SF Bay Area Meet in Marin -- Saturday, October 14, 2006
Oct 17, 2006 at 5:21 AM Post #61 of 95
Considering the amount of gear and people at this fairly large event, the lack of comments/feedback is overwhelmingly disappointing.

Can we possibly get some more comments regarding the Zana Deux? For instince, which headphones it worked well with and vice versa. Some possible comparisons to other current big name amps?
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 6:02 AM Post #62 of 95
I wrote most of this post earlier and then lost it somehow. It fits with the spastic way I have been posting in this impressions thread. I just haven’t caught up with real life since the meet. Anyway, here is one last shot at it, with some pics and scattered impressions along the way.


My_setup.JPG

Here’s my setup sometime during the early afternoon. Although Grahame advertised the meet for 10am, most people didn’t show until the afternoon and the buzz really got going at about 2pm. I had fun playing some vinyl for a few people, but I never managed to break out Hey Jude in a tribute to the generous host of this whole community. I was glad that I brought my Headroom Desktop setup because it was the only HR amp in the place (I saw a Micro Dac but no amps) and because it saw a lot of use. We used it for a few comparisons and ran it both through the Home Dac and through the analog inputs. It is a very versatile setup. The MPX3 has made the rounds previously and was one of three at the meet. Mine has the standard 6SN7 tubes while yellafella and PFKMan’s MPX3s both have high-powered tubes running. I think some people made the rounds, but I only heard the other two amps briefly. Talk about versatile, this amp can be made to sound so many ways while always maintaining a consistently high SQ.


Ric_s_Arm.JPG

My table-mates were episiarch and iamdone, and the latter is setting up behind the table in this pic. Blessingx is checking out episiarch’s rig, after he set up his new Lunchbox for a listen in my rig. My iGrados sat unused most of the time, although a couple people checked them out, and I think Ori said they would be good with an iPod on the go--exactly as intended.
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Also pictured, although not featured, are my new K340s that I am loving (as I type, in fact!). They may get the full Headphile/Philodox mods someday soon...


Yella_and_EC_Gear.JPG

One more pic of the Eddie Currents with yellafella rocking to the Zana Deux. Simply an awesome amp, and maybe the best companion for RS-1s to my ears that I have come across. As I may have said already, I was impressed by how well it drove both Grados and Senns. The high current available to the output stage provides huge power and authority that really grabs onto the drivers and controls them with intense dynamics. There is a lot of slam and great extension high and low, but the control and clarity don’t disappear even at pretty high volume. I own a highly upgraded MPX3 that I love dearly, but this Zana did things mine cannot. I believe with different tubes the MPX3 could have a similar drive, but with 6SN7s, mine does not match what I heard from the short time I had with the Zana. OK, I said it, I think this amp is better than my own at least in some ways. I have not had enough time with it to really gauge the transparency or what music it did well and not, but I know I want more time with it.


HP-1_and_HPA1.JPG

Like the iRiver rockin’ the Big O and Concerto, I loved the incongruity of this beautiful HPA-1 and HP-1 combo playing straight from an iPod! :
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: The HP-1s are very cool, and I was glad to have a chance to try them out with the matching amp. I love the sound -- and they actually fit my big head unlike others at the meet -- and I would love to have a pair. Still might be a little *too neutral* for me, but it is an effortless sound that sounds so natural and easy it is a very pleasant listen.

Next door is the RKV amp that was powering a K1000. They sounded good in this rig that was getting a digital signal from my Squeezebox through the Lavry dac, but I still cannot see going out of my way for these cans. Of course, I might have a different opinion if I hadn’t screwed up again and failed to hear them with the beautiful little Pass Aleph 3 that showed up later. (It was quite difficult to separate xantus from that rig and when he offered to give me a shot I deferred because I was trying out Sleestack’s balanced K701s that he hasn’t even heard yet on daba’s Dynamight. I am not sorry I checked out the K701 because it was a HUGE improvement to my ears over the stock setup. I had heard Tyll’s balanced pair in NYC but only briefly and before I had spent any time with my own. Nice.)

