[neilvg]

Hey all,

I wasn't totally sure what forum this should have gone in, but since it directly related to my L3k's, I will post it here:

I have noticed that with some specific eq'ing of the midrange and adding some 'air' in the upper treble regions (and for fun, boosting the bottom end, but just on some material and just for the sometimes desirable visceral bass effect) I have been able to dramatically increase my enjoyment of the L3K's which has previously sounded dull and 'airless' to me with a rather fatiguing midrange. What I have liked most about these phones is the impact and intimacy they can provide, but generally these effects are underscored by what I can only deem as the "AT Flaw" or the "AT House sound" to be less condescending.

Anyway, agree with me or not (one only need switch to the HE60's after listening to the L3K's to notice a dramatic effect such as what Akwok has recently noticed to come to this conclusion), I would like to know:

Has anyone experimented with EQ'ing higher end headphones, and if so, are there any suggestions for a HIGH Quality standalone (preferably small) EQ that I can add to my rig on top/underneath (I use an Earmax Annivarsary so probably underneath) my amp? I'd like to include this in the chain for only when I use the L3K's.

Neil

 

[sean-xenos]

Hi Neil,

as far as I know the L3000s were originally designed to be used with Audio-Technicas AT-DHA3000 headphone amp.
I have the impression that this amp automatically equalizes the L3000s.
If L3000s are driven by other headphone amps this equalization might have to be done additionally.

I've heard L3000s through an especially equalized CEC HD53R headphone amp, the tonal balance was good and the highs were rather balanced.
Driven by other headphone amps that did not have a seperate eq L3000s sounded too dark and veiled, the highs sounded slightly damped or muffled.

So eqing L3000s might not only be fun but in fact necessary.
Ok, I'm not an expert on L3000s as I don't own them myself, still I've heard them quite often.

You might ask chamix, who owns the L3000s, for further details.

 

[sgrossklass]

There's the Behringer DEQ2496 which seems to be rather popular as a digital EQ.

 

[darkless]

I certainly wouldn't mind anyone sharing their experiences with equalizing the L3000s

 

[cosmopragma]

Seems to be common sense in the small german headphone scene that the L3000 is originally meant to be equalized.Actually they are laughing at stupid american head-fiers that drive the expensive ATs the wrong way.
Send a PM to head-fi member Chamix.Probably he's able to provide an EQ curve.

 

[chamix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg Anyway, agree with me or not (one only need switch to the HE60's after listening to the L3K's to notice a dramatic effect such as what Akwok has recently noticed to come to this conclusion)

Totally agree

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg Has anyone experimented with EQ'ing higher end headphones, and if so, are there any suggestions for a HIGH Quality standalone (preferably small) EQ that I can add to my rig on top/underneath (I use an Earmax Annivarsary so probably underneath) my amp? I'd like to include this in the chain for only when I use the L3K's. Neil

Neil, is the EQ knob at the adequate amp for L3000 from Audio-Technica imperceptible?

The only thing about the EQ'ing need for L3000 that I can tell you is that as luck would have it I could get my headamp C.E.C. HD53R adequate equalized (integrated and optional with an external switch) from an audiophile person. Sadly I can't tell you details about the technical background for some reasons.
Really nice and customer-friendly would be a headphone amp with different and switchable internal EQ'ing for some of the most popular higher-end cans.

Best regards,

Chamix

 

[sean-xenos]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgrossklass There's the Behringer DEQ2496 which seems to be rather popular as a digital EQ.

How about the quality of the DEQ2496s DAC?

In the specs it says something like 24bit-Delta-Sigma,
how does it compare to Burr Browns PCM1794 or PCM 1796?

 

[neilvg]

Thanks for the quick replies...
Let me field some questions that were brought up:

The DHA3K is complete crap. Sorry guys, but as a headphone amp/EQ it fails. First of all, when setting the impedence to "AUTO" it selects a volume sensitivity that is WAY to high, which obviously doesn't make sense. Switching the Sens manually to Low doesn't fix this very much. Secondly, the EQ is done in the manner of an extremely 'soft' EQ. The EQ is for High and LOW and not MID where the L3K's primarily need the attenuation. Basically, I find nothing special about this amp except limitations. You can only use a digital source (which means no SACD/DVD-A in most cases) etc...

