[bcowen]

The CBS/Hytron 5692 is a personal favorite and there may well have been one in this exercise. The Lyr 3 might have been a better way to go but they were hooking to a speaker amp. There are a bunch of us who use a Vali 2 with 6sn7 equivalents. Four Melz 1578's in a Freya are to die for but that can get a little costly.

Differences in tube sound are much more audible (to me) with headphones than with speakers. Now I can still get instant ear bleed putting some Philips ECG's in the big rig or quickly cure insomnia with some GE's, but for the good tubes the sound signatures are magnified through the 'phones.

 

[Balthazar B]

Mine is a lowly CBS Hytron 6SN7 GTA, but it sure sounds nice! Someday, once the kids grow up, I hope I can afford what will be left of the more rarified NOS tubes out there -- if only out of curiosity as to how they sound!

Wonder if there's enough of a tube market developing that superior new tubes will become available in at least the major form factors to address demand. Perhaps new rapid fabrication technologies will facilitate that. I thought vinyl was dead a decade or two ago; lo and behold, it wasn't.

 

[rkw]

After spending a couple of hours playing with USB ports, the dog's face says it all, really.

My dog agrees but gave up trying to climb on the desk.

 

[Oveja Negra]

You don't fool me, that's a skinny tiger.

 

[bcowen]

You don't fool me, that's a skinny tiger.

ROFL! I was thinking it was sufficient justification to spring for a king sized bed.

 

[johnjen]

@johnjen

I will withhold any comments till I check one of these devices out but it sounds like you are noticing a remarkable difference in ALL cables. Therefore with one of those machines in hand, and following careful protocols I could cook a certain amount of cables of most any type and you could tell me blindly which cables were cooked because they sound remarkably better? Lets say a group of 8-10 cables and I would leave some uncooked, and cook the remainder. Obviously then you would be able to say, cables 2, 6, and 9 out of the 10 sound remarkably better. In the sake of fairness I would want you to select a type of cable that is the easiest for you to tell a difference with, I have some short runs of 16 awg speaker wire I could easily use for such an experiment if that is a good choice for you. Heck I could even send you hand built USB cables, interconnects, AES/EBU cables whatever, in groups of five just to make sure I was not sending you a sampling that was more difficult than what you are using yourself. You might have trouble with one type of cable but be spot on with all the rest.

Bill had mentioned headphone cables but I believe if those are hand braided, it is so hard to get every pair braided with the exact same force as I might with standard twisted pair, or bonded twisted pair (even more accurate.)

That sounds like a fun experiment to me and I know @bcowen to be a most honorable man, I could send him the info before you announce your results in order to be totally fair. I prefer shipping such things inside the US and I would certainly cover all expenses in such an experiment. The cables would be brand new and newly cooked and I know Bill keeps all equipment in remarkable condition so I am sure his cooker is fine. I do not know you and it is not my intent to embarrass you of course, I would just like to set something up more out of curiosity, I have spent the last 14 years in this specific field and I am always willing to learn something new. As a thank you for taking the time to do this, if you are willing, I would be happy to send you a set of cables gratis that I would personally fabricate or just let you keep the test cables.

This could be a fun thing for Jason to try at one of his monthly thunderdome challenges as well if he runs out of ideas. If you happened to see what I sent him for last night's experiment at Schiit, I believe you can tell I would follow through on my end if you are game for a challenge.

When I first purchased my cooker I did test it with 2 sets of power cables I made.

I made a double set of power cables with copper, and gold, and rhodium connectors from the same manufacturer.
I cooked one set and not the other.
The results were significant enough that I kept the cooker.

And over the years I have repeatedly 'proven' to myself that the sonic differences are obvious, and most welcome, in MY system.

These sonic differences are, at least to me, readily apparent, but can be obscured by a system that can mask these sonic changes.
As such being familiar with the system and its sonic signature is a must, not to mention the choices of music for such testing.