By the way, the HP-1 and K1000 setups belonged to a really good guy by the name of Bobcn who has amassed all of 7 posts in 18 months on Head-Fi! Obviously he is reading and learning, but he needs to speak up a bit! Maybe post some thoughts here? It was a pleasure meeting you Bob and I hope to see you at more meets.


early_couch_1.JPG

As I think has been mentioned, Mikhail didn’t make the meet until late. The details show his dedication and persistence. I talked to him in the morning because the TSA held up -- and maybe screwed up -- his crates-‘o-amps until sometime like 3pm but he still checked them out in San Jose and then drove all the way to Marin. He even gave PFKMan a ride to the meet. Anyway, he set up and immediately people plopped on the listening couch and set to checking out the new Concerto ES. In this pic, (L to R) NeilPeart is contemplating something while daba and xantus are getting in some critical listening.


early_couch_2.JPG

More early evening fun, with the same crew on the couch and PFKMan, Mikhail and Ori setting up while NeilPeart tells them what to do.


group_dinner.JPG

The crew was flagging, so we picked up some Thai food (which is becoming a Bay Area meet tradition) and other refreshments. At table (L to
R, again), we have the back of hostess Joanne’s head, Grahame, Tom of TTVJ, Ori, xantus, NeilPeart and Mikhail.


Racer_5.JPG

And for my Florida hop-head friends, here is a close-up of one of those refreshments.


Late_couch_2.JPG

Late_couch_3.JPG

Late_couch_1.JPG

Basically, we spent the rest of the night warming ourselves from the glow of the tubes and rockin’ and ravin’ to xantus’s iRiver selections. Shpongle was a blast, and I gotta get me some. Obviously, this was some fun times. Other than me, (second from left), the only person in these pics who has not been named a bunch of times is Neilvg (second from right) who graciously brought his Orpheus and e-stats, as well as his EmmLabs setup with its own rack! Thanks for sharing again Neil.

By the way, there are both stock K701s in the front and Sleestack's Black Dragon balanced K701 in the back. Nice.


Creatures_of_the_night.JPG

Finally, I call this one “Creatures of the Night.” It was taken in the purposeful darkness before the blackout that was imposed on us by Grahame’s complex. On some level, it was probably best because we might not have stopped once we got locked into Shpongle zone with SPEED OF GOD POWER!
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Oct 17, 2006 at 6:14 AM Post #63 of 95
Al, it's too bad you didn't get to listen to my K1000 and Aleph 3 combo, and now you might never hear it again seeing how I'm about to upgrade to a FirstWatt F1 soon
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But like you said, it was kind of hard to separate Joe from my setup, but I'm really glad he enjoyed my setup.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 6:35 AM Post #64 of 95
Quote:

Originally Posted by humanflyz
Al, it's too bad you didn't get to listen to my K1000 and Aleph 3 combo, and now you might never hear it again seeing how I'm about to upgrade to a FirstWatt F1 soon
cool.gif
But like you said, it was kind of hard to separate Joe from my setup, but I'm really glad he enjoyed my setup.



NOOOooooooo!!! Oh well, I may have to wait until the International Meet to miss the opportunity again, LOL.
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On a separate note, I do not have anyone's missing CDs mentioned above, but I did end up with a white multiplug extension cord, a short white power strip, and a yellow 3-way plug adapter. I also have one headphone adapter cable so if you are missing any of these let me know and we will figure out how to get it to you.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 3:08 PM Post #66 of 95
Exceedlingly belated thanks and impressions...

Big big thanks to Grahame for his gracious and generous hosting, and to Voltron for his organizational contributions. And to both of you for being all-around great guys as well. It was a really enjoyable meet.

Thanks also to Asr for letting me audition the AE-1 in my own rig; I know you were using it as a cabling component in your own, and it was very kind of you to let me disrupt your setup so I could try it out.

Voltron, I think those bits of power kit are mine; as someone who arrived early, I expected that other peoples' gear would still be plugged into them when I left early, so I made sure they were all surplus to my current [size=xx-small](sorry)[/size] needs. I'm in no rush to get them back soon, or even necessarily ever.

I'm trying to confine my interests to modestly-priced (and minimally sized!) gear, so I didn't get around to the fantastic-looking high end equipment that was literally everywhere in the room. It looked like those gathered around it were having an awesome time.

