[rickcr42]

Quote:

buying grado directly from the Us would be cheap in comparassion the RS1 costs about 1300USD (!!) here...

hell for that price you could fly over here and pick it up yourself !

 

[danlaix]

I know its unrelated but, would a Meta42 with the
4556AD opamp produce anything close to the RA-1
or the clone?

 

[rickcr42]

not really-following the opamp (already with 70ma of output current) with a buffer inserts the sound of the buffer into the equation in a big way though some of the inherent sound would still come through

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally posted by rickcr42 You would feel better if the opamp cost $20.00 per ? Everytime someone checks the opamp price they flip out and think the amp is a rip off. Did anyone consider how many opamps were tested prior to Grado Labs selecting the $0.29 part ?

Did you know if in fact they had tested that many parts for sure??? IMO is better to be sure of one thing before concluding this, I have seen so many projects made just for funny, and ended on very well know pieces of technology later, and absolutelly NO TESTING OR D & R WAS INVOLVED, ON IT, OTOH many pieces that have being tested to be tired, do not offer that good sound that the RA-1 claimed to give....

 

[rickcr42]

if no testing or research were done then they ripped off someone elses work !

Simple

there are no free lunches and information has to come from somewhere

either you do your own or let another do it but the background is and must be done

you think they just pumped in a simple figure like 70 ma opamp into google and came up with an obscure part ?

yeah ,and pigs fly

 

[Excalibur]

The main issue is not how much research and testing went into this product. It's "the price the market will bare". Grado has been selling this thing for years at around $350.00 because people are still paying it...worth it or not.

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally posted by rickcr42 if no testing or research were done then they ripped off someone elses work ! Simple there are no free lunches and information has to come from somewhere either you do your own or let another do it but the background is and must be done you think they just pumped in a simple figure like 70 ma opamp into google and came up with an obscure part ? yeah ,and pigs fly

Maybe they rip off another job who knows, this is a posibility also, and real, if fact this is a simple diagram, that could be taken from any electronic book, the rest maybe they try a few, but for sure was not as extense as you pretend it to be, OK, after that, let's assumed they try 100 OPAmps, do you really belive that this amp will be worth 350.00 for let's say, 10 years or more. IMHO of course not...

 

[Excalibur]

This looks like an RA-1 spinoff based on the partls list...

http://www.geocities.com/dip16amp/

 

[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally posted by Excalibur This looks like an RA-1 spinoff based on the partls list... http://www.geocities.com/dip16amp/

That's a really cool site! Thanks for the link.

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sovkiller Maybe they rip off another job who knows, this is a posibility also, and real, if fact this is a simple diagram, that could be taken from any electronic book, the rest maybe they try a few, but for sure was not as extense as you pretend it to be, OK, after that, let's assumed they try 100 OPAmps, do you really belive that this amp will be worth 350.00 for let's say, 10 years or more. IMHO of course not...

I have to agree... as much as some people would like to believe some magic about this amp, or hundreds of hours of R&D or whatever (LOL)... I had the chance to look at and handle the RA-1 at a recent meet. Cheeeeeeap RCA plugs on the back, cheap headphone jack, cheap volume pot... only the case was made of wood (and since when is wood expensive, really?).

Can someone convince me that part of the "voicing" of this amp was using cheapo RCA jacks (they really felt like tin foil, my sound card has infinitely better RCA jacks) and el-cheapo pot? B.S...

 

[rickcr42]

Quote:

Maybe they rip off another job who knows

you are relentless ,I gotta give you that man

So what other known headphone amp or hell , even product touts this part

as for the circuit

you know another way to do it ?

EVERY SINGLE OPAMP BASED DESIGN USES THE SAME BASIC TECHNOLOGY

inverting buffer or gain stage

non-inverting buffer or gain stage

you can bias to class A , throw a buffer on the output , add a discrete current stage,filter it,bypass it,servo it

But it still must be used for what it is !

and I don't know where you grew up but around here folks expect to get paid for service rendered

Hire a technician

he wants to get paid

Hire an assembly line worker ,holy cow same thing !

Rent ,power ,R&D equipment ,assembly equipment,quality control testing,shipping,advertising,power lunches to broker deals (yes,how business is done) , workmans comp,insurance for workewrs,insurance for the facility,insurance for the stock

hell i could go on all day

And do not for a moment think that Grado Labs gets $350.00 per amp shipped !

Dealer markup is HUGE on all electronics

Somewhere around 150%


but hey-they also incur cost

especially for products purchased that do not sell-you make it up elsewhere

Hey,no sweat off my behind who does and does not purchase a product . Each commercial offering should stand on the merits

But it comes as damn weird how you never heard much negative about this particular amp until it was reverse engineered and the opamp , the "heart' of the unit , did not turn out to be some highly sought after unobtainable exotic mil spec part

time for a damn reality check

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally posted by rickcr42 time for a damn reality check

Yes it is... if you really think this amp is worth $350, I have two bridges I'd like to sell you (one in New York, one in San Francisco). Let's negotiate... it's an investment, man. You can charge people tolls and get rich. I take Paypal, too... just let me know which one you want, and I'll transfer the deed to you....

 

[rickcr42]

if the opamp inside had no markings and you went solely on design and sound would you still make that statement ?

if yes and that is an honest answer then fine

but a lot of respected reviewers liked the amp and at the price thought it a bargain

should they be selling at K-mart for $85 ?

NO ONE WOULD BUY THEM !

And if they did would proceed to rip it up and mod it !

They would KNOW it sounded OK but would be embarrased to tout it to audio buddies for fear of being mocked

"here comes nummy with his little toy cd player and k-mart amp"


"hey nummy ! what next dude ? Soup can headphones ?"

Again ,you don't like it friggin fine.

Grado will not go out of business any time soon

but just because there is a crapload of amp and part info flying around here don't for a minute think you could go out into the world of audio design for profit and do better without copying previously established designs

only the truly great ones have the spark that allows them to leap ahead and do a truly new thing

the rest of us just tinker and copy

rick out

 

[Spent&Bent]

Quote:

Originally posted by Spent&Bent Barging in on the discussion, but how easy is it to open the casing? I am getting an original RA-1 that needs some internal work.

nobody ever opened this?

Quote:

Originally posted by fewtch I have to agree... as much as some people would like to believe some magic about this amp, or hundreds of hours of R&D or whatever (LOL)... I had the chance to look at and handle the RA-1 at a recent meet. Cheeeeeeap RCA plugs on the back, cheap headphone jack, cheap volume pot... only the case was made of wood (and since when is wood expensive, really?). Can someone convince me that part of the "voicing" of this amp was using cheapo RCA jacks (they really felt like tin foil, my sound card has infinitely better RCA jacks) and el-cheapo pot? B.S...

Obviously you are different to me, I enjoy what equipment gives to me, not what the assumed profit / costs / parts etc. may be.
I myself do not care for this.... total value exceeds the sum of it's parts, maybe just like head-fi is.

And speaking of water and bridges... your arguments are just more water under a bridge to me....

 

[rickcr42]

kinda missed the case opening thing man....one track mind and the tunnel vision y'know

the guy that reverse engined the amp obviously had to remove it first and according to memory (posted at headwize,maybe do a search) he stated it was a real bear to take apart and the case was damged in the process

but since his goal was getting the story of the amp maybe he was not as gentle as could be

By taking a little TLC i think it is a do-able thing .Take your time and think each step through-decide what is press fit/glued/bolted and proceed with the appropriate tool

in my humble opinion " Anything that can be made can be un-made"

just ask my wife about all the "I'm gonna fix it " parts strewn all over the joint