[HawkeyePierce]

I'm about to return my LCD-2's but need to bounce this off somebody before I do to make sure I'm not crazy. I just got them and after about 10hr listening I'm finding it hard to justify the cost.
 
BTW, I'm driving mine with the new Schiit Jotunheim (+dac). Audeze balanced cable.
 
The problem:
...I Have found the LCD-2's to be mind-blowingly amazing for 24-bit (HDtracks) classic rock albums like [fleetwood mac - rumours] and [heart - little queen], BUT, very fatiguing for absolutely everything else. They meet all my wildest expectations on these select albums and I melt in my seat while I sit and listen. However, when I listen to anything pop / electronic / youtube(all genres) / movies(old and new) they become extremely fatiguing after 20 minutes and I am forced to take them off for a 10 minute rest. It's getting very hard for me to find more than 5 or so albums (of music I like) that make use of what the LCD-2 has to offer.
 
Another thing is I have not experienced all this "deep, extended bass" that many people claim of the LCD-2. I suspect maybe I'm just not used to how fast the bass is. I'm coming from 3 years of Denon-AHD2000. It's not even just that the bass feels more controlled, it feels rolled off past 40hz ish.
 
 
Am I crazy, is this a common response, or do you think there's something wrong with my brand-new pair?

 

[DivergeUnify]

Make sure you're wearing your LCD2s very tight.  Its important your ear is close to the driver (I like my ear to touch the fazor), and wear the headband with as few notches as possible.

 

[HawkeyePierce]

They are sealing up very well. I can feel the pressure in my ears when taking them on-off.
 
The pads are extremely thick so I don't know how my ears would touch the fazors. I'll try later to take out a few notches from the headband and see if there's any difference.

 

[Me x3]

You can always pick a high end Fostex instead, although highs might be bright too.
 
NightHawk is warm and relatively dark

 

[pbui44]

I have a feeling that it is the weight of the LCD-2 causing the fatigue, not the sound. Having own or owned all three, the AQ NightHawks are slightly lighter than the Denon D2000 and much lighter than the LCD-2. Probably benefit with a balanced cable as well.

Edit: The weight of the AQ NightHawks are 350g, the D2000 are 370g, and the LCD-2 are 550g.

 

[Monsterzero]

Heres the deal with HDTracks vs. other music files vs. poor production.....some music is recorded very well in studio.Examples of bands that seem to put stock in production: Heart,Stones,Bowie,Eagles...might be others.

I have a pretty vast collection of music and a lot of it is poorly recorded and it doesnt matter if its gotten a 24/192 treatment or not,bad recording is bad recording.

I listen to a 24/192 copy of "Friend of the Devil" on any of my headphones and it sounds amazing,then If I go to any Sly Stone(for example) and Sly sounds like trash,because for whatever reason his stuff was poorly mastered.

For the last 10-15 years there has been a "loudness war" going on in the music business...Metallica's "Death Magnetic" is a fine example of ruining an album for the sake of volume.

Im not sure if this covers your issues or not,but any headphone you get will not make a bad recording sound good,though there are those that will make bad recordings sound horrid..."revealing" is the term used around here.

 

[HawkeyePierce]

I am fully aware of the volume wars, phony 24bit treatment on stuff that was recorded at 16, and crappy mastering.
I have a background in live sound so I know a few things about mics, recording equipment, and accoustics as well. 
 
I expected the LCD-2 to reveal the differences more than my D2000's since the fidelity ceiling is raised considerably. I really enjoy all the extra detail and hidden layers that I can now hear in albums I'm very familiar with. I was tickled silly by the guitars in Fleetwood Mac - Rumors and couldn't resist researching how they mic'd it to achieve such an amazing result. The foley intros in Heart - Little Queen just blew me away... I almost shed a tear; it was so immersive.
 
What I didn't expect was all sub-premium sources to be physically fatiguing after only 20-30 minutes. I have nearly all cd-lossless files and I can't even make it through a whole album with any of them before having a very sharp pain in my inner ear.    
 
In the end I just can't justify the price if the LCD2 can only work for a small handful of premium albums.
 
This post is more about figuring out if I can fix the fatigue. If I can, they will be more usable for all sources.

 

[Monsterzero]

Well in that case you can look at my signature and check off all my headphones from your next purchase cuz I would say that My LCD2.2s(pre fazor)are probably the least fatiguing of any of them.

On a side note,I too find the hype on LCD 2s to be overblown...I like mine but IMO my HE-500s blow them out of the water,500s have better bass impact,better highs,better mids(amazing),pretty much everything except the LCDs do dig down a bit deeper than my 500s.