A few quick notes and impressions:

Gilmore Lite (mine)
I'll start with my own gear just to say that I believe that the hiss Asr heard was an artifact of the meet rig and not the amp. It may have been source-related (cheapo portable DVD driving Micro DAC optical), or related to the daisy chain of two other amps (HeadFive, Go-Vibe 5) coming off its loop-out. Back at the office and plugged back into its customary Micro DAC USB + PC rig (and with no daisy chain of other amps), it is dead silent even on sensitive cans with volume turned all the way up.

HD600 and HD650 (Spektrograf's and Voltron's)
This was my first audition of the HD600 and HD650 since I got my HD595. The 595 is really a nice headphone (and easy to drive, comfortable, etc.) but for pure, focused listening I like the HD600 better. The HD595 is widely considered more "forward" than the HD600, but to my ears the HD600 had an immediacy and presence that the HD595 does not display. The HD650 shares these qualities as well, but is too strong in the bass for my tastes (being an Ety and K501 fanboy).

AKG K340 (Voltron's)
Wow! That is a great-sounding headphone. Lots of sparkle, bottom end, and body, just very nice all around. Voltron mentioned that the HeadRoom amp didn't quite have the oomph to drive it to full potential. I think the Gilmore Lite drives it quite well, but I'm sure not to the level that higher-end amps do.

iGrado (Voltron's)
Nice little (literally; smaller than I expected) headphone that beats the bleep out of consumer streetstyles, and doesn't suck as a headphone for our crowd either. You can give one as a gift without being a traitor to the cause. Drives nicely from, say, a Nano, but definitely benefits from an amp.

Style-wise the iGrado seems lacking, but yesterday I went into someone's office and saw a pair of white streetstyles on his desk. Momentarily I thought they were iGrado's but of course they weren't; they were some generic thing that looked quite similar. That's when I finally 'got' the design concept of the iGrado: it is designed not to be alienating or unfamiliar to the consumer crowd that would buy (and are buying) the generics.

AKG K 81 DJ (not sure whose)
A nice portable, but I found I disagreed with a lot of what I had heard about it. I'd heard it was an uncomfortable head-squeezer; on the contrary, I found it pretty gentle on the head and ears. I'd heard it provided good isolation; not to me, it didn't -- it muted outside sounds somewhat, but not, IMO, enough to let you keep your volume low on a bus or train. And I'd heard it was serious competition for the HD25-1, but I think the latter is miles ahead in impact, fidelity and clarity whether amped or unamped.

I don't mean to sound harsh on the K81DJ; I thought it was a nice product (sonically and designwise) at the price and have already recommended it to one friend. But from the things I'd heard about it, my expectations were higher.

HeadAmp AE-1 (Asr's)
A really nice sounding portable amp, and a great-looking and very practical design as well. Absolutely a winner. Soundwise I didn't prefer it to my Go-Vibe 5, but it didn't suffer in comparison either. With ER-4S's I heard the GV5 as more treble-focused than the AE-1, but not to a large degree. Under meet conditions I didn't get a finer impression of the sonic differences than that, but it was clear that the AE-1 is a high-quality amp all the way.

Netgear Wireless Travel Router (Grahame's)
(With apologies to Grahame) This little router continues my ongoing disenchantment with Netgear consumer products, which seem to work great as long as you stick to default configurations and ports 80 and 443, but are not to be relied upon once you customize the configuration or try to use unfamiliar ports -- such as SlimServer's port 9000. Given my low expectations of success with Netgear custom configurations it makes no sense for me also to complain that this router had a stunning paucity of custom configuration options to begin with, but I will anyway. Even though I know in my heart that they wouldn't have worked (because on Netgear consumer products they never do), it irks me that NetGear didn't include a richer set of configuration settings for me to tinker with.

Yes, I know the router is not a headphone and doesn't belong amidst the other product impressions...but it's the product I spent the most time on at the meet.
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Oct 17, 2006 at 3:46 PM Post #67 of 95
Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltron
Next door is the RKV amp that was powering a K1000. They sounded good in this rig that was getting a digital signal from my Squeezebox through the Lavry dac, but I still cannot see going out of my way for these cans. Of course, I might have a different opinion if I hadn’t screwed up again and failed to hear them with the beautiful little Pass Aleph 3 that showed up later.