For instance one of the most obvious improvements I notice is the extremely low bass response.
Some systems just don't go down to 20Hz nor have sub 20Hz response, nor does all music.

And I really don't care for 'blind' testing as it is a skewed methodological approach to differentiating what is 'Better', not just different.
While it can help with determining differences, qualitative assessment is not it's forté.

Mike Moffet posted his thoughts a ways back on 'blind' testing and I fully concur with his experiences and conclusions.

And since blind testing doesn't lend itself to determining what is 'Better', I use a different approach.
I make assessments over long term listening (days, weeks, months) not minutes, because some of the differences are subtle, while others (like the bass response) are not.
For example, cooking digital cables (USB, SPDIF, AES, Ethernet) is far more subtle than ac power or analog signal cables.

I'd say cook some cables, listen to them for at least a week, if not weeks, with lots of very familiar music, then remove them and pay attention to the qualitative changes with the same music, and then change back to the cooked cables and again listen to the differences.
THAT is where the qualitative aspects will become apparent.

And if your friend will loan you his cooker, this approach is going to tell you more than what 'blind' testing ever can or will.
That is how I test for improvements, in my system, which I have found to be a much better methodological approach to differentiating 'Better'.
Which really is my aim in determining what any tweaks/changes/modifications are all about, is it 'Better' or just different?

And to this end I have kept a written log of such testing over years, where patterns emerge as to the type of modification, and how much time it takes to notice changes, and then determine if these changes are truly 'Better', or not.

And I would love to participate in this little test, except…
I am currently in the middle of other projects (dialing in 2 tube amps, making matched pair tube assessments, evaluating newly made, but different configuration power cables), and as such my entire system is not 'stable' and unchanging enough for such tests.
Which in turn means they would have to take place months in the future, and so these tests would probably not be 'timely' enough, especially since you can test a cooker yourself.
And again since I don't utilize blind testing as a method for assessment as it is far to 'quick and dirty' and lacks resolution and qualitative data for my needs, which means the tests themselves would take weeks as well.

But with access to a cooker yourself you can determine, for yourself, if there is any benefit to cooking cables, and after all, that really is all that matters, to you.

I have already put forth the effort and know what the results are, for me, in my system, and I like what the contribution cooked cables makes.

And this is but one such cable enhancement technique I have explored, using the methodological approach described above.

JJ

 

[myquealer]

I tried that just now. It definitely helps keep the weight on but mine still falls off almost every time I move arm back to the left. Further, the pivot point ends up *much* higher than the stylus.

I have not had the weight fall off at all and have played several albums today. The pivot point does move higher than the stylus. Do the instructions say the pivot point should be at the same level as the stylus or is that just the norm? A higher pivot point means more of the weight at the back of the arm is below the pivot point which would increase stability of the unipivot arm.

On another note, I've resolved my issues with the cueing mechanism by fiddling with the three screws there.

 

[Paladin79]

When I first purchased my cooker I did test it with 2 sets of power cables I made.

I made a double set of power cables with copper, and gold, and rhodium connectors from the same manufacturer.
I cooked one set and not the other.
The results were significant enough that I kept the cooker.

And over the years I have repeatedly 'proven' to myself that the sonic differences are obvious, and most welcome, in MY system.

These sonic differences are, at least to me, readily apparent, but can be obscured by a system that can mask these sonic changes.
As such being familiar with the system and its sonic signature is a must, not to mention the choices of music for such testing.

For instance one of the most obvious improvements I notice is the extremely low bass response.
Some systems just don't go down to 20Hz nor have sub 20Hz response, nor does all music.

And I really don't care for 'blind' testing as it is a skewed methodological approach to differentiating what is 'Better', not just different.
While it can help with determining differences, qualitative assessment is not it's forté.

Mike Moffet posted his thoughts a ways back on 'blind' testing and I fully concur with his experiences and conclusions.