 

[knopi]

I had one of the first version of the LCD2 (so no Fazor) but I agree LCD2 is warm darker headphone but with clean black window so it sounds very accurate, clean, semi open at the same time against some dark bloated headphone in my opinion. So it is strange that you feel fatigue them because it sounds pleasant according to my experience, maybe try another pair.
 
I had also HE500 one month borrowed in past and I agree it is better headphone tones are much more right and sound si more open etc. but strangely I enjoyed more LCD2 because of mids it has nice atmosphere and I was more lost in the music with nice nature signature although it is quite out against my speaker. Truth is I liked LCD2 only from quality dac hp amp which was neutral on more on brighter side because of Audeze darker character.
HE560 is better than HE500, I like it a lot but heard them only on meeting. Overall all planars are a little similar it has good dynamic, attack and nature tones but Audeze sounds more like semi open and more nature to me and HiFiMAN more open and tonally more right.  

 

[mysticstryk]

If you have the fazors version, your hearing that wonky mid to treble transition and treble response.

Your not weird, I sold my LCD-2 for the same reason. That and they have some of the worst ergonomics and fit right up there with Grado.

A well amped 650 or even the Hifiman 560 if you prefer the planar sound are much more balanced headphones with lots of detail.

 

[Malfunkt]

  I'm about to return my LCD-2's but need to bounce this off somebody before I do to make sure I'm not crazy. I just got them and after about 10hr listening I'm finding it hard to justify the cost...
 
Am I crazy, is this a common response, or do you think there's something wrong with my brand-new pair?

 
Well this is a timely post. I've seriously considered selling my LCD2 after getting my Denon AH-D2000. I know it seems crazy. But I love the Denon's so much. 
 
A lot of it comes down to usage. Right now, most of my headphone use is now at my home office. The Denon's won't bother the missus in the same room. A major factor is a lot of the music I'm listening to while working is electronic, groovy, or ambient - stuff I can play in the background, that is sensory engaging, but doesn't require involved listening like classical or jazz. The D2000 works great for this. It is also much lighter and more comfortable than the LCD2. It's cable is also better and more practical. 

So here is the rub, the LCD2 are better than the D2000 for jazz, acoustic, rock and classical. Here is my post on this http://www.head-fi.org/t/509710/audeze-lcd-2-impressions-thread/9225#post_12935532
 
It's tough because I've just gone through two pairs of 650s, and the LCD2 is technically better but the 650 can have a better balance in some ranges. Overall, I still keep my LCD2 over the 650. I sold the 650 to finance my D2000 (I have a rule of only owning so many things). The next factor is my LCD2 are kinda patched up (I did a good job, barely noticeable). Not sure what I could sell them for, and I did buy them for the obscene amount of $450CAD (before our dollar tanked too!). I know they are gem, and I put work into them. They are just not a daily headphone. They sleep in their box until I feel like using them. Actually, they are pretty comfortable and I even enjoy gaming with them from time to time, even driving them out of my PS4's Dualshock controller (sacrilege I know!)
 
If I want to do some 'proper' listening, it's going to be on the LCD2. 
 
Still, what am listening to right now? The D2000 via my ODAC/O2 listening to some crazy psybreaks (Hedflux & Grouch). It's a phase, I have to remind myself. 
 
Oh, and I can understand why you think the LCD2 is fatiguing. For music like pop, electronic, you may be turning it up to try to get some of the engagement on the lows and highs. I'd recommend just a touch of eq on the lows and highs. You just aren't going to get the rumble that the D2000 has. The D2000 just clicks with so much music. I love the damn thing.
 
Some of sonic preference is relative - especially when it comes to the low-end. I can think the D2000 have rumble, then I put on my MDR-7520 and it hits harder (not as round, bubbly and bragadociously), then I put on my 7550 and this is deep, round, and fairly fast dynamic bass, then throw on something like a Logitech UE6000 and go 'what the? this is all bass!' (how did Innerfidelity think this was balanced I don't know). But really, all of these headphones, you acclimate to, well maybe save the UE6000 (they actually are quite clear but very bass orientated. Value basshead cans for certain, plenty fun). 
 
The LCD2, is honestly not fatiguing while still managing to be very transparent. The HD650 is a completely non-fatiguing at the expense of losing out some details in some upper-mid frequencies (highs are more accurate and balanced than my LCD2, however, so there is a trade off. LCD2 has more extended bass, but 650 is still enjoyable). I

It can also take a while to appreciate some headphones, while others are immediately satisfying. The LCD2 needs to be fed dynamic music (24 bit doesn't matter, just great recordings and performances). Overtime, it may actually make you listen to different music. Honestly. There is plenty of chamber, classical and jazz, that moves me emotionally, that just wouldn't cut it otherwise. 
 
