[akwok]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoobies Yes, it's a distortion injector. What other straw-men can we beat up on?

Hi CookieFactory! I thought you were banned?

 

[Zoobies]

Quote:

Originally Posted by akwok Hi CookieFactory! I thought you were banned?

I was! But I pulled an ILuvSony!

 

[akwok]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoobies I was! But I pulled an ILuvSony!

Oh snaps.

 

[RogerWilco]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferbose So no one even knows what the jumper is supposed to do and we just go around blindly debating its sonic character? What if it is a distortion injector? Why not just pull out a few capacitors or op-amps and see if the DAC will will sound better? From one of the earliest Zhaolu thread it is said to be a 24/192 DAC from China, which it is not, and never was. So much misinformation about the Zhaolu is promoted ad lib around here. The whole 192 kHz business (labeled on the outside of some units, printed on PCB) is clearly an intentionally misleading advertisement by Zhaolu electronics in China, a common practice in audio industry over there. And when I finally got my hands on it to do A/B and found (to my ears) it is not the giant killer it is supposed to be, people ask me: "have you tried the phantom 192 kHZ mode that does not even physically exist? It sounds better... blah blah blah." Now that Zhaolu 2.0 is out, the FOTM complex will only escalate...

All of this has been gone over and over an over again Ferbose.It has all been explained.I don't really feel like going over it all again--maybe someone else here that has been keeping up with this will.My self i really don't care what it is labeled as--i only go with what sounds the best.

 

[Ferbose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerWilco All of this has been gone over and over an over again Ferbose.It has all been explained.I don't really feel like going over it all again--maybe someone else here that has been keeping up with this will.My self i really don't care what it is labeled as--i only go with what sounds the best.

OK, do I need to dig into a thread that has 1200 replies and find out what the heck is going on with that mislabeling business? When the title of the thread is itself misinformed? You know it is not 192 kHz, but you still use the term 192 kHz jumper setting as if 192 kHz operation really exists--that greatly confuses me.

 

[Ori]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferbose You know it is not 192 kHz, but you still use the term 192 kHz jumper setting as if 192 kHz operation really exists--that greatly confuses me.

Forget the 192. If you open a Zhaolu 1.3 you will find one (and only one) user-changeable jumper, with position A and position B. In the translation from Chinese, position A was mistakenly marked 192. Put the jumper in position A please.
Many people have tried position A. The manufacturer tried position A. The manufacturer says it's OK to use position A. The dealer says it's OK to use position A. Therefore, I submit that you ought to try position A.

 

[Ferbose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ori Forget the 192. If you open a Zhaolu 1.3 you will find one (and only one) user-changeable jumper, with position A and position B. In the translation from Chinese, position A was mistakenly marked 192. Put the jumper in position A please. Many people have tried position A. The manufacturer tried position A. The manufacturer says it's OK to use position A. The dealer says it's OK to use position A. Therefore, I submit that you ought to try position A.

Pardon my ignporance, what does postition A do compared to postition B?

 

[Ori]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferbose Pardon my ignorance, what does position A do compared to postition B?

My guess is that it modifies the internal digital filter, but it's a guess only. The spec is very blurry in that regard.
I doubt that the FAE at Crystal Semiconductors really knows. Many times a designer builds some logic into a chip, which may have made sense at the time, but later turned out not exactly per the original intent. That's called "happy mistakes"...
I have a friend who made such a blunder in a communications chip, which made it to huge volume production and eventually the standards committee adopted that mistake as part of the specifications. Go figure...

A simple example. When you vote for a mayor, senator or the President, you are usually faced with two choices. Do you really know what they mean?!

Heck no... You take your best guess and hope for the best... Think of that jumper the same, put it in position A and hope for the best. One thing is for sure. It definitely won't raise your taxes...

 

[hugz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferbose Pardon my ignporance, what does postition A do compared to postition B?

I dont know why you show hatred to position A and not position B

you're perfectly happy to use position B even though you dont know what it does, so why aren't you happy to use position A even though we dont know what it does?

 

[RogerWilco]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hugz I dont know why you show hatred to position A and not position B you're perfectly happy to use position B even though you dont know what it does, so why aren't you happy to use position A even though we dont know what it does?

LMAO

 

[Ferbose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hugz I dont know why you show hatred to position A and not position B you're perfectly happy to use position B even though you dont know what it does, so why aren't you happy to use position A even though we dont know what it does?

I was using position B because the machine was handed to me that way and s.a.b. said it sounds better, and I didn't bother to change it to a setting called 192 kHZ that makes no sense. I have nothing against either position, but I don't like people saying why not try A over B--I am not going to tell you what A does, but the consensus (how come I was informed otherwise?) is that it sounds better. Are we talking about a magic stone on top of the CDP or are we talking about a jumper in a circuit that should actually do something?

So, what does the jumper do?

I have been bit**ing and mo**ing about this jumper over so many posts.
And I got so many replies that basically mean: "dude, you suck, why didn't you try it?"
Still, no one wants to tell me what position A does.
This is very frustrating...

 

[hugz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferbose I was using position B because the machine was handed to me that way and s.a.b. said it sounds better, and I didn't bother to change it to a setting called 192 kHZ that makes no sense. I have nothing against either position, but I don't like people saying why not try A over B--I am not going to tell you what A does, but the consensus (how come I was informed otherwise?) is that it sounds better. Are we talking about a magic stone on top of the CDP or are we talking about a jumper in a circuit that should actually do something? So, what does the jumper do? I have been bit**ing and mo**ing about this jumper over so many posts. And I got so many replies that basically mean: "dude, you suck, why didn't you try it?" Still, no one wants to tell me what position A does. This is very frustrating...