I heard the K-1000s with the RKV at first and didn't really didn't "get it" either. I guess it seems to help give the K-1000s more bass but also seemed to lack dynamics. Considering how many people say that it is a good amp for the K-1000s, I was dissapointed and thought it sounded mediocre at best. (comments are about the combo, not the amp in general)

The Pass Aleph 3 did much more justice with them, and I can't wait to hear the F1
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humanflyz wanted to hook his set up to the EMM labs gear, but I think he felt that it would have been a little intrusive given that the HE-90 was being listened to constantly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xantus
aw now I feel bad. as a comment to humanflyz' system, it was easy to lose track of time while listening to it


Don't feel bad. It's people like you that help me to not feel like a nut for holding the K-1000 flag so high
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Anyway, I wish I would have listened more to Eddie Current's stuff. Or maybe it's best I didn't since I've gone the Singlepower route, and feel I may have questioned my whole direction with Singlepower afterwards considering everyone's comments about Eddie's amps. (how's that for a run on sentence?)

In regards to the HP-1:
Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltron
Still might be a little *too neutral* for me, but it is an effortless sound that sounds so natural and easy it is a very pleasant listen.


My personal tastes lean toward that neutral, nothing added to the music (hence my K-1000 love
k1000smile.gif
). Well, I do like coloration at times (I'm Gemini, can you tell), but I definately understand what you mean about the HP-1s in that regard.

So, I was wondering if you heard iamdone's PS-1? The sound is very similar, except with the added "fun". It gives an RS-1 (read: exciting) kind of sound except more refined and detailed - while the HP-1s gave a Senn HD600/ AKG K701 type of sound except much more refined and detailed (IMO).

I have to say iamdone's Mapletree amp was nothing short of impressive, and very good looking as well. I think it helped to soften the bass on the PS-1's which can get overwhelming on the wrong setup.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 4:17 PM Post #68 of 95
Quote:

Originally Posted by robm321
I have to say iamdone's Mapletree amp was nothing short of impressive, and very good looking as well. I think it helped to soften the bass on the PS-1's which can get overwhelming on the wrong setup.


I was actually very impressed with it too especially when it was hooked up to your moddified cd player. I tried the PS-1 on a few other amps like the MPX-3, the Cayin HA-1A, and a GS-1. I didn't get a good listen on the GS-1 since someone was listening to the GS1000 at the same time and the volume was way too loud for me. The MPX-3 has just a bit too much bass and the Cayin sounded really nice with it. The GS-1 sounded too harsh with the few things I did try with it at normal sound levels.

I also found I still didn't like the GS1000 that much on all the setups I tried it. It didn't work well with my Mapletree and when BlessingX had me try it on the Zana Deux, I found it overly warm, still slightly recessed mids, and clear upper highs. It just sounds slightly off for my tastes.

I just wanted make it clear that I did love the Orpheus but somehow I was expecting a mind altering experience just looking at the whole setup and cables. Although you get lost in the music, at no point does it not sound like your listening to headphones. I think I was expecting a much bigger soundstage. The K1000 was the only headphone that did something completely different than all the other headphones I tried as far a soundstage.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 4:44 PM Post #69 of 95
Speaking of being spastic, episiarch's post reminded me of two things I meant to include in my typically long-winded impressions. First, I listened to Asr's setup late in the afternoon and really enjoyed the AE-1. Such a strong little portable, with very clean sound. The loop out is a nice feature as well because Asr was able to put a source into the AE-1 and then loop out to the NKK-01 for quick and easy comparisons. Cool stuff, and I would be interested to hear what the new model will do. The NKK-01 is also very cool, although it seemed to be drained of juice because the sound was collapsing. I love Rudi's big giant chrome volume knob on that little amp. It doesn't seem truly "portable" like the AE-1 or others, but it is nice to be able to tote it around without a cord. I should have pulled out my SR-71 to compare, but I was tired at that point I think. I also gave the Cayin a short listen, and liked it quite a bit. Very nice and easy sound with a clear tube presence but not overly warm or soft.

