[Eudoxa]

Hello Head-Fi,
I'm hoping someone can answer my questions regarding the Cowon J3 and UM Miracles, output impedance, and amps/attenuators. Please treat me well.

I've read that the J3 has an output impedance of ~2 ohms while the Miracles has an output impedance of ~16. The formula for damping is "headphone impedance/source impedance" which gives a damping factor of ~8 for this particular combo.  I've read that is pretty bad and will result in distortions of all kinds when using them.  Can someone explain what a good damping factor for portable headphones is and how to remedy this?

I currently have a J3 + W4 setup.  I've noticed that the sound seems to change on me occasionally, but I thought it was just me "feeling for something different".  Is this phenomenon accurate in describing the distortions?  Given that 31(W4)/2(J3)= 15.5 damping, is this a poor combination?

How do amps and attenuators factor in to the overall equation?

Finally, why is the J3 such a revered dap when it has such a high output impedance leading to a poor damping factor with the generally low impedance portable headphones/iems?

---
Ultimately, I want to know whether or not getting a clip+/clipZip would be the solution to this problem, but I'd like to learn as much as I can about this issue if anyone would be so inclined to explain.  I'm reading about it on this forum but its going to take some time to understand it so I'm hoping I can get some direct answers both for immediate gratification and as reference for working out something is a good idea.

Thanks in advance.

 

[zenpunk]

To be honest I wouldn't loose sleep over it. There is a lot of misinformation around that get repeated by people with limited  understanding. It is not to say that in some cases having  a low z is better but I have heard quite few amps with relatively high output impedance that sounded noticeably better than some with Z close to 0 Ohms.

 

[proton007]

Take a look at the thread link below, hope it can help.

 

[FlatNine]

Quote:

Hello Head-Fi,
I'm hoping someone can answer my questions regarding the Cowon J3 and UM Miracles, output impedance, and amps/attenuators. Please treat me well.

I've read that the J3 has an output impedance of ~2 ohms while the Miracles has an output impedance of ~16. The formula for damping is "headphone impedance/source impedance" which gives a damping factor of ~8 for this particular combo.  I've read that is pretty bad and will result in distortions of all kinds when using them.  Can someone explain what a good damping factor for portable headphones is and how to remedy this?

I currently have a J3 + W4 setup.  I've noticed that the sound seems to change on me occasionally, but I thought it was just me "feeling for something different".  Is this phenomenon accurate in describing the distortions?  Given that 31(W4)/2(J3)= 15.5 damping, is this a poor combination?

How do amps and attenuators factor in to the overall equation?

Finally, why is the J3 such a revered dap when it has such a high output impedance leading to a poor damping factor with the generally low impedance portable headphones/iems?

---
Ultimately, I want to know whether or not getting a clip+/clipZip would be the solution to this problem, but I'd like to learn as much as I can about this issue if anyone would be so inclined to explain.  I'm reading about it on this forum but its going to take some time to understand it so I'm hoping I can get some direct answers both for immediate gratification and as reference for working out something is a good idea.

Thanks in advance.

 
I would let your musical enjoyment and experience here reign supreme. Many years ago, I went to school for electrical engineering. About 22 years ago, I moved into the software field and never looked back, although I did retain much of the EE stuff. Unless you really enjoy the tech specs, don't go too deep. When you buy a car, do you compare the endless tech specs? Probably not. Some are downright misleading anyway. Instead, you drive it and consider things like, fun factor, comfort, appearance, reliability, etc. When you find a car you really like, I'd bet you'd probably buy it - even if the specs are not as good as another car you considered. Same rules apply here - if I read somewhere that my beloved Sennheiser HD-650's had some very poor spec, you know what I'd do? Not a damn thing because I love the way they sound!
 
Enjoy your journey, and yes, the research is part of the fun. Just let your ears have the final say.  Cheers!

 

[Eudoxa]

As a budding computer scientist, I might be interested in comparing tech specs endlessly

.
 
My reason for wanting to try the clip+/zip ultimately is because I find that I'm always bouncing back and forth between satisfied and unsatisfied with my J3 + W4 combo and I'd like to find out why and find a solution.  The ambiguity of audio versus the specificity of computer science simultaneously annoys me and intrigues me greatly.
 
I probably will buy a clip sooner or later and indeed let my ears have the final say but I'd like to find some hint of an explanation as to why I enjoy something over another without the use of such vague/hard-to-understand-unless-you've-heard-it terminology and concepts.  However, I think this is an impossibility...

and

(this is my intrigued face).
 
I guess this is the life of hi-fi enthusiasts?
 
Anyways, thanks for the responses.

 

[FlatNine]

Quote:

As a budding computer scientist, I might be interested in comparing tech specs endlessly

.
 
My reason for wanting to try the clip+/zip ultimately is because I find that I'm always bouncing back and forth between satisfied and unsatisfied with my J3 + W4 combo and I'd like to find out why and find a solution.  The ambiguity of audio versus the specificity of computer science simultaneously annoys me and intrigues me greatly.
 
I probably will buy a clip sooner or later and indeed let my ears have the final say but I'd like to find some hint of an explanation as to why I enjoy something over another without the use of such vague/hard-to-understand-unless-you've-heard-it terminology and concepts.  However, I think this is an impossibility...

and

(this is my intrigued face).
 
I guess this is the life of hi-fi enthusiasts?
 
Anyways, thanks for the responses.

 
You're right on and I agree - I don't think any spec exists that can quantify things like sound stage. And yes - this is part of the life. Another part is spending a lot of money. But the best part is finding that combo that works for *you* and makes *you* happy, often in spite of lousy tech specs.