Maybe it's position B which contains an extra circuit and position A skips it? You seem to be assuming that position A will add something to position B (a filtering circuit or a distortion circuit as you teasingly put it), but for all we know it's could be position B that adds a filtering circuit, distortion circuit or lord knows what else.

Since no one has any idea what each one does, I think the only fair thing to do is try both and use the one which sounds best; or, failing that, use the factory setting (192?).

Have you considered that no one is telling you what position A does because no one knows? We're not hiding anything from your ferbose, it's not a conspiracy to trick you into doing strange reviews. All anyone's saying is that there's 2 different settings on the DAC and they provide a different sound. You can bitch and moan all you want, but no amount of bitching or moaning will cause the knowledge of the purpose of position A or B to pop into my head. I simply dont know why it does.

Try it out and see how it sounds! You may like it better or you may not! In my opinion, you sound so frustrated with zhaolu at this stage due to not understanding the purpose of having an ambiguously labelled jumper that I suspect you'll consider it to sound worse if you change it. Sounds to me that after all the complaining about the jumper and chinese products being poorly labelled, you're not going to be able to return to the DAC without some prejudice.

 

[Ferbose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hugz Have you considered that no one is telling you what position A does because no one knows? We're not hiding anything from your ferbose, it's not a conspiracy to trick you into doing strange reviews. All anyone's saying is that there's 2 different settings on the DAC and they provide a different sound. You can bitch and moan all you want, but no amount of bitching or moaning will cause the knowledge of the purpose of position A or B to pop into my head. I simply dont know why it does.

Thanks for the honest reply, Hugz.

Confucius once said: if you know, then you know; if you don't know, then you don't know; And thus you really know.
(I guess few people read Confucius in China anymore, after the Cultural Revolution)

One thing I hate to see is audio hype wrapped in mysticism. A nice way to sell audiophile prodcuts and promote audiophilia for sure, but in the long run it's detrimental for the entire audio hobby. There is no miracle product in audio electronics, regardless of where it's made or who designed it. Zhaolu DAC is a good product (cleverly tuned sonically) for what it is, but not a miracle product. It does not need misleading ads, hype or audio mysticism to sell itself. I once found a Chinese webpage complaining that Zhaolu mislabled their DAC 96 kHZ when the receiving chip was still 48 kHz. Why do they keep doing that?

 

[Ori]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferbose I have been bit**ing and mo**ing about this jumper over so many posts. And I got so many replies that basically mean: "dude, you suck, why didn't you try it?"

I hope not. This should be a hobby, not a war zone... Even if you're wrong, you are free to do whatever you want. I'm not certain the jumper would make that much difference, but it's a 2 minute task, vs. half a day of "bit**ing and mo**ing about this jumper over so many posts".
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferbose Still, no one wants to tell me what position A does. This is very frustrating...

Read my earlier post. It's not a joke. That is just the reality of the digital chip business.
You have to understand that there is theory and then there is reality. I've seen enough things that look great on paper or simulations but the final result comes out wrong, because of some minor detail you haven't considered or because of an erronous assumption. That's just the reality.
Check out the spec for the CS8414 receiver chip. It has tons of words about obvious things and not much about proprietary features. Is it important?
I don't think so. I drive a car and I don't have to know that pushing the gas pedal only tells the computer that I want to accelerate, and the computer computes some algorithm as to how much more injector opening to apply. It's irrelevant. I push the gas pedal and the car just goes faster.
You change that jumper and listen. Perhaps you hear some improvement, maybe nothing at all. Then you can come back here and say "sorry guys, but no cigar" and we'll all laugh it off...

Or you can say "I refuse to open the case" and we'll all shut up. Some will feel sorry for you, some will say you're wrong and some won't even give a hoot that one person in Pasadena refuses to try a two minute experiment.
Whichever way you go, that's fine with me. If you do it and decide that it sucks, that's OK too. All I know is that I would have tried it, but that's me.
In fact I did. I wrote about the Zhaolu 2.0 after listening to it in its near-stock form and it really sucked big time. Then someone said "try these opamps" which I happened to have. So a few minutes later I plugged these in and I'm better off now, knowing that these opamps do make a difference. That's how I learn and that's exactly what makes the web such a great resource. Granted there could be some negative experiences along the way, but then you should just shrug them off and move on. Life is too short to deal with such crap...
Again, I hope that all posts are with good intentions and that you'll find your truth in the end. It's your ears that count and you're entitled to enjoy your music the way you like it, whether anybody out there approves of it or not. I know I do...

 

[hugz]

Aside from all the junk about position A and position B, thankyou for your review. I'm personally in the position of deciding between the zhaolu 2.0 and something from the storm digital range (fortunately australia has a storm distributor which aleviates the worries shown in other threads about ken taking people's money and not delivering product). I'm somewhat using the Benchmark as my... benchmark. I've never heard one personally but since people so often talk of it so highly, I figure that if I can get a product which compares favourably against the DAC1 then I wont have to worry too much about upgraditis. It's useful to see reviews comparing them against the benchmark.

I hope that sometime in the future you can try out the zhaolu with the jumper switchd. I also hope that stuart can borrow your benchmark to do a similar test in his system!

My motivation for the position A/B thing is that i'm hoping after switching the position it will sound better, you'll compare it favourably against the Benchmark and then i'll get to save some money!