[kh6idf]

It's been a few weeks since I last visited this thread, glad to see the discussion continuing. That's some high praise from Bowmoreman for a $700 (in today's worthless dollars) preamp!

 

[Bowmoreman]

It's been a few weeks since I last visited this thread, glad to see the discussion continuing. That's some high praise from Bowmoreman for a $700 (in today's worthless dollars) preamp!

I *should* be coming up soon in the queue for service for my DR6; I’ve decided that unless it is an insane amount of $$, I’m going to get it recapped (presuming that is the issue, but it sure seems that way), and then bring it back to RACE directly head-to-head with the Kara/Skoll. My own “thunderdome” as it were. Then I’ll give it a SERIOUS review, etc.

But, for now, as I said, I’m not missing anything (that I can remember/care about) on my best recordings. For those that haven’t listened to it, the Mercury Resphigi Birds/Fountains of Rome/Pines of Rome CD is *epically* well recorded. The string section is SO three dimensional it is scary, and the tonality, etc…. Ymmmm. The only complaints (versus the LP) is the very top octave is a bit “digititus” to my hearing (likely the DAC in the Cambridge Azur 751BD being delta-sigma - I hear similar from my Modi

I can only WONDER what it’d sound like with a DAC upgrade. Alas, fund prioritization will delay THAT a bit (will probably start with a Bifrost/64 it holds value if i ultimately were to decide to move back, or on towards Yggy.

And yeah, considering Kara is $700 in 2024 Joe-Biden inflation times, and the Classe’ was $3400 (?) in 1990 dollars…. inflation calculator says that would be $8310 in today’s “money”. Working in reverse, that would have meant today’s $700 product was around $260 in 1990. There was NO preamp in 1990 anywhere near $260 that was any good, frankly.

@Jason Stoddard Question: as part of development or after, did you do listening A/B’s against older or newer (so-called) “high end” preamps? What preamps of past and current impress you?

Because you NAILED it with Kara (and Skoll), and I refuse to believe it was luck. Might make a great read to learn about how you “voice” your designs (what baselines listening-wise, etc.)

(Not asking you to say about “betterer/worserer” comparisons of other products, just HOW your process to asymptote the design to as much musicality as you obviously achieved.

 

[33na3rd]

And yeah, considering Kara is $700 in 2024 Joe-Biden inflation times,

I was enjoying your post until until you managed to drag politics into it.

 

[Bowmoreman]

I was enjoying your post until until you managed to drag politics into it.

Sorry to offend sensibilities.

 

[33na3rd]

Sorry to offend sensibilities.

I don't know that I was offended. But politics permeates much of modern life.

I like to visit my favorite music/gear sites to escape. They're my refuge from the real world.

For what it's worth, I don't even enjoy my own politics...

 

[kh6idf]

Checking in again, this thread seems to have died down. Anyway thought I would mention about the two speaker cables I had described earlier. I have a new amplifier (Hypex NilaiDIY500 stereo amp), and with that amp I am using the Blue Jeans Cable 10 Ga Belden with locking bananas. With the Hypex amp, the BJC cables sound great. Plenty of Bass and dynamics, very transparent, beautiful midrange, etc. I theorize that the Hypex amp has a much larger damping factor and maybe this makes it less sensitive to variation in speaker cables? Just a guess...

The Schiit Kara preamp and the Hypex amp are a very good combination. I am using the 1X buffered output on the Kara and the mid gain (21.8 dB) setting on the Hypex. Speakers are 91.5 dB efficient.

 

[FellowTraveller]

I *should* be coming up soon in the queue for service for my DR6; I’ve decided that unless it is an insane amount of $$, I’m going to get it recapped (presuming that is the issue, but it sure seems that way), and then bring it back to RACE directly head-to-head with the Kara/Skoll. My own “thunderdome” as it were. Then I’ll give it a SERIOUS review, etc.

