undue boost, with proper load those freq can be adjusted and that's a good thing because it allows to compensate earing loss ! Now when it came to use those armature for music, My guess is that at the time earphone manufacturer toke what was available, the natural choice was big fat CI2955 cause powerfull means Bass. But they could not decently use his treble render as it wasn't really suited for "normal" use. Hence the use of an smaller less powerful armature for the treble. What about triple armature ? 2 CI2955 for more bass says the ads... Not quite. One of the issue with the old CI2955 is that it's a distortion beast up to 10%@500 hertz , my guessing is that using 2 CI2955 is really to have them work less and get less distortion (as distortion increase when the drivers works to his maximum extension). In 25 years Manufacturer have made new armature design: Music specific and a lot of improvement have been made in terms of resonance , distortions etc.. at a price.. That was to answer your question, now ultimately regardless how technology can be fascinating It's you ears that you are looking to satisfy not your Brain (I know argument is flawed). There is no shame to prefer the sound coming from 700$ custom multiple 25 years old distorted driver over a new state of the art Klipsh , new UE, Sleek. etc.. But I think It's a good thing that Sleek and others open the gate of new armatures cause it may force some other manufacturer to use better quality armature if they want to be able to justify there price tag. Ultimately this will lead to more customer satisfaction, I hope.

Very interesting and insightful post drmcworm! Thanks

What you detail makes logical sense; simplistically, better quality components utilised can perform better but at a cost. I think you're guessing that, though sleek use a single balanced armature as opposed to multiple drivers with crossover, they have used a high-quality armature in this set-up, that, though is capable of delivering high(er) performance (as most ppl who've tried and/or owned the SA6 have attested to), such technology and quality parts will come at an increased cost to the consumer, reflecting the increased cost to the manufacturer to create.

 

[jazzy639]

What tips are you using for the SA6?

Inculded bi flange
Shure Olives
Compy Foam
other?

 

[tstarn06]

I go back and forth, and for comfort/SQ, I prefer the basic Shure yellow foamies. I also use Shure olives, but they seem too tight sometimes, even with a small in one hear (different ear sizes). Now, the shure yellow foamies are ugly, and get dirty fast. But they are cheap. I just can get used to the Silicone, and haven't really used Comply with the SA6s.

 

[drmcworm]

@ BloodSugar00

there are several improvements that have been made in armatures to name a few: ferro fluid damping , diamond shape coil etc.. Strictly from a spec point of view simply looking at manufacturer catalogue: less distortion, greater output for smaller size, more controlled freq response. It makes sense that those translate some how to our ears.

I notice that the path followed by many has been to add armature to improve quality rather than use better part. I cant refrain me to think that part of the decision making in that process was marketing "the more the better". Using several armature has some merits but liking quality to the need need of 3,4,5 balanced armature really is more hyped than reasoned. What can you do " Twin bass armature for impressive bass response" has a lot more weight than looking a the schematic and noticing that you have in deed those two armature in // but loaded with a resistance. So what you really have 2 armature at 50% and a resistor heating for free

(and a terrible pun)

 

[j2kei]

i just picked up a pair of sa6. coming from the vmoda vibes, i feel really disappointed in the bass

however i do have to say that the clarity is definitely AMAZING. after using these earphones, they made me realized that im a basshead and choose the wrong earphones. i'm already considering reselling or possibly returning these and getting something with more bass.

 

[BloodSugar00]

Quote:

Originally Posted by j2kei /img/forum/go_quote.gif i just picked up a pair of sa6. coming from the vmoda vibes, i feel really disappointed in the bass however i do have to say that the clarity is definitely AMAZING. after using these earphones, they made me realized that im a basshead and choose the wrong earphones. i'm already considering reselling or possibly returning these and getting something with more bass.

I have the SE530's and Triplefi's- both of which deliver strong bass responses- and I don't find the SA6 lacking much, if anything, comparatively to these two phones. There are a number of things you can try to help the bass quanity improve: try shure olives or complys as your tips in place of the supplied silicones; implement a resistor adaptor/attenuator into your (portable) rig; try the bass + port mod/pinhole mod, this adds weight to bass and opens up soundstage a bit; use EQ in the low/bass bands (a bit of clear bass on my sony DAP is great); aquire the W1 wireless adaptor which has an apparent bass boosting quality purposefully designed and inbuilt into it.

 

[j2kei]

ive tried the se530 before, and those definitely have better bass. The sa6 bass as of right now is nothing close to the bass ive heard on the SE530 however i dont remember why i returned them. i think i found them uncomfortable or not worth their high price.

right now the bass i find on the sa6 are weak. i wouldnt describe it as tinny, but something along the line that some lower-end IEM found in electronic stores will have. maybe i am expecting too much?

edit: i did the pinmod on the bass +, this time using a candle and heating the pin. the difference is phenomenal. now the earphones actually has a bass that can compete. i cannot believe the difference between the pin mod and w/o it is this huge.

 

[jazzy639]

Im really considering this pin hole mod! What pin are you guys using? I had taken a normal staple and straightened it. Is this too thin?

It heating the pin up crucial?

 

[graben]

Yes a staple is fine, that is what I used. You don't need to heat it up. The mod absolutely improves the bass, it is like night and day.

 

[tstarn06]

X2. And no heating required. Night and day.

 

[pseudohippy]

Im curious what you others have found without heating. On mine they seem to get clogged up or re-expand the close back up. Not sure what is happening for sure. But I found that every couple weeks or so Ill just put it back through. Maybe its just my mind that thinks the bass fades a little over time. Heating up would maintain the hole for sure but Im scared to do it without any backup ports.

 

[jazzy639]

Hmm i've really not noticed much difference. I know I wont get bass levels near the CX300 because they are boomy. However, it is still no match for my separates system.

My speakers are the B&W DM601 S3, so they are small bookshelf so they dont put out a lot of bass, will try and make the hole larger....

 

[BloodSugar00]

Yeah, I have to say I find it surprising the number of ppl who percieve the differance the pinhole mod has on the bass response from the SA6 to be so great. It could be that I've already got a few other variables at play (likely) boosting bass and/or that I havn't created a large enough hole when I've enacted the mod, but I find it a slight-significant increase, a mild augmenation as opposed to a mammoth enhancement. Hmm, I'll try applying the mod again, this time going for a larger opening.

 

[j2kei]

one thing i really noticed after the bass + pinhole mod was that the sound seem very separated. the bass and more warm sound seem more oriented toward the left ear, while the mids and highs seem more oriented toward the right ear. in addition, it seems like more music seems to be coming out of the left ear. is this right?