[sunia32]

Hi Guys,
 
I'm looking to upgrade from HD598 which I currently use on a regular basis. I love the open-back design and the wide soundstage and would like to have similar or greater soundstage on my upgrade.
 
As for my music preferences, I used to listen to a lot of acoustic pieces but lately I've been listening to a lot of vocal / chill EDM. Generally, EDMs are mastered really well and the bass sounds clear and fantastic even on my HD598.
 
For my upgrade, I have always had the HD700 in the back of my mind. I have read both positive and negative reviews about this HP, and the negative reviews about the high treble points really stick out. I cannot go for the HD800 as that would also mean having to invest in a fairly expensive amplifier which I cannot afford.
 
I've heard people say that a Stax system will sound relatively closer to an expensive HP like the HD800 while also being budget friendly. After searching online, Stax SRS-3100 is available for delivery in my area and costs just a bit less than the HD800 - bonus being that I don't have to buy an amplifier separately. My primary question would be, is it worth the cost?
 
Not sure which one should I go for, the Sennheiser (which I'm familiar with) or the lesser known Stax headphones?

 

[KR...]

the HD700 was a failed product, which is why it is now selling at a 3rd of the cost. I would avoid them, they have serious QC issues, you will just end up getting something else within a year if you make that mistake.

 

[sunia32]

So does that mean that HD700 should be out of the picture? That only leaves me with the SRS-3100 - any thoughts on this along with any other similarly priced headphone?
 
Like I said I enjoy the open back nature of my headphone with the nice soundstage.

 

[KR...]

I haven't heard the current Stax SRS-3100, but I have heard the original version, so take this for what it is worth, the amp that comes with it is not very good. The headphones are good with a high quality amp but not as good as the two models above it, the bass is lacking. Stax are all about being neutral, very fast and detailed, but the soundstage is pretty small until you get to the flagship models.They do not sound anything like any Sennheiser headphones that I ever heard.

 

[Malfunkt]

  Hi Guys,
 
I'm looking to upgrade from HD598 which I currently use on a regular basis. I love the open-back design and the wide soundstage and would like to have similar or greater soundstage on my upgrade.
 
...
 
For my upgrade, I have always had the HD700 in the back of my mind. I have read both positive and negative reviews about this HP, and the negative reviews about the high treble points really stick out. I cannot go for the HD800 as that would also mean having to invest in a fairly expensive amplifier which I cannot afford.

I always had the 700 in the back of my mind as well. Sennheiser is still selling them and they have their fans and detractors.

They are among my favourite headphones. They are incredibly comfortable and work very well for the genres I listen to classical, jazz, ambient, psychedelic. My main reference is classical music, but also high-quality binaural environment recordings. So far, the HD700 of all the headphones I've had, the 700s have been the best at being able to make me feel like I'm immersed in an actual environment when listening to binaural recordings. Listening to something like this https://youtu.be/2Gpl99s02Aw?t=15m39s you get a true sense of space. It's more than just 'soundstage', the HD700 presents a sound that is almost holographic. Now, it could be different for other people , with individual HRTF.  
 
The HD700 has a particular frequency curve and phase response that creates a spatial image that is quite cohesive. Initially, some of the peaks of its overall frequency curve took a bit to adjust to. There were times I just didn't want to listen to them. Now I prefer listening to them over my other sets, not just for sound, but also because of superior ergonomics.

If you can get them at a good price they are worth it IMO. You can always sell them if you don't like. It's worth trying out. You may also like the HD600/650, while not necessarily wider in soundstage, it overall has more depth, and detail. 
 
Here is are some of my comparison impressions from when I first got them. I would say I have an easier time listening to them as a whole. They are also superb for gaming and movies. http://www.head-fi.org/t/832713/headphone-comparison-sennheiser-hd700-denon-ah-d2000-sony-mdr-7520-audeze-lcd-2-rev-1-and-a-pair-of-logitech-ue6000s
 
What kind of music are you primarily interested in?

 

[buke9]

I also like my HD-700's and not sure about QC problems I haven't heard anyone complain about that on the 700 thread. I tend to like them on a warmer amp like a Cavalli Liquid Carbon or a Bottlehead Crack. A cheaper introduction into Electrostat's is the Koss ESP-950 they run anywhere from $530 to $650 depending on what I don't know they just fluctuate in price on Amazon. Super comfortable as are the 700's to be fair sound a bit better with a amp upgrade but what doesn't really; )

 

[Petyot]

Before speaking about the Stax, let me tell you what I have at home so you can see to what I'll compare them :
 
Sennheiser HD800 + Little Dot MKVI+
Fostex TH900 + Jotunheim (sold a few days ago but I am looking for a replacement)
Stax SR-207 + SRM252s
 
The Stax system is a wonderful system! Hard to beat at that price. The best Q/P ratio in my opinion of all my systems, by far! 
 
