[Xcalibur255]

Here is something less artful I recently did. This was part of a blind challenge I made up for a group of friends. These are 6sn7 or equivalent tubes of different manufacture, encased so they cannot be recognized, even sealed with sealing wax. All have tube extensions built in so nothing on the actual tube is visible. One gentleman from here was quite accurate recognizing the various makes of tubes by sound. There are a few Russian tubes but mostly those made by companies like Sylvania, GE, Westinghouse, Ken-Rad, and RCA. Each capsule is vented and no tubes were harmed in this process. Many from the forties and some are considered to be remarkable sounding but not everyone can discern the differences. You can pay a lot of money for some tubes and scarcity becomes a factor, a person might find the sound remarkable for a lot less money if there are no pre-conceived ideas.

The first tests were conducted in a Lyr 3.

Is there a post elsewhere on the forum with a more detailed write-up of this and the results? I would enjoying reading one if there is.

 

[Jason Stoddard]

Is there a post elsewhere on the forum with a more detailed write-up of this and the results? I would enjoying reading one if there is.

Same here!

 

[Paladin79]

Is there a post elsewhere on the forum with a more detailed write-up of this and the results? I would enjoying reading one if there is.

Same here!

Much of it was written about in the Vali tube rolling thread. A gentleman there hates GE tubes (maybe not power tubes) so I offered him a challenge of picking the GE tube out of a group of eight tubes. He was so sure of his abilities that he said not only would he put the GE at last, he would bet me a steak dinner and a big bottle of wine on his ability to do that. In order to be fair, I put some very good tubes in with the GE, Sylvania bad boy, Ken Rad VT-231 etc. Other friends will listen just to see if they like some tubes better than others. I am not sure if there is one definitive write up as much as ongoing conversations but you can check it out and I will provide additional info if needed. The main person who heard them picked a grey glass RCA from the 40's as well as a black glass Ken Rad as two of his favorites. He flat nailed the Sylvania Bad Boy and came within one tube of picking the GE as the worst. Thus I won the bet.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/vali-2-tube-rolling.793982/page-253

This is pretty far into the discussion but you can go back farther to read early parts.

The same gentleman involved here, @bcowen goes through certain amounts of burn in with tubes before some of them sound good to him. This is very specific so I am in the middle of running tests to see if it is measurable, or if indeed people can hear a difference between nearly identical tubes that are brand new, or that have had say 100 hours of burn in. That will be the next fun challenge.

The tubes have the numbers 1-8 on the top, those numbers can be swapped around so the next person does not know one tube from another. I should have them back soon and I will rearrange the numbers on the top.

 

[Paladin79]

1. Melz 6H8C 1956 (Russian)
2. Sylvania 7N7 tall body
3. GE 6SN7GTB
4. RCA 6sn7GT grey glass
5. Ken-Rad VT-231 Black Glass
6. Electro Harmonix 6SN7 (Russian)
7. Foton 1954 ribbed plates 6H8C (another Bill favorite) (Russian)
8. Sylvania VT-231 (bad boy)

9. This tube is an alternate and only available in case a tube fails Westinghouse 6SN7

Here are the tubes I used in the challenge, some were in there because the main person I sent them to knows Fotons and 7n7 (loktal equivalent to 6sn7's) very well.

The tube numbers 1-9 are meaningless because they will change each time a person receives the tubes to check out. We agreed no Phillips ECG tubes, and only 8 tubes in the study. I now have a mouse ear Tung Sol that might go nicely in the challenge as well. Emission was very good on all tubes, and all were thoroughly tested with the pins cleaned before insertion into octal extensions that I personally built. Some tube bases say CCCP on the bottom, thus I did not want the original bases to show.

You have to be careful in doing this because there are cases where GE tubes might have really been Ken-Rad and vice versa. Or a tube has a GE eia code for GE but it was really made by Sylvania. I bought plenty of tubes only to find out they were made by other companies.

 

[Jason Stoddard]

1. Melz 6H8C 1956 (Russian)
2. Sylvania 7N7 tall body
3. GE 6SN7GTB
4. RCA 6sn7GT grey glass
5. Ken-Rad VT-231 Black Glass
6. Electro Harmonix 6SN7 (Russian)
7. Foton 1954 ribbed plates 6H8C (another Bill favorite) (Russian)
8. Sylvania VT-231 (bad boy)

9. This tube is an alternate and only available in case a tube fails Westinghouse 6SN7

Here are the tubes I used in the challenge, some were in there because the main person I sent them to knows Fotons and 7n7 (loktal equivalent to 6sn7's) very well.