And since blind testing doesn't lend itself to determining what is 'Better', I use a different approach.
I make assessments over long term listening (days, weeks, months) not minutes, because some of the differences are subtle, while others (like the bass response) are not.
For example, cooking digital cables (USB, SPDIF, AES, Ethernet) is far more subtle than ac power or analog signal cables.

I'd say cook some cables, listen to them for at least a week, if not weeks, with lots of very familiar music, then remove them and pay attention to the qualitative changes with the same music, and then change back to the cooked cables and again listen to the differences.
THAT is where the qualitative aspects will become apparent.

And if your friend will loan you his cooker, this approach is going to tell you more than what 'blind' testing ever can or will.
That is how I test for improvements, in my system, which I have found to be a much better methodological approach to differentiating 'Better'.
Which really is my aim in determining what any tweaks/changes/modifications are all about, is it 'Better' or just different?

And to this end I have kept a written log of such testing over years, where patterns emerge as to the type of modification, and how much time it takes to notice changes, and then determine if these changes are truly 'Better', or not.

And I would love to participate in this little test, except…
I am currently in the middle of other projects (dialing in 2 tube amps, making matched pair tube assessments, evaluating newly made, but different configuration power cables), and as such my entire system is not 'stable' and unchanging enough for such tests.
Which in turn means they would have to take place months in the future, and so these tests would probably not be 'timely' enough, especially since you can test a cooker yourself.
And again since I don't utilize blind testing as a method for assessment as it is far to 'quick and dirty' and lacks resolution and qualitative data for my needs, which means the tests themselves would take weeks as well.

But with access to a cooker yourself you can determine, for yourself, if there is any benefit to cooking cables, and after all, that really is all that matters, to you.



I have already put forth the effort and know what the results are, for me, in my system, and I like what the contribution cooked cables makes.

And this is but one such cable enhancement technique I have explored, using the methodological approach described above.

JJ

Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts.

Oh yeah if any of you would like to know the tubes sent to Jason for the listening at the Schiitr, PM me and I will let you know.

 

[DACattack]

I know the Sol is experiencing some serious growing pains right now, and I do hope it succeeds in the end. That said, I do think Schiit really hit it out of the park with both Aegir and Bifrost 2. I've owned a lot of their gear and these two in particular really shine.

On a personal note, I still miss ORT's wordplay and his VU meter silliness, and will miss Robert's obvious joy in this hobby. On an even more personal note, my brother's fiancé died unexpectedly last month (only 40), and it just brings home to me how tenuous and fragile this life is and how important it is to appreciate each day as it comes, if we are so blessed.

Now, to that end, time to enjoy a cup of good coffee, the early morning sun, and some music. Best to all.

 

[bcowen]

I know the Sol is experiencing some serious growing pains right now, and I do hope it succeeds in the end.

There are several companies that have been making turntables for decades and are still learning things as they go (VPI comes to mind). For Schiit's first entry, it looks to me like they got a *lot* of stuff right. But what's most important (to me, anyway) is how they have publicly acknowledged the flaws, the immediate steps they are taking to fix them, and the lengths they are going to for those that have already purchased. Can't be a profitable venture for them at this point, which just reinforces the example they set of being a company that truly cares about taking care of their customers and making things right if something goes wrong.

On a personal note, I still miss ORT's wordplay and his VU meter silliness, and will miss Robert's obvious joy in this hobby. On an even more personal note, my brother's fiancé died unexpectedly last month (only 40), and it just brings home to me how tenuous and fragile this life is and how important it is to appreciate each day as it comes, if we are so blessed.

Very sorry to hear that. My condolences to your brother and your family.

 

[DACattack]

There are several companies that have been making turntables for decades and are still learning things as they go (VPI comes to mind). For Schiit's first entry, it looks to me like they got a *lot* of stuff right. But what's most important (to me, anyway) is how they have publicly acknowledged the flaws, the immediate steps they are taking to fix them, and the lengths they are going to for those that have already purchased. Can't be a profitable venture for them at this point, which just reinforces the example they set of being a company that truly cares about taking care of their customers and making things right if something goes wrong.

