Schiit Happened: The Story of the World's Most Improbable Start-Up

[Les Strat]

No. Analog volume control and EQ will always beat digital. Not in flexibility, maybe, but certainly in sound quality.

Though I do have to admit: It’s closer than you might think. As a years-long fan of Jason’s analog EQs, I was a bit surprised at how good the Mimir’s EQ sounds if used correctly.

Thanks for the excellent explanation of digital vs analogue volume controls Martin.

For several years I have been running my 'second system' without a preamp.

It is Logitech Transporter ( streamer) =>Schiit Gungir MB => ELAC Navis ARB 51 active speakers.

I use the digital volume control in the 'Transporter, and balanced XLR connections all the way through to the speakers.

I do need to attenuate volume quite a lot for 'normal' listening levels, so, I have taken the plunge and ordered a new Kara.

I don't 'need' a preamp as I only use one source in this system, but I have a feeling it is going to sound a lot better with a superb preamp in the chain....

I ordered direct from Schiit at the weekend and ETA is Friday this week.

Looking forward to trying it!

 

[Timster]

Question: How would one add the Valhalla 3 RCA output into my existing main set up? I was hoping to find a way to get it through to my passive speakers. Thing is I don't own a power amp. Only an integrated.

I think there were already a couple of responses, so let me add a bit as well.

What's your integrated amp, and does it have a Pre-Out / Main-in set of sockets on the back? Frequently if it exists it will have a connector between the two sockets like this:

This is the link between the preamp of the integrated and the power amp side of the integrated.
If they exist, run the pre-out into the inputs on V3 and then the output of the V3 to the main-in/power-in.

In this case you will have two volume controls. I would set the V3 to max, and just use the integrated's volume as you do now. (I don't think that's an issue for the tubes, but @bcowen or ACP could maybe suggest if that's an issue). If it is a concern for the tubes, reverse the idea, or even some combination of the two controls. I doubt you'd hear any signal degradation either way.

If you don't have the pre-out/main-in option, then without another external switch box, you could only run the V3 on one of your sources. So perhaps the DAC feeding the integrated. Run the output of the DAC into the V3 and V3 output into the input you currently use for the DAC. You will again have the two volume controls to contend with, but now the V3 is only playing with (in this example) the DAC as the source. This one does have the advantage that if your main source comes via the DAC, then you get DAC --> V3 --> Headphones, with no need to turn the integrated on.

You might need to match the gain on the V3 to the integrated, so always start with the low gain and adjust as needed.
And, in either case, no output to speakers with headphones as the V3 mutes the pre-out when headphones are connected.

 

[artur9]

From the linked explanation:

Rather than a fixed 8Ω, it may be interesting to use speaker impedance or EPDR instead, if that number is handy.
My speakers are rated at 4Ω nominal so I'd need to double the number.
Their minimal EDPR is only 1.5Ω so that would be 5 1/3 the number.

Using your voltages, @Lavcat , I'd need 12.5-33 1/3 W "normal" and 344-917 1/3 W.

Darn! the amps I'm getting only go to 800W peak ...

....
I personally like how a lot of the early CDs were mastered. Maybe because it was before the loudness wars started. And of course Mike's MFSL tech was great.

My research and home experimentations suggest that the sweet spot for CD is between 1989-1996?

Why?

In 1989 (maybe '90), the 24b ADC was introduced and my home experiments suggest that 16b doesn't record some instruments correctly (horns, in my tests) and cymbals (which produce sounds with details 16b doesn't capture).

1996 is the beginning of the loudness wars, which go on to 2003?

With the above in mind, I look for CDs remastered post-1990 or recordings with a provenance of analog higher rated ADC (24b/48Khz).

 

[KoshNaranek]

You kids and tube heat. If you want dinner in a hurry, light up 24 EL-34's, four EL-84's, and four 6922's....in just the amps. Jiffy pop.

I thought you were allergic to pentodes?

 

[StimpyWan]

very interesting idea, but shouldn't one divide the squared voltage by the speaker's impedance to get wattage (e.g. P=V*V/R). also the test tones are not recorded at 0dBFS, but at -12dBFS...

@StimpyWan or anyone else with digital music production knowledge: how much headroom (relative to 0dBFS) is typically built into digital recordings/ masterings? Does this headroom vary with Genre or other characteristics of the recorded material (e.g. unamplified classical / jazz vs EDM or music created without actual instruments & microphones)?