The tube numbers 1-9 are meaningless because they will change each time a person receives the tubes to check out. We agreed no Phillips ECG tubes, and only 8 tubes in the study. I now have a mouse ear Tung Sol that might go nicely in the challenge as well. Emission was very good on all tubes, and all were thoroughly tested with the pins cleaned before insertion into octal extensions that I personally built. Some tube bases say CCCP on the bottom, thus I did not want the original bases to show.

You have to be careful in doing this because there are cases where GE tubes might have really been Ken-Rad and vice versa. Or a tube has a GE eia code for GE but it was really made by Sylvania. I bought plenty of tubes only to find out they were made by other companies.

This was a great experiment--and a lot of work!

If you every get by the Schiitr, we should do a tube shootout. I think we're doing cartridges in August.

 

[Paladin79]

This was a great experiment--and a lot of work!

If you every get by the Schiitr, we should do a tube shootout. I think we're doing cartridges in August.

@Jason Stoddard I am happy to send the tubes your way to check out if you ever have the time. Some were very specific for a group that likes the Foton's and 7N7's so I may swap some of those out. There were a few things I was considering sending your way regardless so say the word sometime and I will get these to you as well. I have a tube tester and @bcowen owns several so every possible effort has been made to make sure there are no shorts, grid leakage, etc.

Tom

 

[Jason Stoddard]

@Jason Stoddard I am happy to send the tubes your way to check out if you ever have the time. Some were very specific for a group that likes the Foton's and 7N7's so I may swap some of those out. There were a few things I was considering sending your way regardless so say the word sometime and I will get these to you as well. I have a tube tester and @bcowen owns several so every possible effort has been made to make sure there are no shorts, grid leakage, etc.

Tom

Thank you!

If you're willing to part with the tubes for a while, September would be a great month to do a comparison at the Schiitrmeet.

 

[Paladin79]

Thank you!

If you're willing to part with the tubes for a while, September would be a great month to do a comparison at the Schiitrmeet.

Consider it done, I know they will be in good hands and since they are going to such a prestigious company, I am going to upgrade a couple tubes as well.

 

[wout31]

This was the link

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

Consider it done, I know they will be in good hands and since they are going to such a prestigious company, I am going to upgrade a couple tubes as well.

Big kudos and compliments indeed. You are adding something to the general knowledge of audiophiles. Good work.
Now.. as I suppose you are the one to choose the wine when the steak dinner comes by, see if you can twist his arm three ways from backward and pay for a Brunello di Montalcino. The absolute top of the top from Toscana Italia.
The Rosso still is a prime choice tough.

 

[Ableza]

The Rosso still is a prime choice tough.

Barbera or Barbaresco for me. Or maybe a Sangiovese.

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

Barbera or Barbaresco for me. Or maybe a Sangiovese.

Good because both Brunello and Rosso are made of 100% Sangiovese. (Sangiovese Grosso)
You will like it.

 

[Paladin79]

Big kudos and compliments indeed. You are adding something to the general knowledge of audiophiles. Good work.
Now.. as I suppose you are the one to choose the wine when the steak dinner comes by, see if you can twist his arm three ways from backward and pay for a Brunello di Montalcino. The absolute top of the top from Toscana Italia.
The Rosso still is a prime choice tough.

I will look for that wine as well. My family will be there and we are not limited to just one bottle. The bet has been resolved so there is no changing anything on it but I can apply the funds at my discretion anyway.

Through the years folks have told me of what they believe they can hear, or discern and some of the claims have been pretty amazing. Can one hear the difference between two identical wires? Can one connector sound better than another connector? In the case of tubes, there are audible differences in some types of tubes. I cannot hear much difference in power tubes, or as much difference in tubes in one amp compared to another.

 

[Paladin79]

Good because both Brunello and Rosso are made of 100% Sangiovese. (Sangiovese Grosso)
You will like it.

I am sure I will, thanks.

 

[RCBinTN]

That is a fascinating experiment, Tom. Coming from a guy who knows nothing about tubes.
I thought you were supposed to be making cables