Personally, what I need to do at some point is save enough money, buy some HD800s and spend some serious time with them to compare. From there I'll let go of either headphone or keep both if it makes me appreciate them for their qualities. I've also tried the HE560s and felt these were somewhat in-between the LCD2 and the HD800. Very good headphones though and more comfortable. Haven't tried the HE500s but always wanted to.
 
I know for certain the D2000 isn't going anywhere - well at least its lineage isn't going anywhere. I might consider a AH-D7200 or Fostex model at some point. 
 
Hear at head-fi, we are all a bit crazy to obsess over this stuff.  I know I get strange looks all the time from my girlfriend as I'm switching headphones back and forth comparing them. 

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkeyePierce /img/forum/go_quote.gif

 

The problem:

...I Have found the LCD-2's to be mind-blowingly amazing for 24-bit (HDtracks) classic rock albums like [fleetwood mac - rumours] and [heart - little queen], BUT, very fatiguing for absolutely everything else. They meet all my wildest expectations on these select albums and I melt in my seat while I sit and listen. However, when I listen to anything pop / electronic / youtube(all genres) / movies(old and new) they become extremely fatiguing after 20 minutes and I am forced to take them off for a 10 minute rest. It's getting very hard for me to find more than 5 or so albums (of music I like) that make use of what the LCD-2 has to offer.

 

That's because the recording quality sucks and you're listening to what they really sound like. With Grados they can be even more fatiguing but people enjoy them for the midbass boost, then they just tweak it to reduce the treble.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkeyePierce /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Another thing is I have not experienced all this "deep, extended bass" that many people claim of the LCD-2. I suspect maybe I'm just not used to how fast the bass is. I'm coming from 3 years of Denon-AHD2000. It's not even just that the bass feels more controlled, it feels rolled off past 40hz ish.

 

What you're listening to probably doesn't even have that much below 40hz. Planar drivers tend to have a very flat response from 1000hz all the way down to 10hz (in some, only compared to dynamic drivers, but some are totally flat), the keyword being flat. You don't get a huge boost anywhere in the bass region unlike a dynamic driver with boosted bass like those Denons.

 

[HawkeyePierce]

   I know I get strange looks all the time from my girlfriend as I'm switching headphones back and forth comparing them. 

 
Yep... I just shipped my LCD's back to Audeze RMA. I have mixed feelings about it. My fiancee is definitely happy I returned them. haha. I tried explaining this audio stuff and demo'ing stuff for her but was mostly met with a blank stare and nodding.
 

   
Well this is a timely post. I've seriously considered selling my LCD2 after getting my Denon AH-D2000. I know it seems crazy. But I love the Denon's so much. 
 
 

 
I feel so much better after reading your post... I always did think my D2000's were one of my best buys ever. I got them for $200 (US) new on Amazon about 5 years ago. It was after they were discontinued but before people realized they were amazing and collectible. Now they go for $800 on ebay if they're in good shape.
 

 

.....

 

What you're listening to probably doesn't even have that much below 40hz.....

 
Oh it does... I get lower frequencies (not just MORE bass) out of my denons and even my old logitech 2.1 pc speakers.

 

[knopi]

How someone can prefer closed cans like D2000 over LCD2, ok Audeze have a lot shortcomings as I wrote but this is out. Thanks god that everyone have own ears and taste..

 

[Malfunkt]

  How someone can prefer closed cans like D2000 over LCD2, ok Audeze have a lot shortcomings as I wrote but this is out. Thanks god that everyone have own ears and taste..

 
It may very well be about ears and taste. 
 
In my case, it is about appreciating the qualities of each headphone. And there is a lot to like with the Denon. I prefer it as a complete package over the LCD2. More comfortable, a bit more portable, benefits of semi-closed design, easy to drive, engaging but largely linear frequency response, etc..
 
The Denon isn't quite a closed headphone, it's acoustic optimizer allows for the back pressure needed for bass impact but doesn't have the degree of chamber resonance issues you might get from a closed can otherwise. As a result it is remarkably open sounding, also aided by its surgical high-end. The bio-cellulose drivers are stellar. I noticed this on the TH-900 and same on the D2000. 
 
The LCD2 overall has a frequency response and technicalities that are superior for acoustically record music, vocal, classical, chamber, jazz, etc. It IS a better headphone in these regards. If I need to sit down and close my eye listening to small chamber classical music with a glass of scotch - the LCD2 it will be it.  
 
Otherwise, I'm reaching for the Denon.