[SteveM324]

I didn't mean that as a personal attack. I'm sorry if you took it that way.
I break-in all my headphones in a controlled process where I put my CD player on repeat for about 2 weeks and I use a CD with a lot of dynamic music. I usually listen to headphones everyday during this period and I listen for any changes. I've purchased and broken-in 4 headphones in the last month, SA5000, AKG K1000, AKG K501 and the Sony D66. The K501 changed the least amount during break-in while the D66's harsh highs didn't smooth out until after the first week of 24/7 break-in. My point is that until you go through a controlled break-in process, you may not notice the changes taking place.
Quote:

Originally Posted by spike33 oh ok buddy anyways, my point was I've been satisfied with the sound ever since the 100 hour mark so I don't care to keep track of changes again...

 

[Jasper994]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron_Dreamer I think the SA5000 is no doubt BETTER than the HD650, in that it has more detail. It is different in that it offers a more neutral accurate sound than the HD650/Zu, which I prefer, so it was better for me on both counts, and the HD650's have found a new home. Pick the HD650 well IMO, only if you want a darker, bassier, slower, more colored sound. Pick the SA5K if you want a more detailed, neutral, and dynamic sound. I prefer the SA5K on all genres, but others (due to taste) might not (i.e. they find it too revealing/neutral, etc.)

While I definately agree with regard to detail, I'm not so sure I agree when it comes to neutrality. If you recall, I found that Diana Krall's voice sounded significantly different than I'd ever heard it sound before. This is not to say one is more or less neutral, but simply to state that I question the SA5000's neutrality since it is the only headphone or speaker I've heard give that presentation of her voice before. I will agree that by comparison the HD650's sounded veiled (with Zu cable).

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasper994 While I definately agree with regard to detail, I'm not so sure I agree when it comes to neutrality. If you recall, I found that Diana Krall's voice sounded significantly different than I'd ever heard it sound before. This is not to say one is more or less neutral, but simply to state that I question the SA5000's neutrality since it is the only headphone or speaker I've heard give that presentation of her voice before. I will agree that by comparison the HD650's sounded veiled (with Zu cable).

Funny, somehow your post made me realize what people mean by "veiled." For some reason I always assumed 'veiled' meant the overall sound was muted or overlaid by coloration (like a veil), but now I realize it refers only to upper midrange and/or treble -- i.e. a tonal coloration in a limited part of the frequency spectrum. I guess the visual image of a veil was confusing me, since veils cover *everything*.

 

[Jasper994]

glad to be of service...

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joey_V Ill take his Von S. speakers that ssportsclay has over them high end headphones any day. The air and soundstage good high end speakers eminate are just levels above what a headphone can do, IMO.

I'm used to the performance of high-end bookshelves, having had some 2500$ Acoustic Energy AE1 MkII, as well as some Harbeth HL-P3/es and some Epos ... And I'm entirely confident in saying that the only one that could somehow rival the HD650 was the AE1 (which incidentally was surprisingly comparable to it also for sound signature) ... yes, similar, but the HD650 has CLEARLY the superior resolution, and extension on both sides.

Really, this couldn't be mistaken.
ssportclay's speakers look indeed awesome, but unless they're imported from some alien world

, they won't be better at clarity/accuracy/detail than the AE's and all the more reason, than the HD650 ...

It's a matter of HOW certain speakers present detail ... it's like saying that Grados are clearly more detailed than a "laidback" phone like the HD650 ...

 

[Joey_V]

With all due respect Andrea, just because you feel that your $2500 speakers were equal to (or less) to the 650 in resolution does not discount the fact that perhaps his VR is a match for the 650.

If you go by the fact that yours are more expensive than his hence his VR cant possibly match the 650s, then it is just like saying that the cost = performance.... which we know is not exactly true.

I mean, how many people here would agree that the 650 is THE BEST CAN at the 500$ pricepoint... just because it costs $500, doesnt mean that a can that costs $300 cant be more detailed and resolute than the 650.

MAYBE his VR do best the 650, maybe they dont. Dont you think that it is unfair to critique his speaker without EVEN hearing it. Would you like to tell me exactly how the Qualia sounds? Or how the Shure E4c sound? Even though you havent heard them (I presume).

 

[Andrea]

Yep, naturally. But I didn't really mean to make it all a matter of $$$$. I know how great a "monitor" the AE1 is (for me, 'was') (and note, it featured a small-sized metal woofer made of 3 layers of different metals, and a magnesium dome tweeter, with the 'box' internally dampened by some 'cement' compound, silver-teflon internal cabling, and a couple other nice goodies,

weighing nearly 9 Kg despite its diminutive size) ... it's reasonable to think that it may have a different presentation of the sound (British gentleman -like

), perhaps less vivid, but hardly less resolving. Besides, the only speakers I happened to hear that really may match the HD650's resolution were the B&W Nautilus 800's.