But, for now, as I said, I’m not missing anything (that I can remember/care about) on my best recordings. For those that haven’t listened to it, the Mercury Resphigi Birds/Fountains of Rome/Pines of Rome CD is *epically* well recorded. The string section is SO three dimensional it is scary, and the tonality, etc…. Ymmmm. The only complaints (versus the LP) is the very top octave is a bit “digititus” to my hearing (likely the DAC in the Cambridge Azur 751BD being delta-sigma - I hear similar from my Modi

I can only WONDER what it’d sound like with a DAC upgrade. Alas, fund prioritization will delay THAT a bit (will probably start with a Bifrost/64 it holds value if i ultimately were to decide to move back, or on towards Yggy.

And yeah, considering Kara is $700 in 2024 Joe-Biden inflation times, and the Classe’ was $3400 (?) in 1990 dollars…. inflation calculator says that would be $8310 in today’s “money”. Working in reverse, that would have meant today’s $700 product was around $260 in 1990. There was NO preamp in 1990 anywhere near $260 that was any good, frankly.

@Jason Stoddard Question: as part of development or after, did you do listening A/B’s against older or newer (so-called) “high end” preamps? What preamps of past and current impress you?

Because you NAILED it with Kara (and Skoll), and I refuse to believe it was luck. Might make a great read to learn about how you “voice” your designs (what baselines listening-wise, etc.)

(Not asking you to say about “betterer/worserer” comparisons of other products, just HOW your process to asymptote the design to as much musicality as you obviously achieved.

Thanks for your very interesting reflections on the Kara and other topics. I'm interested in the CD with the Respighi recording on Mercury that you mentioned. Do you mind sharing the cover or saying the orchestra and/or year so I can find the exact recording you're talking about?

 

[adias]

After an afternoon and evening session with Kara using 4x mode, I have to say that @leafy7382 's impression is spot on.

Listening to classical, I was impressed by the added weight and clarity that 4x mode brought to tympani, double bass, and cellos. This wasn't added bass per se, but more presence if you will, better definition.

On rock fare, there seemed to be greater dynamics.

At first, I thought that 1x mode seemed a bit smoother, but after some back and forth between 1x and 4x while trying to volume match, I'm not so sure.

I thought 4x sounded a bit grainy with Freya S. I have no such complaints with Kara's 4x mode.

I detected no loss of detail/resolution with Kara's 4x mode. I appreciated the perceived greater dynamics.

The only downside that I've encountered so far, is that 4x shows that one of my phono units has a bit of self noise that can be heard if an LP isn't playing. This particular phono unit has a little more gain than average, so this isn't that unusual.

I'm going to continue with 4x for awhile, maybe a very long while...

Thanks to @adias & @leafy7382 for prodding me to give 4x another try.

Still using 4x? I went back to 4x after a long while with 1x. I suspect my perception varies with time.

 

[Bowmoreman]

Thanks for your very interesting reflections on the Kara and other topics. I'm interested in the CD with the Respighi recording on Mercury that you mentioned. Do you mind sharing the cover or saying the orchestra and/or year so I can find the exact recording you're talking about?

Sure thing!

It is the Dorati conducts Minneapolis (and London) Symphony’s. Recorded in 1957 (London) for The Birds and the Brazilian impressions, and then in 1960 for The Fountains of Rome and The Pines of Rome (Minneapolis). CD released in 1990: D108699 (432 07 02). Here’s pics, the sticker was on it because I got it used from a public library sale…

 

[Bowmoreman]

Small update: I continue to find 4x works best on my current setup. If/when I get a dedicated DAC (balanced) and new transport, that may change. But, for phono (using Skoll) I really find the 4x is pretty much required; I’m now settled on 70dB gain on Scoll, and even with 4X on Kara… silence (when it’s supposed to be silent).

More dynamics/range, no penalty in noise or dimensionality that I can discern

 

[33na3rd]

Still using 4x? I went back to 4x after a long while with 1x. I suspect my perception varies with time.

