Recording live music with a DAP
Jul 27, 2008 at 1:57 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 21

Jackboot

New Head-Fier
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Posts
23
Likes
0
I've used MD for some time to record live music. I'd like to exit the MD world.

Can anyone suggest what options are available for a DAP that also has a mic input? I don't want to get a dedicated recording device. The Cowon D2 looks pretty good but not exactly what I'm looking for since it only records in 256 WMA.

Here is my short list of requirements:

1. Must be a good sounding DAP - not a recorder that also plays music
2. Records via a microphone input or line input. Highly prefer a lossless recording format like WAV or FLAC
3. At least 4GB of onboard flash
4. SD memory slot (important but not essential if there is enough onboard memory)


I don't feel that this list is too long or demanding yet I can't seem to find a player that fits my needs. Any help?

EDIT 1: I've slightly edited/clarified the list of requirements. The best suggestion so far is the Sony NWZ-A72x or NWZ-A82x DAP. However, only the Japanese market models have the record function.
 
Jul 27, 2008 at 8:23 AM Post #2 of 21

shigzeo

The Hiss King
Joined
Aug 9, 2006
Posts
12,931
Likes
1,062
i use sony a828 for live reocording. there is no plug in mic but with an extension cable and mic preamp or battery pack, it sounds very good indeed.

i used to be an md recorder with sharve auvi dr7 and sony rh10 and before that with sony mzr-37 and a panasonic and a kenwood and a sharp.

they have more in box editing options, but the fact i can record pcm for like 12 hours is all i need to recommend the sony. and it plays back very very well
 
Jul 27, 2008 at 4:06 PM Post #3 of 21

Jackboot

New Head-Fier
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Posts
23
Likes
0
Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
i use sony a828 for live reocording. there is no plug in mic but with an extension cable and mic preamp or battery pack, it sounds very good indeed.

i used to be an md recorder with sharve auvi dr7 and sony rh10 and before that with sony mzr-37 and a panasonic and a kenwood and a sharp.

they have more in box editing options, but the fact i can record pcm for like 12 hours is all i need to recommend the sony. and it plays back very very well



Very interesting suggestion! It is a DAP first with the ability to record in uncompressed PCM. It is a pity that it requires the WMC-NWR1 accessory cable ($30 shipped) AND a miniplug coupler ($10 shipped) in order to be able to plug a microphone into it. This adds another $40 to the already higher than average price for an 8GB flash player. The best price I'm finding in the USA is $250 for the 8GB. Also, it does not have an SD slot so I'm stuck with just 8GB of total memory. Still, it is worth considering.

When you say that it records in PCM, you mean that it records in WAV format, right?

Also, is the difference between the A72x and A82x series only bluetooth? (Edit: yes, this is the only difference).
 
Jul 27, 2008 at 10:25 PM Post #4 of 21

Jalo

Headphoneus Supremus
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Posts
3,415
Likes
849
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jackboot /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I've used MD for some time to record live music. I'd like to exit the MD world.

Can anyone suggest what options are available for a DAP that also has a mic input? I don't want to get a dedicated recording device. The Cowon D2 looks pretty good but not exactly what I'm looking for.

Here is my short list of requirements:

1. Good sounding MP3 player. I use Creative EP-630 earphones but may upgrade to slightly better phones.
2. Records via a microphone input. Highly prefer a lossless recording format like WAV or FLAC (Cowon D2 unfortunately records in 256 WMA!) but could also live with MP3
3. At least 4GB of onboard flash
4. SD memory slot

I don't feel that this list is too long or demanding yet I can't seem to find a player that fits my needs. Any help?





Well it depends on how you define dedicated recording device, but I recently purchase a Sony PCM-D50 digital recorder to use as a music player and it has everything on your list and more. First of all it has an excellent built in mic set up with mini external mic-in option. It can record 22/16, 22/24, 44/16, 44/24, 48/16, 48/24, 96/16 and 96/24. It has 4 GB on board memory and a memory card slot that will take memory stick pro duo and hg duo. It records in wav format and can play wav and mp3 format. What is more impressive is that it has optical line in and out in addition to analog line in and out. I can use all of the DAC and amp set up, Ultra Micro Dac and Amp, Predator etc. It is a very fun device to have and I just went to a concert and did some live recording just off the build-in mic in 96/24 set up and it sounded like a professional recordings. Furthermore, the simple usb connection with your computer make it so easy to copy you recordings to your computer in wav file. It is everything I wanted.
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 2:11 AM Post #7 of 21

Jackboot

New Head-Fier
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Posts
23
Likes
0
Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
these are all good choices. if you want small/stealthy though: non-international version of the sony. if you want features for recording to match or exceed your md: the others are decent choices.


I want small & stealthy - a DAP that does a good job at recording audio via external mic. So far I think the Sony is the best choice.