Moving on, I would like an EQ (I'll take a look at the suggestions provided) that allows me to adjust the curve in realtime. I'd rather not have an amp with this feature built in as getting the exact curve is difficult without experimentation in addition to the specific source / content used at the time. Small adjustments usually need to be made, and I usually find this fun as I can 'salt and pepper' my music.

For those who squak at this type of 'induced coloration' I say that you should already be know that the L3K's and many phones in this strata are extremely colored and with the exception of maybe (but not really) the HE60/HE90 most electrostat's are colored as well. Personally I listen to headphones for fun, not to constantly judge the sonic accuracy of the musical content. And if I wanted to do that, I havw phones for this.

Anyway, so the DHA wont cut it, I need something realtime, preferably something small enough to integrate easily with my rig, and something High Quality that wont degrade the signal (too much). I've seen some horrendous EQ.
===
If anyone has experience EQ'ing in general with any good headphones, please contribute to this thread. I'm pretty good at creating EQ curves, but I'm always curious. The L3K's are capable of so much more with the right 'tweak'.

Neil

 

[akwok]

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg Anyway, agree with me or not (one only need switch to the HE60's after listening to the L3K's to notice a dramatic effect such as what Akwok has recently noticed to come to this conclusion), I would like to know:

Yes, my main reason for switching to the HE60 was the huge amount of air!

The DHA3000 is a very good amplifier, the sound is top notch, but no amplifier can change the general sound signature of the L3000. The HE60 and the L3000 are both on opposite ends of the spectrum, and I am just one of those few who prefer the HE60.

I agree with the DHA3000 sensitivity issues though, even at low-impedance the gain seemed a bit much for the L3000. The EQ doesn't seem to do that much, it's rather limited, but I never used it anyways - I just set it and forget it (at 0 for all EQ). One issue I had with the DHA3000 was that when I messed around with the EQ, there would be times where there'd be a huge crackling sound, which pretty much scared the hell out of me the first time.

 

[sgrossklass]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean-xenos How about the quality of the DEQ2496s DAC? In the specs it says something like 24bit-Delta-Sigma, how does it compare to Burr Browns PCM1794 or PCM 1796?

Don't nail me on it, but I think it uses AKM parts, AK4393 or such. If the output stage is similar to the SRC2496, there should be 4580s in there. Certainly has some mod potential left.

 

[neilvg]

Does anyone know anything about the AudioControl Stuff? There are several home theater and car audio related products.

Neil

 

[chamix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg The DHA3K is complete crap. Sorry guys, but as a headphone amp/EQ it fails.

I haven't any experience with this amp, what I'd like to say with my poor english is that the EQ at the DHA3000 is a significant hint for the L3000 EQ'ing need.


Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg The L3K's are capable of so much more with the right 'tweak'. Neil

That's exactly what I've experienced with my equalized headamp. The problem in this case is, that manufacturers of headphones don't like to speek about this general problem by headphones openly.

This is a big advantage for electrostatic headphone systems like Stax and causes not recently their success and the customers satisfaction. Accounted to the necessary for no standard amping nobody to call these expensive and concerted amps into question.

 

[Nomad]

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg The EQ is for High and LOW and not MID where the L3K's primarily need the attenuation.

You just need to level up a bit the highs and to level up a bit the lows.
You might want to level down a bit the volume after that.
That will attenuate the mids.

 

[neilvg]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nomad You just need to level up a bit the highs and to level up a bit the lows. You might want to level down a bit the volume after that. That will attenuate the mids.

The EQ makes hardly any difference to the sound, it is very minor. The L3K's unfortunately need to scoop how the mids quite dramatically.

 

[Nomad]

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg The EQ makes hardly any difference to the sound, it is very minor. The L3K's unfortunately need to scoop how the mids quite dramatically.

Audiophiles shouldn't be afraid of some nice, controlled EQ if required (at the end everybody is doing it via cables/amps... somehow) but if you feel like you need a dramatic EQ instead of a subtle one you might want to change the cans instead.

Maybe they don't have the sound signature you are looking for after all.

Good luck with your EQ. Please let us know your findings. Cheers.