The SRM-252s is a very capable amp! Don't listen to those saying it is a bad amp. This is simply not true! I had a listening session with the SRM-252s and the SRM-006ts a few days ago (wanted to try the L700). Here are my impression : 
 

  Ok, I am back from the Stax dealer. I had my listening session with the L700 for two hours in very good quiet conditions (a speakers listening room with the door close). 
 
The source was a Moonaudio CD player NEO 260D with DAC. Cables were apparently high end too...
I tried the L700 and the 207 on the SRM-252s and then changed for the SRM-006ts (that was the only other Stax amp available).
 
First conclusion : the L700 are much more confortable than the SR-207. Pads are buttery soft and the new adjustment system is more practical to keep the good adjustment. With the synthetic 207's pads I start to sweat after a certain uninterrupted time of listening. That didn't happen with the L700. Weight feeling is about the same (I din't check the weight of each unit...). No farts on the L700. I wear glasses and the seal was better with the L700 (remember, buttery soft pads...)
 
Second conclusion : the SRM-252s is more than capable of driving both headphones! Volume was at 10/11 am for both headphones and the music was loud enough for me. At 12, it started to be too loud for my pleasure, with the SR-207 or the SR-L700. 
 
Third conclusion : I didn't hear (emphasis on "I") any differences between the SRM-252s and the SRM-006ts, both with the 207 or the L700. I don't pretend that there are no differences, I am just saying that I didn't hear any!
 
Fourth conclusion : the L700 are (for me) better than the SR-207. Everything was better in my opinion... Bass, sub-bass, imaging, soundstage, etc... How much better? I would say by 15/20% (if that makes any sense to estimate the differences by a %). Which mean, nothing to rationnaly (BUT, is there anything rationale in that hobby??) justify 3x the price difference! 
 
I think that the SR-207 are a real bargain at their price! With the SRM-252s you have a killer system. I also think that the L700 are also a bargain BUT you have to compare them to the "high end" models (SR-007/SR-009). In that league, they have the best Q/P ratio. 
 
I had the SR-007MK1 with the SRM-717 for more than 10 years (my only system for a long time) so I think I can give my appreciation (not to compare, since I didn't had the two headphones at the same time) between the L700 and the SR-007. I think that the differences between the SR-007 and L700 are lower that 10%.

 

[ZGojira]

The SRS-3100 does sound pretty close to the HD800. Both have strong treble performance.
If you find that you prefer the electrostatic sound, you might never be able to use dynamics or planers again.

The good side is that the upgrade path is simple, but can get expensive quickly.
 
What amp and dac do you use at the moment? The HD700 still sounds better with a good amp.
 
From my experience, the HD598 is very warm whereas both HD700 and sr-3100 are both on the brighter side.
How sensitive are you to treble?
 
Full disclosure: I was a huge HD800 fan until I heard my first pair of stax, now all my main cans are stax

 

[KR...]

  Before speaking about the Stax, let me tell you what I have at home so you can see to what I'll compare them :
 
Sennheiser HD800 + Little Dot MKVI+
Fostex TH900 + Jotunheim (sold a few days ago but I am looking for a replacement)
Stax SR-207 + SRM252s
 
The Stax system is a wonderful system! Hard to beat at that price. The best Q/P ratio in my opinion of all my systems, by far! 
 
The SRM-252s is a very capable amp! Don't listen to those saying it is a bad amp. This is simply not true! 
 

 
It pretty bad compared to the high end "Stax" amps, you don't get to really hear what those Stax phones really sound like until you give them a LOT of power. I wish you could hear what these phones can really do so you would understand. Even the top of the line Stax amps are kinda not that great to be honest. But if you are not going to listen to a high end system then I guess it doesn't matter anyway. Once you listen to a Stax with the Blue Hawaii amp (design by someone that used to post here, not sure if he still does) and above, with a source good enough to allow you to hear the differences easily, it is really hard to ever want to listen to the underpowered Stax amps again.
 
I also understand that not everyone cares about such things, so yes any Stax amp will work and allow you to listen to the phone sat high volumes. If that is the only thing people care about, then yeah I guess it anything will do and forget what I said before, LOL.

 

[Petyot]

 
I also understand that not everyone cares about such things, so yes any Stax amp will work and allow you to listen to the phones at high volumes. If that is the only thing people care about, then yeah I guess it anything will do and forget what I said before, LOL.
 

 
That is so condescending!!
 
To the OP : don't believe such kind of bullsh... You will have a lot of fun with the SR-3100 if you decide to go that route (specifically if you are, like me, one of those vulgar, uncultivated, mentally deficient audiophile, who just care about listening at high volume...

). 

 

[KR...]

