[thelsuman]

Your advice is appreciated here!...I'm thinking of investing in a setup (thinking around $750 or less for everything). What do you guys think would be a good choice for a bedroom setup in this price range (and relative budget for each system piece to maximize bang for buck)? For any recommendations, please consider that the main source will be my iPod Touch. I've heard that tube amps can work wonders for HP's, but was leaning towards solid state due to my complete inexperience with tubes (frankly I'm intimidated & am concerned about their fragility...don't know if this is justified...but I do have kids under age 5). Can you guys opine on a good combo of:
-Amp (SS or otherwise "kid-friendly"...mobility would be nice)
-DAC (do I need this?)
-Interconnects (I'm guessing the type that plugs into the bottom of iPod?)
-Headphones (I'm torn here... I like the "open" style, but some sound isolation would prob be a good idea for me), should I consider IEPs?

If this has all been previously discussed elsewhere on headfi, please direct me to the right place(s). Much Obliged!

 

[MrSlim]

If you are going to go analog out of the iPOD, then you don't need a DAC.
(and the only way to get digital out of an ipod is via a WADIA 170i, which is about $380 by itself, then you need a DAC, and then an amp.. or a dac with a built in amp.. overly complicated.. ).

Sticking with Solid State:

I'd look around for something like a Firestone Cute Beyond headphone amp ($187.00) (there's one for sale on HF right now that the guy wants $120 for) and you could add an optional "Supplier" power supply if you want a bit better sound ($117.00). This is strictly a desktop amp, the Cute Battery II (which I use with my AKG K601's and it sounds very nice) can be used with its internal battery or with an AC adapter(I've disconnected the battery cable internally so I can keep the AC adapter plugged in permanently). Since the power supply on these things is just 24V, you might even get better sound out of a beafier AC adapter than the one provided with the unit(which is really what the Supplier is in a fancy matching case). They are very nice little amps you can check them out here: Firestone Audio Products, Cute Headphone Amps, Fubar II USB DAC, Spitfire 24 BIt DAC, Big Joe Power Amp, Tube Head Preamp,

You will need a ipod to stereo RCA connector (the above site has them for $77, you can find them cheaper on Ebay) for any amp you buy.

If you are into DIY you could also look at a CK2III kit, which has a great following. There is one onsale on HF that a guy has partially finished, you might need to fix up the case work etc..
Starting from scratch, a CK2III would cost you under $200.
Jeff at Glass Jar Audio used to sell CK2III kits, but their not on his site anymore. you might want to email him and see if he still has any kits left.. http://glassjaraudio.com/main.sc
You can also find one of the builders who could make one for you.. like this guy:
YBM Audio products
The CK2III would run you about $400 from him.. and it would beat most of the commercial products at that price.

I was going to build one, but am building a couple of SOHA's + JISBOS buffers myself (a tube hybrid).


As far as headphones are concerned, I Really like my AKG601's, which you can find for around $250. The 701's have a large following but some people find them very analytical(and very white).. The 702s, are a bit more expensive than the 701's and are a much more subdued colour(black or deep blue). and sound the same as the 701's. They are all "Semi Open" designs, so there is some leakage..

Some people think the 701s are hard to drive(need lots of current), which may also be true of the 601's but I have been very satisfied with how my 601's sound with my Cute Battery II.

so, 300 - 400 for an amp, (less if you DIY or buy used) , around $50 for the cable, and ~ 300 for headphones.. and you'll be set..

 

[thelsuman]

Thanks Mr. Slim for the nice recommendation. That Firestone setup seems perfect for me (based on form factor and FWIR on the product site). Question: Is there a performance/mobility trade-off between the Cute Beyond & the Cute II Battery? They seem to retail for about the same $. I would use this mainly in my bedroom, but the battery option might come in handy.