Second, I meant to point out again how impressed I am with Grahame's mastry of the Squeezebox, even with the network glitches episiarch resolved. I described his setup as "The Future" when he walked into the Saratoga meet and hooked up his own network under the control of the Nokia 770 tablet. I am still impressed even after buying two of my own Squeezeboxes. The tablet is even cooler now with a skin that allows you to scroll through album covers, and Grahame was able to take over any and all Squeezeboxes on the network to sync them, change the songs, shut them down, whatever. Still very cool stuff and lightyears ahead of my feeble usage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by robm321
Don't feel bad. It's people like you that help me to not feel like a nut for holding the K-1000 flag so high
k1000smile.gif


In regards to the HP-1:

My personal tastes lean toward that neutral, nothing added to the music (hence my K-1000 love
k1000smile.gif
). Well, I do like coloration at times (I'm Gemini, can you tell), but I definately understand what you mean about the HP-1s in that regard.

So, I was wondering if you heard iamdone's PS-1? The sound is very similar, except with the added "fun". It gives an RS-1 (read: exciting) kind of sound except more refined and detailed - while the HP-1s gave a Senn HD600/ AKG K701 type of sound except much more refined and detailed (IMO).

I have to say iamdone's Mapletree amp was nothing short of impressive, and very good looking as well. I think it helped to soften the bass on the PS-1's which can get overwhelming on the wrong setup.



I think Joe knows I was just kidding and have nothing against his drive to hear lots of music through lots of systems. He certainly must have won the award for most time under the cans throughout the room. Quite impressive and single-minded. I wish I had done more listening, as I always feel at the end of these things.
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Here is what I said about the PS-1s last September when I heard them for the second time in balanced mode:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltron
ayt999’s PS1s rock my world. I don’t *think* I am a basshead or anything, but man the bottom end out of those things is killer. I think they were the most “fun” cans I experienced yesterday, as that term is used around here. ayt’s home-brew balanced recable certainly might put this pair in another category altogether, and of course they were plugged into the simply incredible SDS-XLR Mikhail made for him. Nonetheless, PS1s are high on my list of cans to own.


As you can see, I feel the same way about them as you do. I still don't own them, but I purposely didn't listen to them at this meet because there is a pair on the FS forum that is wearing down my resistance... Another failure on my part was to listen to iamdone's Mapletree amp. I haven't heard one to my memory.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 4:48 PM Post #70 of 95
Quote:

Originally Posted by iamdone
I just wanted make it clear that I did love the Orpheus but somehow I was expecting a mind altering experience just looking at the whole setup and cables. Although you get lost in the music, at no point does it not sound like your listening to headphones. I think I was expecting a much bigger soundstage. The K1000 was the only headphone that did something completely different than all the other headphones I tried as far a soundstage.


I guess I should make it clear too that the HE-90 could easily be the best headphone in the world. Like you I expected to be blown out of my seat. But it definately did everything well across the board. Very fast, very neutral with no wholes at all. But it sounded like a very good headphone, and so did the O2 for that matter (although the bass couldn't compare with the HE-90).

My suprise was that given the gear it was plugged into, and listening the the K-1000 with it's extremely modest gear in comparison was VERY compareable, if not prefereable in a lot of ways.

The only real dissapointment was the R-10. It does a couple of things VERY good, maybe even the best of any headpone (airy highs, romantic midrange), but compromised with soundstage and bass in an ugly way (for my tastes). If it were an $800 headphone, I'd own it just for what it does well. But at it's price
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I wouldn't put it up against the K-1000, HE-90, O2, or even the 404.

K - I'll shut up now
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Oct 17, 2006 at 5:43 PM Post #71 of 95
Yup, Mike's PS-1 was one of the highlights of the meet for me. I expected it to be too bassy for my tastes, since I really love an airy presentation, but it was just very fun to listen to, very full-bodied but not excessively so. For something that hits hard, it is very fast and nimble and has tons of PRAT to spare. I've also thought that you needed a really high-end amp to control the bass, but Mike's Mapletree amp drove them really well, and that combo is something I can easily envision myself having someday. I really wish the prices on the PS-1s would come down so I can get a pair.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 6:07 PM Post #72 of 95
I would loved to have read comments about EMM Labs + humanflyz setup. Just to see how well the K1000 scales with the source. Something tells me it would have rocked.