 I am sorry if you took it the wrong way, I did not mean it that way at all. I am not talking about people, I am talking about gear. I am not passing judgement on anyone, just giving my 2 cents on different gear just like everyone else. 
 
Listen to whatever you want, i really don't care. As long as you like it, that is good enough for you.
 
I am just offering my opinion if case sound quality is the most important thing, but that is not on the top of the list for everyone, and that is ok! Not everyone cares about hi-fi anymore. Back when this site started, the whole goal of this hobby was to get the best sound possible no matter what. Listening to portables and using computers and laptops as sources was crazy talk. No one who waste their time with that stuff, but those days are over or most people couldn't care less anymore. It is what it is. Last time I was a regular here was almost ten years ago  Things have changed a lot!
 
Looking around this site, I starting to understand that most people here just don't care about that stuff anymore, which is fine I suppose. But I also now understand that most people use headphones for gaming, portables and their computers and not hi-fi. Which is fine, for those things yes, Stax SRS-3100 System is more than good enough for sure.
 
I was not trying to offend anymore.

 

[sunia32]

Guys,
 
I am in search of a good upgrade; and after reading some of your conflicted opinions on both HD700 and Stax SRS3100 I'm not so sure if I should go for either one.
 
@ZGojira: After a lot of thought that your post provoked, I've concluded that I do like the warmth of my HD598 and suddenly going for something bright like HD700 or SRS-3100 might not suite my taste. Any recommendations on warm open-back headphones around 800 USD that does not need a super expensive amplifier?
 
Maybe I should go for the critically acclaimed HD650 with a good enough amp?
 
Sincerely,
Sun

 

[Malfunkt]

  Guys,
 
I am in search of a good upgrade; and after reading some of your conflicted opinions on both HD700 and Stax SRS3100 I'm not so sure if I should go for either one.
 
@ZGojira: After a lot of thought that your post provoked, I've concluded that I do like the warmth of my HD598 and suddenly going for something bright like HD700 or SRS-3100 might not suite my taste. Any recommendations on warm open-back headphones around 800 USD that does not need a super expensive amplifier?
 
Maybe I should go for the critically acclaimed HD650 with a good enough amp?
 
Sincerely,
Sun

You can go with a HD650, and you'll likely be very happy with a relatively inexpensive solid-state amp. The 650 is definitely a good step up from the HD598. It is just more refined and has better technical qualities. I also found the bass more linear and impactful. Highs are more natural and effortless. You could spend much less than $800USD for such a setup.  You would also have a headphone that is a very good reference for many hear.

Other mentions would be Hifiman HE400i, LCD2 (currently enjoying at the moment), though both not as comfortable as the Sennheisers. And then you may want to check out the Focal Elear, a bit above your budget, and though I haven't heard it, it sounds like Focal has designed an easy-to-get along with dynamic headphone,with in an incredible build.

Still, a lot of this hobby is taking the time to check out different signatures. BTW - good price http://www.head-fi.org/t/844792/sennheiser-hd700 (it punches above its weight and price)

 

[buke9]

Guys,

I am in search of a good upgrade; and after reading some of your conflicted opinions on both HD700 and Stax SRS3100 I'm not so sure if I should go for either one.

@ZGojira: After a lot of thought that your post provoked, I've concluded that I do like the warmth of my HD598 and suddenly going for something bright like HD700 or SRS-3100 might not suite my taste. Any recommendations on warm open-back headphones around 800 USD that does not need a super expensive amplifier?

Maybe I should go for the critically acclaimed HD650 with a good enough amp?

Sincerely,
Sun

There are deficiencies with most headphones. There is no perfect one ( The HE-1 comes close but who has $50000 laying around) . You have to take reviews and impressions for what they are one persons opinion. I can also give a few things about the HD-650's that are not good and that would be my opinion. I have a pair of HD-6xx's same as the 650's I like them but not for everything. From a Bottlehead Crack they are stunning for some music and just ok for other types. The 650 is a pretty good all a rounder though if you just want one headphone.

 

[ZGojira]

  Guys,
 
I am in search of a good upgrade; and after reading some of your conflicted opinions on both HD700 and Stax SRS3100 I'm not so sure if I should go for either one.
 
@ZGojira: After a lot of thought that your post provoked, I've concluded that I do like the warmth of my HD598 and suddenly going for something bright like HD700 or SRS-3100 might not suite my taste. Any recommendations on warm open-back headphones around 800 USD that does not need a super expensive amplifier?
 
Maybe I should go for the critically acclaimed HD650 with a good enough amp?
 
Sincerely,
Sun

 
Unfortunately, I am a fan of brighter headphones and warm headphones just don't sound good to me 

 
So it's not the best idea for me to give recommendations on warm cans

 
At this stage, if possible, I would say try as many different cans as possible... at 800USD preference plays a big part....