 

[Brighten]

Quote:

Originally Posted by thelsuman /img/forum/go_quote.gif Your advice is appreciated here!...I'm thinking of investing in a setup (thinking around $750 or less for everything). What do you guys think would be a good choice for a bedroom setup in this price range (and relative budget for each system piece to maximize bang for buck)? For any recommendations, please consider that the main source will be my iPod Touch. I've heard that tube amps can work wonders for HP's, but was leaning towards solid state due to my complete inexperience with tubes (frankly I'm intimidated & am concerned about their fragility...don't know if this is justified...but I do have kids under age 5). Can you guys opine on a good combo of: -Amp (SS or otherwise "kid-friendly"...mobility would be nice) -DAC (do I need this?) -Interconnects (I'm guessing the type that plugs into the bottom of iPod?) -Headphones (I'm torn here... I like the "open" style, but some sound isolation would prob be a good idea for me), should I consider IEPs? If this has all been previously discussed elsewhere on headfi, please direct me to the right place(s). Much Obliged!

What kinds of music do you listen to?

 

[thelsuman]

I listen mostly to classical (baroque), jazz, acoustic, classic rock.

No hip hop/rap, country, & not much R&B, or metal.

 

[Acrog]

I'd check out headroom to get started in head-fi. They have great product information on their site. The k701/2 will go good with instrumental music.

 

[Deiz]

MrSlim makes some good recommendations. Personally, I would pick up a line-out dock for $10-15 off of eBay, and find a mini-to-RCA or mini-to-mini cable elsewhere, for much less than $77 total.

Given your price limit, you have a ton of options. Given your circumstances, however, you're somewhat limited.

Harder to drive headphones often struggle when fed by lower-power mobile amplifiers, so the surest way to drive a headphone well is with a good desktop amp, but there goes your portability. Using an iPod as a source, it's obviously ideal to have a portable amp because then you can cart it around with you, if you choose to.

For an absolutely killer portable amplifier, I'd choose a Mini^3 built by a DIYer or commercial builder, the lowest cost I know of is $115 plus shipping. Fairly high output for a portable, and virtually no mark-up on the price I mentioned there.

As for headphones.. That's tough. Grados do rock very well, Sennheisers are generally all-rounders but really shine with classical. However, all Grados and upper-end Sennheisers are open - And if you don't necessarily want to be disturbed, a closed headphone with modest isolation could be your ticket to audio bliss.

I can't help too much with closed headphones, the only ones I have are exceedingly bassy which is something you may not want. I've heard good things about the Denon D2000. It's fairly even, despite a bit of treble wonkiness.

Ultimately, what I just mentioned would set you back roughly $12 for a cheap line-out dock, $5-30 for a mini-to-mini cable, depending on where you look, $115 for a Mini^3 and $240 for the D2000s. That's a bit under $400 total. I think it makes sense to start at a sane level, price-wise, and if you enjoy the hobby and want to continue adventuring, you can spend more.

 

[jinp6301]

Line Out Dock with RCA outputs - $20 - $50 (try not to pay more then that)
M^3 w/ elpac prebuilt from Rockhopper - $375
Sennheiser HD-580/600 - $150 - $300 depending on new/used and model

Hope this helps

 

[MrSlim]

Regarding your Cute Battery II vs Beyond question.. From what I have read, the difference is mainly in the output driver. The Battery II runs in class AB mode and the Beyond runs in Class A. Theoretically, Class A "should" sound better than Class AB, and the Firestone site does mention something about the differences in Sound (see www.firestone-audio.com). I thought about the possibility of using it as a portable too, when I bought the Battery II vs the Beyond, but it hasn't moved from my desk at work yet, and I ended up unplugging the internal battery cable so that I could leave it plugged in all the time (the mfr suggests that you should not have the unit charging for more than 12 hrs at a time, so removing the battery cable relieves that issue, except that I get a power blip when I turn it off(and like to remove my headphones before I turn it off)).. If you want to try your hand at opamp rolling (swapping opamps for different/better sound) you can do it with both units..
Something else that might be intriguing in that vein, although I'm not sure if it would fit or not, would be to see what one of the HDAM (from audio-gd, do a search for it on HF) modules would do in one of the Cute Amps. They are basically discrete opamps, to replace exisiting single or dual opamps.. People are using them in various devices with excllent results. And they're not that much more expensive than some of the high end opamps..

