[Acidicfriend]

I got a portable tube-amp for myself today! I really like it, however, I'd also like to use it for my desktop -- the thing is, I only have a dac/amp combo for my desktop - if I start with my dac/amp, then input that into the tube, then out the headphones, will that effectively give me the tube-sound? or is that a backwards way of doing that?

 

[PointyFox]

That should work and possibly give you even more of a tube sound.

 

[Acidicfriend]

That should work and possibly give you even more of a tube sound.

Oh great to hear!!!

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I got a portable tube-amp for myself today! I really like it, however, I'd also like to use it for my desktop -- the thing is, I only have a dac/amp combo for my desktop - if I start with my dac/amp, then input that into the tube, then out the headphones, will that effectively give me the tube-sound? or is that a backwards way of doing that?

If your desktop DAC-HPamp has a line out function then you can send its DAC's signal to the portable "tube" amp.

 

[PaganDL]

I got a portable tube-amp for myself today! I really like it, however, I'd also like to use it for my desktop -- the thing is, I only have a dac/amp combo for my desktop - if I start with my dac/amp, then input that into the tube, then out the headphones, will that effectively give me the tube-sound? or is that a backwards way of doing that?

Hi @Acidicfriend,

Yes, connecting things the way you described will give you tube sound, especially as @ProtegeManiac pointed out if you have a line out on that tube amp.
It will also work if you use the head out on the tube amp as well.
The important thing to consider is how you want things to sound from your source, certainly having a dac/amp (which one would also be good to know), as the 'in between hopefully gives you a better sound to begin with before adding the tube.
By the way, what tube amp do you have, you never mentioned.

Hope you have a great day !

 

[Acidicfriend]

Hi @Acidicfriend,

Yes, connecting things the way you described will give you tube sound, especially as @ProtegeManiac pointed out if you have a line out on that tube amp.
It will also work if you use the head out on the tube amp as well.
The important thing to consider is how you want things to sound from your source, certainly having a dac/amp (which one would also be good to know), as the 'in between hopefully gives you a better sound to begin with before adding the tube.
By the way, what tube amp do you have, you never mentioned.

Hope you have a great day !

I have the JDS labs element dac/amp and the little bear version 2 tube amp !!!

 

[PaganDL]

Hi @Acidicfriend,

Unfortunately don't have either amp you mentioned so can't comment beyond that but as @ProtegeManiac & I have already stated, as long as both amps or any amp, for that matter, either have a dedicated line out &/or good head out, you should be more than fine.

Hope you have a great day !

 

[PurpleAngel]

I got a portable tube-amp for myself today! I really like it, however, I'd also like to use it for my desktop -- the thing is, I only have a dac/amp combo for my desktop - if I start with my dac/amp, then input that into the tube, then out the headphones, will that effectively give me the tube-sound? or is that a backwards way of doing that?

What are the make and model of the DACs and head amps?
So your double amping?
Not really the best type of connections to use
If the DAC/amp comes with a separate line-output (RCA or 3.5mm), the line-output is what you would want to connect to the tube amp.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I have the JDS labs element dac/amp and the little bear version 2 tube amp !!!

That one has a 2.1V output. It might be controlled by the preamp but since 2.1V is the max output you can just set it to max volume so you still get a 2.0V-ish output to the "tube" amp.

The question though is "why." If that's a portable amp, it's not really even a true tube amp, it's a hybrid amp. No way current battery tech and power supply circuit that small can generate the kind of voltage that driver tubes need, so you have at best rectifier tubes controlling the signal that gets to op-amps in the output stage. If the Element's output is preamp controlled, even with 2.1V max, you just end up with two preamps in one chain...and then the output stage can't match the Element's power output stage in output power nor THD+N performance. It could go louder sooner but that's just the gain, so if you put something really hard to drive on it, crank it up more and you'd just clip the signal anyway, not to mention higher noise on higher gain tubes.

 

[Acidicfriend]

That one has a 2.1V output. It might be controlled by the preamp but since 2.1V is the max output you can just set it to max volume so you still get a 2.0V-ish output to the "tube" amp.
The question though is "why." If that's a portable amp, it's not really even a true tube amp, it's a hybrid amp. No way current battery tech and power supply circuit that small can generate the kind of voltage that driver tubes need, so you have at best rectifier tubes controlling the signal that gets to op-amps in the output stage. If the Element's output is preamp controlled, even with 2.1V max, you just end up with two preamps in one chain...and then the output stage can't match the Element's power output stage in output power nor THD+N performance. It could go louder sooner but that's just the gain, so if you put something really hard to drive on it, crank it up more and you'd just clip the signal anyway, not to mention higher noise on higher gain tubes.