I'm just struggling to keep a realist view. It's renown how (current) headphones have like "1 more gear than speakers"

for such aspects of the sound, for inherent technical/physical reasons.



And again, indeed those VR-1 speakers seem awesome and unbelievably well equipped for 950$ (or something) speakers.

 

[ssportclay]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea I'm used to the performance of high-end bookshelves, having had some 2500$ Acoustic Energy AE1 MkII, as well as some Harbeth HL-P3/es and some Epos ... And I'm entirely confident in saying that the only one that could somehow rival the HD650 was the AE1 (which incidentally was surprisingly comparable to it also for sound signature) ... yes, similar, but the HD650 has CLEARLY the superior resolution, and extension on both sides. Really, this couldn't be mistaken. ssportclay's speakers look indeed awesome, but unless they're imported from some alien world , they won't be better at clarity/accuracy/detail than the AE's and all the more reason, than the HD650 ... It's a matter of HOW certain speakers present detail ... it's like saying that Grados are clearly more detailed than a "laidback" phone like the HD650 ...

Over here in Ohio,we refer to that alien world as New York.

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssportclay Over here in Ohio,we refer to that alien world as New York.

Hehe, after my speculative heating some cooling was really needed.

 

[boodi]

double

 

[boodi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joey_V Ill take his Von S. speakers that ssportsclay has over them high end headphones any day. The air and soundstage good high end speakers eminate are just levels above what a headphone can do, IMO.

this year I've done myself a gift steppping on a good 5.1 system ..

I have to say I'm starting to use the full size cans less and less while I reach for canalpohones more - and only for portable .

When I'm home I use my 5.1 system and I don't feel too much the need of getting on heaphones as I yet wear canals on the go .

While if i get on headphones I see where was the " research for the sound " freak mood that led me into headphoning escalation , now I just enjoy much more the music on air , and wouldn't likely exchange my full system for an heaphone top system.

 

[Jahn]

Ah, the luxury of the open air! I wish I had the space and the silence! But I don't, so hello headphones!

 

[akwok]

I recieved my SA5000s.

I do not have a equal-calibur headphone to compare this against, but I did come from a MDR-V700, which usually has -too much bass- as said by many members. The SA5000s has equal amount of bass as MDR-V700 when listening to bass heavy tracks like Outkast. The bass is not muddy, it is very clear and -punchy-.

Detail wise, it is AMAZING. I was relistening to Black Sabbath's Iron Man today and I could hear the smacks of Ozzy's lips while he sang. You could hear the feedback from the drums in Van Halen's tracks, and the each chord of the guitar is clearly distinguished in each of Rush's songs. The headphones can keep up with Malmsteen without it being muddy and blurred. Synthesizer heavy tracks such as those by Michael Jackson are very detailed and the bass is -perfect-. Everything seems a lot more vibrant, and contrary to what other people say about the brightness of these cans, they sound VERY natural to me.

Plus, the SA5000 is -very- comfortable, after a while you forget that you're even wearing them.

HOWEVER, I have found that I need to re-encode all my 192kps tracks into lossless, as these headphones benefit SIGNIFICANTLY from them!

Great buy.

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea Iron Dreamer, have you seen GerG's response measurements (and all further comments) of the SA5000, versus the HD650 ? Do you feel so confident in calling it 'neutral' and 'accurate' ? Btw, the HD650 is nowhere close to sounding like "thick" to my ears... perhaps you really favour the SA5000's thinness -- which from your comments I'm growing convinced it sounds (thin)...

Please forget about graphs while you are comparing two headphones, curves will give you an idea of the overall spectrum but not of the particualr sound diferences between two headphones. I have heard both and yes IMO the SA5000 is far superior in accuracy to the HD650, that will sound completelly dull and compressed in comparison to the huge extension, and details of the SA5000. Yes it could be considered bright (I do consider it bright) but the details, separation of instruments, clarity and cleanness of the sound will smash anyday the sound you will get ouf of a good setup with the HD650...I have heard it a few times, in very good setups, and honestly IMO nothing to write home about....

I prefer other heapdhones to the SA5000 which I sold after some time of used, but the HD650 WILL NEVER BE one of them....

OTOH, (JAZZ) yes the SA5000 needs a lot of burn in, let it burn in and you will notice the changes, maybe after at least 200-300 hours...But don't expect a miracle OK? The bass should be the same in amount....the highs will improve though, to a less harsh and more natural ones...

I agreee with the Tom and Purk and rest of the members I found no excitement while listening the SA5000, my major deception after the little lacking bass, and the reason I sold them....IMO I have found no substitute for my beloved CD3000 yet on this price range...

 

[Yada]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssportclay I do not understand this idea of headphones having too much detail.The SA5000s do not present enough detail because my Von Schweikert VR-1 speakers present far more detail than these headphones or any other headphones that I am aware of.Headphone technology has some catching up to do.

I bet if you put both your Von Schweikerts a few millimeters from your ears you might get a better idea of "too much detail."