I'm still using 1x as my default. I have no qualms about switching into 4x, especially for those rare times of using headphones with Kara.

Speaking of headphones, I think that my 32 Ohm headphones sound best with Kara. Better tonal balance & dynamics. My Grado SR125's were something that I could only tolerate with tubed headamps, but they sound very nice with Kara. But you really shouldn't listen to me regarding headphones. I hate headphones. I'm sorry, but I really do.

 

[Bowmoreman]

I'm still using 1x as my default. I have no qualms about switching into 4x, especially for those rare times of using headphones with Kara.

Speaking of headphones, I think that my 32 Ohm headphones sound best with Kara. Better tonal balance & dynamics. My Grado SR125's were something that I could only tolerate with tubed headamps, but they sound very nice with Kara. But you really shouldn't listen to me regarding headphones. I hate headphones. I'm sorry, but I really do.

My Koss ESP950’s sound quite nice on the Kara (using it’s headphone out plugged into the Koss Energizer’s rca line inputs and it has no trouble driving). I’m getting a loaner pair of Senn’s arriving later this week, and it’ll be fun to race them using same connection. I’m not a huge headphone guy, but it will be “MOAR DATA” eh?

 

[33na3rd]

My Koss ESP950’s sound quite nice on the Kara (using it’s headphone out plugged into the Koss Energizer’s rca line inputs and it has no trouble driving). I’m getting a loaner pair of Senn’s arriving later this week, and it’ll be fun to race them using same connection. I’m not a huge headphone guy, but it will be “MOAR DATA” eh?

That's funny that you mentioned using Kara's headphone output into another headamp. I did the same thing earlier this week when I was trying to see which of my headphones sounded best with Kara. My Senn/Drop HD6xx sounded sleepy through Kara's headphone out, but adding Asgard 3 to the mix woke it up. The Grado's sound pretty darn good with Kara without any extra help. If you like headphones...

 

[Bowmoreman]

That “feature” was one of the final straws that had me pull the Kara trigger. I like that the headphone out is identical discrete circuit as that which drives LINE out… perfect for a guy like me that uses the HP’s as “backup” for when wifey don’t want to hear MY music (like when I play anything rock, or progressive rock… she’s FINE with Jazz and Classical…

My “redo” of my listening room is now only a bit more than a week away; it will optimize my seating/listening position to be very NEAR to all my gear, instead of it all being all the way across the room to the side of my speakers. When done, I’ll only need a 6 foot headphone cable, AND I’ll have direct (and close) line of sight to all the gear (pre, TT, Phono Pre, DVD/CD player, etc), and the amp will be in the basement below the speakers. No more cables across the floor - anywhere.

It’s been in mind since before the whole Kara/Skoll acquisition last autumn…

 

[adias]

I'm still using 1x as my default. I have no qualms about switching into 4x, especially for those rare times of using headphones with Kara.

Speaking of headphones, I think that my 32 Ohm headphones sound best with Kara. Better tonal balance & dynamics. My Grado SR125's were something that I could only tolerate with tubed headamps, but they sound very nice with Kara. But you really shouldn't listen to me regarding headphones. I hate headphones. I'm sorry, but I really do.

Two flavors at the click of a switch. My preferences change and not on a trend line; they change back and forth. What causes that? I suspect exposure to competing sounds - attending a concert hall performance, being away from the system for a while and listening to other systems, and so on.

Re. headphones… I’m not a headphone listener either, but that is changing. My headphones are a pristine (like new) Joseph Grado HP 1000/HP2 with JG’s ultra wide bandwidth cable (whatever that means). I have listened to them sparsley over the years; they play fine through Kara but I do not listen to them there. Recently I got the Last Call Magni+ on a whim. The Magni+ headphone amp is connected to the bottom-of-the-barrel Schiit DAC Modi+. I’ll tell you - the HP2 sounds superb through that tiny system located on my office desk. Smooth, detailed, wide ranging - I will not be looking for more as far as headphone listening goes.