[Ableza]

  By this I mean that although these are commonly called PCM recorders, the "PCM" signal these devices output is really the result of a re-sampling and decimotion trick performed on the delta sigma modulator data stream.

 
Yes, it is, depending on the ADC used.  But what does that matter?  If that is the original content format, then there will be nothing better created from it, and any variation from that original is just that: a simple variation.  Not an improvement.

 

[audioholik]

   
Yes, it is, depending on the ADC used.  But what does that matter? 

 
It's not native PCM content. Just another re-sampling trick.
 
What I wanted to say is that the argument of nativeness works both ways, for DSD and PCM.

 

[Maxvla]

It doesn't matter if it's the original.

 

[audioholik]

It doesn't matter if it's the original.

The original re-sampling trick.

 

[madwolfa]

  By this I mean that although these are commonly called PCM recorders, the "PCM" signal these devices output is really the result of a re-sampling and decimotion trick performed on the delta sigma modulator data stream.

 
I don't think recording studios use cheap delta-sigma ADCs...

 

[Ableza]

   
It's not native PCM content. Just another re-sampling trick.
 
What I wanted to say is that the argument of nativeness works both ways, for DSD and PCM.

Not native PCM?  Of course it is.  Almost all DARs use PCM as their native recording format, at whatever sampling rate the engineer set (or the system is capable of.)  It can't be "re" sampled if it's the original sample!

 

[audioholik]

   
I don't think recording studios use cheap delta-sigma ADCs...

 
Pro-audio industry moved to delta-sigma ADCs long time ago.

 

[audioholik]

  Not native PCM?  Of course it is.  Almost all DARs use PCM as their native recording format, at whatever sampling rate the engineer set (or the system is capable of.)  It can't be "re" sampled if it's the original sample!

The Nile is not just a river in Egypt, as they say

 

[madwolfa]

  Pro-audio industry moved to delta-sigma ADCs long time ago.

 
OK... And most of them are recording in PCM anyway and then converting to DSD for SACD mastering.
Almost nobody records to DSD directly.

 

[audioholik]

   
OK... And most of them are recording in PCM anyway 

They are NOT recording in PCM, they are making a couple of tricks on the D-S modulator and output PCM.
 
Probably nobody is manufacturing r2R ADCs today.

 

[madwolfa]

  They are NOT recording in PCM, they are making a couple of tricks on the sigma modulator and output PCM.

 
So what do you suggest? Tapes?

 

[NinjaHamster]

   
So what do you suggest? Tapes?

I suggest you befriend Leonard Bernstein and Janis Joplin and ask to go to their house and listen to them ... ah, crap ...

 

[Ableza]

  They are NOT recording in PCM, they are making a couple of tricks on the D-S modulator and output PCM.
 
Probably nobody is manufacturing r2R ADCs today.

An R2R ADC is NOT required for PCM.

 

[Jason Stoddard]

After a few pages of the DSD/PCM/provenance/upsampling/etc debate, do you wonder why so many people think us audiophiles are a little bit nuts?
 
Time to listen to some music, I think. Does it sound good? Yep. Then all is well.

 

[Ableza]

... and we engineers can be even more nuts than audiophiles.  Now combine the two...