Agreed. They are going about this the right way.

(Thank you for your condolences.)

 

[RCBinTN]

Here’s the deal with Sol: we dun messed up. We should have had a beta on Sol.

Soooooo...we’re doing a beta.

Yesterday, all Sol owners got this email:

Okay, so it looks like the Sol launch has uncovered a lot more problems than we expected. Please accept our apologies for any trouble you may have had. We want this to be a really exceptional turntable, so we're putting a pause on sales.​

We're also making you the following offer: please keep your Sol and help us improve it. ​

If you choose to do so, we'll refund $300 of the Sol's original price, making your cost $499. Then, we will send you a selected set of updates and changes to improve your Sol. Also, if you have any functional problems right now (like wobbling platters), we will swap those parts as well. And, at the end of the beta period, if you still aren't happy, we'll refund the rest of your purchase price.​

Alternately, if you're just done with Sol right now, that's fine too. Contact us for an RA and we will refund 100% of your purchase price, taxes and shipping when we receive it back.​

We sincerely hope you'll help us make Sol what it should be. If not, we completely understand.
​

We're going to be doing everything we need to make this right, up to and including flying out Conrad to help us in real time. When we know a bit more, we can start sending updates to the beta testers. With luck, we'll be able to address the problems you've had and start shipping again within a month or two. If not, it might take a little longer. And when we relaunch, we'll make sure every turntable is pre-set-up for a "typical" cartridge, and there will be a standard cartridge option.

Again, apologies for the stupidity.

Yikes, it really was Friday the 13th. Nice reaction & beta plan, Jason and Schiit folks.

Sorry to hear about your family's loss, DACattack. My condolences as well.

Piece of bad "luck" here, our upstairs HVAC unit took a dump yesterday. Perfect timing, the heat index is only 105F.
No more Schiit for awhile, this could be an $8k adventure

 

[Porteroso]

There are several companies that have been making turntables for decades and are still learning things as they go (VPI comes to mind). For Schiit's first entry, it looks to me like they got a *lot* of stuff right. But what's most important (to me, anyway) is how they have publicly acknowledged the flaws, the immediate steps they are taking to fix them, and the lengths they are going to for those that have already purchased. Can't be a profitable venture for them at this point, which just reinforces the example they set of being a company that truly cares about taking care of their customers and making things right if something goes wrong.

It's totally a profitable move... They tried to enter a new market segment, and if they had not done what they did, which sure, was totally the best possible thing to do in their predicament, they would have ruined their reputation forever with a ton of people not interested in their digital stuff, but maybe in the analog. Making it right is the first step toward appealing to a new customer base and expanding their sales. It's the right thing, and it's also the most profitable thing, long term.

I do appreciate them making the table better. I'll wait for the non-beta version, and I bet it will be great. If you can get the current version to work (balanced platter, short cart) you apparently get great sound out of it. Hopefully it only improves.

 

[bcowen]

It's totally a profitable move... They tried to enter a new market segment, and if they had not done what they did, which sure, was totally the best possible thing to do in their predicament, they would have ruined their reputation forever with a ton of people not interested in their digital stuff, but maybe in the analog. Making it right is the first step toward appealing to a new customer base and expanding their sales. It's the right thing, and it's also the most profitable thing, long term.

I do appreciate them making the table better. I'll wait for the non-beta version, and I bet it will be great. If you can get the current version to work (balanced platter, short cart) you apparently get great sound out of it. Hopefully it only improves.

I certainly hope it is profitable for them long term and expect it will be. But that's beside the point I made above.

 

[artur9]

We're going to be doing everything we need to make this right, up to and including flying out Conrad to help us in real time.

First time I read this I thought it meant Conrad would be flying out to customer's homes. The frequent flyer miles!

Again, apologies for the stupidity.

Ditto.