Shigzeo: When you say that it records in PCM, you mean that it records in WAV format, right? Also, the manual on Sony's website doesn't have a section on any recording function. Can you tell me a bit about how the A82x/A72x records?
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 2:57 AM Post #8 of 21

MrFaust

1000+ Head-Fier
Joined
May 31, 2006
Posts
1,050
Likes
21
you need an iRiver H120 or H140. There is a custom version of Rockbox made just for this instance. for more info on this, go to Taperssection.com - Index <- a wealth of information!!! Be sure the check out Church Audio. Chris made me an awesome stealth mic setup using a pair of Grado SR-60's a couple years ago. And now he has even better and much much MUCH smaller mics. He is always running specials on pre-amp/mic combos.
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 3:03 AM Post #9 of 21

shigzeo

The Hiss King
Joined
Aug 9, 2006
Posts
12,931
Likes
1,062
i mean in sony format pcm. it is 16bit 44.1 but you must use sony supplied sonicstage or something to convert from it. i have used it many times and soon will do a rmaa test with it and the original wav from the sony to see how well the signal stands up against the master material.

the problem is that these players are stripped down outside of japan. they probably can record but they are firmware hacked to not allow it. all japanese models record and the cable here is only like 10$ usd.

funny: church made me a mic preamp some time ago but it was massive: the size of a hammond. but that was bout 6 years ago, so things might have changed. i used it extensively with my sp ear mounted mics and sony/sharp/panasonic md units.

sp have great battery preamps though too and seem to have prices that do not flucuate at the wrong time.
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 3:08 AM Post #10 of 21

Jackboot

New Head-Fier
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Posts
23
Likes
0
Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
i mean in sony format pcm. it is 16bit 44.1 but you must use sony supplied sonicstage or something to convert from it. i have used it many times and soon will do a rmaa test with it and the original wav from the sony to see how well the signal stands up against the master material.

the problem is that these players are stripped down outside of japan. they probably can record but they are firmware hacked to not allow it. all japanese models record and the cable here is only like 10$ usd.



Oh jebus I'm gladded I asked! So you are saying that if I want recording ability I must buy the Japanese model? But aren't the menus on the Japanese models only in Japanese characters?
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 3:11 AM Post #11 of 21

Jackboot

New Head-Fier
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Posts
23
Likes
0
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrFaust /img/forum/go_quote.gif
you need an iRiver H120 or H140. There is a custom version of Rockbox made just for this instance. for more info on this, go to Taperssection.com - Index <- a wealth of information!!! Be sure the check out Church Audio. Chris made me an awesome stealth mic setup using a pair of Grado SR-60's a couple years ago. And now he has even better and much much MUCH smaller mics. He is always running specials on pre-amp/mic combos.


Thanks for the suggestion. I've looked at the H120/140 in the past but at the moment I'm only looking at flash based players. I also have my 10+ year old core sound stealth binaural mics that I'm still happy with
smily_headphones1.gif
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 3:31 AM Post #12 of 21

Jackboot

New Head-Fier
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Posts
23
Likes
0
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jalo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Well it depends on how you define dedicated recording device, but I recently purchase a Sony PCM-D50 digital recorder to use as a music player and it has everything on your list and more. First of all it has an excellent built in mic set up with mini external mic-in option. It can record 22/16, 22/24, 44/16, 44/24, 48/16, 48/24, 96/16 and 96/24. It has 4 GB on board memory and a memory card slot that will take memory stick pro duo and hg duo. It records in wav format and can play wav and mp3 format. What is more impressive is that it has optical line in and out in addition to analog line in and out. I can use all of the DAC and amp set up, Ultra Micro Dac and Amp, Predator etc. It is a very fun device to have and I just went to a concert and did some live recording just off the build-in mic in 96/24 set up and it sounded like a professional recordings. Furthermore, the simple usb connection with your computer make it so easy to copy you recordings to your computer in wav file. It is everything I wanted.


Thanks for the suggestion. I would say that the PCM-D50 is most definitely a dedicated recording device. The reason that I don't want a dedicated recorder is because at the very least the price is significantly higher than a DAP due to the extra recording features which are nice to be sure, but I don't need/want them. The PCM-D50 is about double the price of the Cowon D2 for example.
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 4:48 AM Post #13 of 21

shigzeo

The Hiss King
Joined
Aug 9, 2006
Posts
12,931
Likes
1,062
yeah, the japanese ones don't seem to have english menus... sorry i keep forgetting about that. japanese models are about 30-40% more expensive. however: it and an external small sp amp and my mic and bass roll off can all fit in a pocket and looks like im groving to music (in the middle of a concert).
 
Jul 28, 2008 at 5:59 AM Post #15 of 21

Jackboot

New Head-Fier
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Posts
23
Likes
0
Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif
yeah, the japanese ones don't seem to have english menus... sorry i keep forgetting about that. japanese models are about 30-40% more expensive. however: it and an external small sp amp and my mic and bass roll off can all fit in a pocket and looks like im groving to music (in the middle of a concert).


DANG!!! I thought I had found the perfect DAP
frown.gif
I couldn't handle having only Japanese menus. Thanks for your suggestion, but it looks like I'm back on the hunt!

Who can suggest something like the Sony A729 that has a recording function? I've used the anythingbutipod DAP search but can't find anything that meets my criteria.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top