In my experience, most mastering houses kept digital levels at 0dB, in order to take advantage of the full 16 bit CD resolution. There was very little headroom at that point. Maybe a tenth of a dB. Even then, I often found digital masters that were peaked too hot, which can cause audible over level distortion (a brief buzz that sounded similar to an electric razor - not pleasant). There's no why to fix that, since the over level occurred during the transfer of the master source copy. A new CD master would be required from the client, at that point.

Personally, I'd master projects a -3dB, that set final 0 levels, using Dither, when producing the final master. I never had any issues using that method.

 

[WeepingGuitar]

I think there were already a couple of responses, so let me add a bit as well.

What's your integrated amp, and does it have a Pre-Out / Main-in set of sockets on the back? Frequently if it exists it will have a connector between the two sockets like this:


This is the link between the preamp of the integrated and the power amp side of the integrated.

Sorry if I'm a tad slow to catch on and please correct me if I'm wrong, is this a method to utilize Valhalla to inject tube sound in the signal chain?

If yes, then it's what I'm pondering. Would I be able to put a Vahalla between my Freya S and power amplifier and have some fun with tubes? I would max out the volume on the Vahalla and control volume with the Freya? Thanks.

 

[bcowen]

I thought you were allergic to pentodes?

I think it was the onslaught of all those pentodes that triggered my allergy.

But I'm now down to a single pair of triodes, so pretty much immune to allergic flare-ups.

 

[StimpyWan]

Sorry if I'm a tad slow to catch on and please correct me if I'm wrong, is this a method to utilize Valhalla to inject tube sound in the signal chain?

If yes, then it's what I'm pondering. Would I be able to put a Vahalla between my Freya S and power amplifier and have some fun with tubes? I would max out the volume on the Vahalla and control volume with the Freya? Thanks.

Certainly. The VH3 has preamp inputs and preamp outputs. So, there's no reason you couldn't insert it between your Freya S and your power amp. As to volume, I'd set the VH3 at 50% volume. Just to control the peak levels a bit, so you don't accidently blast your system, using the 100% volume method. Then, you can add or subtract volume via the VH3 to set gain, to tube warmth ratio. Plus, the VH3 can still be used as a head amp.

Good luck.

 

[JohnnyOps]

What's your integrated amp, and does it have a Pre-Out / Main-in set of sockets on the back? Frequently if it exists it will have a connector between the two sockets like this:

Is that a Creek 5350se? Looks exactly like mine (fonts, RCA weird side slots). Love that amp.

 

[ricksome]

Well, when I short it out I tend to light up quite dramatically! Does that count?

ORT

Post a picture when you light up !!! LOL !!!

 

[Paladin79]

I think it was the onslaught of all those pentodes that triggered my allergy.

But I'm now down to a single pair of triodes, so pretty much immune to allergic flare-ups.

Pentodes can certainly act as triodes, my favorites are Telefunken LS-50’s and I might even use Russian GU-50’s in a pinch. Then there are beam power tetrodes that can be used as well.

 

[bagwell359]

No. Analog volume control and EQ will always beat digital. Not in flexibility, maybe, but certainly in sound quality.

Though I do have to admit: It’s closer than you might think. As a years-long fan of Jason’s analog EQs, I was a bit surprised at how good the Mimir’s EQ sounds if used correctly.

Sonics vs flexibilty and some control (fixed bands or not enough PEQ bands) vs available bands do the job.

IMO, the best:

1. no EQ or PEQ

2. Whichever fits the needs best and best sonics - which are two variables that are unlikely to both be maxed at the same time if one has multiple choices of EQ/PEQ.
It's good to have more choices - analog fixed and digital PEQ fixed range from Schiit.

As always one has to weigh the needs with what is available to one. In my case my current PEQ only works via streaming/Pixel 9/USB, so for my CD (optical) and streaming (coax), the Gungnir 2 PEQ will get tried and almost for sure used. Nice for free.

 

[sam6550a]

I think it was the onslaught of all those pentodes that triggered my allergy.

But I'm now down to a single pair of triodes, so pretty much immune to allergic flare-ups.

I will be glad to give all of those pentodes and beam power tetrodes that trigger your allergies a good home.

 

[Ripper2860]

Happy Tuesday (or Wednesday if applicable)!!

(A little pick-me-up!!)

 

[bcowen]

I will be glad to give all of those pentodes and beam power tetrodes that trigger your allergies a good home.

Sam, I never fail to be impressed at what a great guy you are. How very thoughtful!