I'm going to re-iterate my suggestion of the AKG K601's again, particularly considering your music preferences, which are similar to mine. My previous headphones ( call me old fashioned, but I can't use the word "cans" ) were Grado SR-60's which were a great introduction to the headphone world.. but they were so damn uncomfortable.... and all the Grados are based on the same design. the K601s are a dream to wear. I can't comment on the Denons, I've heard good things about them on HF, but I'm partial to the open design of the AKGs' vs a closed back system.

 

[MikeW]

Compass DAC/AMP combo /w Denon D5000, and some good interconnects.

Head Direct EF-1 + Denon D2000 + Stock Zero, or Valab

Kicas AMP + Denon D2000 + Zero or Valab

Another Option... /w power protection

Compass DAC/AMP Combo /w Denon D2000 and PS Audio Duet. Still leaves money for some blue jeans interconnects..

You can replace the Denon with any 250$ headphone that suit's your taste.

There's also Little Dot amps to look at..

I'd go with the Head-Direct, D2000 and Valab, but I might be slightly biased

Edit: I see you wanted to use the Ipod as your source, frankly that just won't do. The output of that device will always be a huge limitation, get a 40$ dvd player with Digital Output and hook it up to a dac. Fancy headphones and amp's are a total waste of money if you plan to keep using that ipod for output. Now, you may want to get an AMP and Headphones now, and then later get a DAC + Transport, but it's essential step if you want audiophile quality. You could spend 1000$ on an amp and 500$ on headphones, and with an ipod as the source, a Compass + Cheap Transport + 200$ headphone will destroy it in sound quality at half the price.

 

[scytheavatar]

For your genres, I think the most idiot proof combination is the HD600/HD650 with the modded Zero DAC. No nonsense, very popular, very good value for money.

 

[tintin47]

I am another vote from the CK2III or M^3 crowd. Good amps. I would say x2 for the Zero DAC and then HD600s. They are hands down the best all around can I've heard. You can't go wrong with them.

 

[Brighten]

A used tube amp that has a nice power supply and a pair of HD-600s may be what you are looking for. Get the DAC later down the road.

 

[thelsuman]

Thanks everyone for the advice. I'm now leaning towards the Zero DAC (modded with HDAM)...perhaps this one: (ebay item #330298826261 from biglawhk...$220) & some used Senn HD600's. I also like the idea of using a CD transport...maybe a Marantz CD5001, if one can be found. I guess the best thing would be to connect the CD player to the Zero DAC using an optical connect & maybe use the Zero's coax input for the iPod??? Does this sound about right?

 

[paaj]

If you do get the Marantz or any other decent CD player, forget about the DAC for now and see how it does. Within this budget I don't think it's usefull to pay for and a good CD player and an upgrade DAC. either get a CD player, or go the PC->DAC route.

HD600 is a good start. Certainly the safest choice. Of course, you could also look at any of the other 'big three', the DT880, K701 or SR325i depending on taste.

If you want to keep it portable with the iTouch, you have to make a choice about amping, as a desktop amp will give you better sound for the money but you can't take it with you.
A hornet does ok with a HD650 btw, not great but no real need to worry either, and the HD650 is not really portable anyway. Something like a predator/pico/coming iQube2 are expensive, but both DAC and amp and portable.

Oh.. and you can't connect your iPod digitally to a DAC without something like the iTransport. I assume you have something like a pc/mac, these do connect digitally to a DAC.
and maybe you have a speaker amp/receiver with headphone out you can use?