I think the EMM Labs is my dream source, beautiful preamp in the DCC2 as well. If I haven't moved onto a speaker system in a couple of years that will be the upgrade for me.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 6:08 PM Post #73 of 95
@J-Pak:

I have no doubt about it, the K1000s are revealing enough to really show what a top-tier source can do. But too many people were listening to the Orpheus, so I didn't want to bother Neil.
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 6:12 PM Post #74 of 95
Quote:

Originally Posted by iamdone
I just wanted make it clear that I did love the Orpheus but somehow I was expecting a mind altering experience just looking at the whole setup and cables. Although you get lost in the music, at no point does it not sound like your listening to headphones. I think I was expecting a much bigger soundstage. The K1000 was the only headphone that did something completely different than all the other headphones I tried as far a soundstage.


Quote:

Originally Posted by robm321
I guess I should make it clear too that the HE-90 could easily be the best headphone in the world. Like you I expected to be blown out of my seat. But it definately did everything well across the board. Very fast, very neutral with no wholes at all. But it sounded like a very good headphone, and so did the O2 for that matter (although the bass couldn't compare with the HE-90).

My suprise was that given the gear it was plugged into, and listening the the K-1000 with it's extremely modest gear in comparison was VERY compareable, if not prefereable in a lot of ways.

The only real dissapointment was the R-10. It does a couple of things VERY good, maybe even the best of any headpone (airy highs, romantic midrange), but compromised with soundstage and bass in an ugly way (for my tastes). If it were an $800 headphone, I'd own it just for what it does well. But at it's price
eek.gif
I wouldn't put it up against the K-1000, HE-90, O2, or even the 404.

K - I'll shut up now
redface.gif



Like I mentioned earlier as well, I have never heard the K1K as good as I heard it out of the Pass Labs at the meet. However, a few things from personal experience are:

1) the HE90 takes a while to really get the full experience. In meet conditions, the subtlety of what it does generally gets glossed over and most people tend to look for the things that stick out. Also, the HE90 always battles expectations. This IS a headphone, it is NOT trying to sound like a speaker. I personally do not want it to sound like a speaker. That's what speakers are for.

2) I owned the K1000 for some time, and I noticed 1 thing interesting and counterintuitive (for me). While this is probably the most open and hence, speakerlike headphone, I found that while I thought it would be the most susceptible to room noise, it actually wasn't. Obviously a quiet room for any headphones would be ideal, but since the K1K's give a speaker like presentation, it doesn't seem to rely on dead quiet to deliver its sonic punch and subtlety.

Whereas, to me, the HE90 is a very delicate phone in terms of getting the complete jist of the phone. Something, to me, that is impossible to do in meet conditions. I think I've owned almost every major top tier headphone (barring the Original Omega) and PS-1, and I have to say, to me, the HE90 does what I need. The K1000 though, is very very nice, and its price differential w/the HE90's make it very attractive (not to mention far greater availability). But I think, for me, what it comes down to is that, over time I just really really enjoy the HE90 signature.

Neil

PS: Again, if anyone notices they have Dhammapada by John Mayer (the composer), please PM me. I am missing this CD. =)
 
Oct 17, 2006 at 6:20 PM Post #75 of 95
Quote:

Originally Posted by J-PAK
I would loved to have read comments about EMM Labs + humanflyz setup. Just to see how well the K1000 scales with the source. Something tells me it would have rocked.

I think the EMM Labs is my dream source, beautiful preamp in the DCC2 as well. If I haven't moved onto a speaker system in a couple of years that will be the upgrade for me.



Quote:

Originally Posted by humanflyz
@J-Pak:

I have no doubt about it, the K1000s are revealing enough to really show what a top-tier source can do. But too many people were listening to the Orpheus, so I didn't want to bother Neil.



J-PAK-
The EMM Labs Combo sounds AMAZING out of speakers. It scales far better with my speaker rig than even with headphones! The PRE is also spectacular and it really does make an excellent top tier system.

humanflyz-
You really should have bothered me =) That's what meets are for! Lol. I mean, later on in the evening we were driving up to four sources out of that EMM. Really it would not have been an interruption to connect that rig. It is with this that I make an offer to you: If you bring your Rig to my apartment in San Francisco (either the new F1 or the Aleph), we can have a real listening session =) Bring your friends too.

Neil
 

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