I just wanted to try out the 'tube sound' -- not sure of the logistics of it nor the difference between a full-blown tube amp and my hybrid tube amp! As long as it sounds fun coming out the amp I have purchased, which I feel like it really does, I can't complain. My question stems from the necessity of a DAC, is a DAC necessary for what I'm looking for? I just ordered a FiiO Q5 portable amp, not sure that solves anything you're trying to say, however.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

I just wanted to try out the 'tube sound' -- not sure of the logistics of it nor the difference between a full-blown tube amp and my hybrid tube amp!

I actually explained much of that in my previous post.

Pure tube amplifiers only use tube components in handling the signal - tube rectifier (preamp) to boost the incoming signal and driver (power) tubes to amplify that line signal into something that will drive a transducer, like headphones or speakers. This needs a lot of voltage, and even on things that won't run on a battery, a proper power supply design has to be there to heat the tubes and run them at the their best operating voltage. Look at pure tube amps and note those huge boxes sticking out near the tubes. Those are power transformers. Some have three - one for the preamp stage and one each for the amplification stage channels. A battery is an even bigger problem. Thus hybrid tube amps allow for some tube coloration by using a tube preamp stage and then feeding that into a solid state output stage.

And in your specific case not only is it a hybrid and not full tube, but you're getting less power and more noise (if not also higher distortion) over what you'd get out of the JDS Element's amp circuit. That's why I was asking "why."

My question stems from the necessity of a DAC, is a DAC necessary for what I'm looking for?

I also tackled this in my prior posts.

If the JDS Element's RCA outputs are not controlled by its preamp, then no, you don't even need another DAC, just hook up the RCA outputs on the Element to the input on your hybrid portable amp. And even if it was controlled by its preamp stage all you have to do is set it to max. If there's noise audible to you then get a separate DAC.

I just ordered a FiiO Q5 portable amp, not sure that solves anything you're trying to say, however.

You just spent a whole lot of money on gear that will only double up what the Element can do (other than if there's any audible noise added by the Element's output being controlled by its active preamp). I mean sure the Q5 has a line out but it has a powerful amp stage built in. You're basically just accumulating equipment without getting what you really need.

I mean if you really want to just hear real tube sound and you don't specifically need to be able to do so on a portable system (since you're trying your current hybrid amp on the Element) you could have put the funds that went to the Q5 and what you can sell the hybrid portable amp and the Element towards a transformer-coupled tube amp like the WooAudio WA6 (plus an inexpensive 2V output desktop DAC). The WA6 looks expensive but the Q5 is already half its price; sell the Element and the hybrid amp and you'd be almost there.

 

[Acidicfriend]

I actually explained much of that in my previous post.

Pure tube amplifiers only use tube components in handling the signal - tube rectifier (preamp) to boost the incoming signal and driver (power) tubes to amplify that line signal into something that will drive a transducer, like headphones or speakers. This needs a lot of voltage, and even on things that won't run on a battery, a proper power supply design has to be there to heat the tubes and run them at the their best operating voltage. Look at pure tube amps and note those huge boxes sticking out near the tubes. Those are power transformers. Some have three - one for the preamp stage and one each for the amplification stage channels. A battery is an even bigger problem. Thus hybrid tube amps allow for some tube coloration by using a tube preamp stage and then feeding that into a solid state output stage.

And in your specific case not only is it a hybrid and not full tube, but you're getting less power and more noise (if not also higher distortion) over what you'd get out of the JDS Element's amp circuit. That's why I was asking "why."




I also tackled this in my prior posts.

If the JDS Element's RCA outputs are not controlled by its preamp, then no, you don't even need another DAC, just hook up the RCA outputs on the Element to the input on your hybrid portable amp. And even if it was controlled by its preamp stage all you have to do is set it to max. If there's noise audible to you then get a separate DAC.





You just spent a whole lot of money on gear that will only double up what the Element can do (other than if there's any audible noise added by the Element's output being controlled by its active preamp). I mean sure the Q5 has a line out but it has a powerful amp stage built in. You're basically just accumulating equipment without getting what you really need.

I mean if you really want to just hear real tube sound and you don't specifically need to be able to do so on a portable system (since you're trying your current hybrid amp on the Element) you could have put the funds that went to the Q5 and what you can sell the hybrid portable amp and the Element towards a transformer-coupled tube amp like the WooAudio WA6 (plus an inexpensive 2V output desktop DAC). The WA6 looks expensive but the Q5 is already half its price; sell the Element and the hybrid amp and you'd be almost there.

Really the fiio q5 wasn't bought just for better tube sound outta my little bear. Purity aside, as long as the little bear sounds okay and fun as a hybrid amp, I'm decently happy with my purchase. If i sold my element I wouldn't have a clean audio out for mixing and referencing on my desktop.

But hey, maybe i return the fiio after a few tests and spend half the cash for the wa6, could u rec a decently cheap dac?

 

[ProtegeManiac]

But hey, maybe i return the fiio after a few tests and spend half the cash for the wa6, could u rec a decently cheap dac?

ODAC Rev B