[onitafmw55]

I have a question, maybe it's been answered (if so direct me to where I can find the answer), maybe it's a silly question.  But I'd rather ask it and end up coming across like a fool, than constantly be curious and wondering. 

I love headphones but I have trained my ears over the years to listen louder and louder and louder.  It's to the point now where I listen to a Fiio X3 2nd gen on high gain at 100-120 steps almost always.  My hearing at least at 32 is still very good, my yearly ear doctor always passes me.  I hear fine for now anyway. 

I love to listen loud, I can't go back.  I just don't have fun going quiet.  But headphones are not all equal.  Some will clip/distort and I feel like it is 100% due to the fact that they can't handle the volume.  Too much.  They clip/distort before getting to the volume I prefer.  When a headphone does that, it's basically useless to me.  I've returned so many headphones because of clipping/distortion. 

So my question is....is there anyway to know if a headphone can handle loud volumes before buying them, so I don't always have to return them.  It's fatiguing to return a headphone all the time.  It's even got me banned at a few stores.  Too many returns.  I know specs aren't always accurate but is there some spec that would tell me, this can go loud. 

To give you a few examples of headphones I had that distort at loud volumes that I use:
Beyerdynamic DT770 80 ohm
Beyerdynamic DT990 250 ohm (yes I used an amp)
Beyerdynamic Custom One Pro Plus
Philips Fidelio X1
Bose QC25

To give you a few examples of headphones I had, that do not distort at loud volumes I use:
Audio Technica M50X
Audio Technica AD700X
Sony MDR-V6
Sennheiser Urbanite On-Ear
Beats Solo 2

 I do feel that higher end headphones seem to distort more than lower end.  That over ear headphones distort more than on ear or earphones.  It could just have been a coincidence though. 

So is there anyway to know before buying, if a headphone can get loud enough?  Any technical specs way or anything to help.  If so, please let me know.  Also why is it, some headphones get loud while others seemingly distort.  Is it just the way the companies design it. 

Thanks for the help.

 

 

[jodgey4]

As the human ear gets louder, you more easily hear bass and treble. Does the idea of a v-shaped headphones appeal to you? It would mimic the same intensity of a normal headphone at a higher volume. The DT770 and DT990 are V-shaped (higher bass and treble).
 
If you're a basshead, look into the JVC SZ-2000.

 

[DrKC]

I would hazard a guess that your amp runs out of steam/distorts in some of the cases you site.  A good amp with wide rails and output voltage swing will rarely distort when paired with a good pair of Hi-Z phones.  If you have a good amp, take a look at some of the planar phones.  These usually can soak/handle more power than traditional phones.

 

[jodgey4]

Planars also take much more current to get loud, so most benefits would be lost. The Fiio E12 and Cayin C5 are powerful portable amps, FWIW.

 

[DrKC]

  Planars also take much more current to get loud, so most benefits would be lost. The Fiio E12 and Cayin C5 are powerful portable amps, FWIW.

Well, that's a vague generality that certainly doesn't apply across the board.  And as I prefaced my statement with "if you already have a good amp", current wouldn't be an issue, now would it?  You need to do little homework, as all planars do not require copious amounts of current to achieve a high SPL value.

 

[jodgey4]

 

[onitafmw55]

Thanks for the replies. 

I did a little spec checking.  I know that two of the most important parts of how loud a headphone can go is ohms and spl.  Lower the ohms, higher the spl, louder a headphone should get if the specs are actually correct. 

I think my issue lies with Maximum Input Power.  I looked up all the Max Input power ratings that I could find (some aren't listed on the box or on any site info) and every headphone I had that distorted too soon had a low mW and every headphone that I had that did not, had a high one.  The lowest mW that I had that did not distort on me (at my volumes) was the Audio Technica AD700X which was 700mw.

I know there is more to it....the ohm/spl deal and all that.  But I do listen to headphones very loudly and I run into the distortion problem all the time.  With or without an amp.  I have a Cayin C5 amp, my players are the Fiio X3 II and the Cowon Z2.  I'm not an electrician but if I hit the maximum loudness my headphone will handle before distorting with a regular audio player, isn't an amp irrelevant at that point.

I think I should look into the Planar Magnetics.  The HifiMan's are 6W or 6000mW.  If Max Input Power (or lack thereof) is my problem.  Those have plenty to spare.  The highest mW headphone I have is 3500mW (Audio Technica ATH-Pro700mk2) which is a Dynamic Driver. 

 

[jodgey4]

Don't forget about sensitivity. That has just as much to do with power consumption as impedance!
 
Planars usually can handle more power, yes. But they're also much less sensitive.
 
The "mW" rating on a can is practically useless. My Q701's say no more than like 100mW but that's total nonsense without more info. What frequency? For how long? Or is that DC burst?

 

[onitafmw55]

  Don't forget about sensitivity. That has just as much to do with power consumption as impedance!
 
Planars usually can handle more power, yes. But they're also much less sensitive.
 
The "mW" rating on a can is practically useless. My Q701's say no more than like 100mW but that's total nonsense without more info. What frequency? For how long? Or is that DC burst?

SPL is sensitivity, no?  Absolutely it matters.  But I have one headphone that is rated 500mW and it is just barely distorting at my preferred volume (just a tad though), another that is 700mW and to my ears, it is not distorting at all.  While anything I've ever had less than 500mW has been too distorted for me.  I just have a hard to believing it is practically useless.  I understand other things factor in though

Funny enough, I wanted a Q701.  But...100mW rating now has me turned off.

 

 

[jodgey4]

My Q701's get loud pretty fine, was my point. SPL is not sensitivity. dB/mW is sensitivity.

 

[onitafmw55]

My Q701's get loud pretty fine, was my point. SPL is not sensitivity. dB/mW is sensitivity.

ok I'm sorry, I'm learning.  Everyone's opinion of "loud" varies.  That's the problem. 

 

[jodgey4]

Well, these are numbers you can measure, so I wouldn't say opinion

.

 

[onitafmw55]

Well, these are numbers you can measure, so I wouldn't say opinion .

Thats true and as far as measurements go, I agree. But what I mean is, if we had the same players, same headphones. Say you listen at 60/100 and to you that is loud and I listen to 95/100 and to me that is loud. Our opinions or perhaps a better word is preferences of what is loud is different. That is why it is hard to measure these things. You can to some degree, but only so far. Some players are louder than others, some headphones are louder than others and some people listen at louder volumes than others. Alot of real world factors that specs cant completely answer away. They can be a good guide though.

My goal with this post was to see if there was a way to know how loud a headphone can go before it reaches its limit and clips/distorts. Your info is valid. I have my very unproven max input theory. But truth be told, I'm no closer to a certain answer. Maybe there isnt a certain answer. But I am learning some things at least.

Thanks for the help/discussion

 

[jodgey4]

I think what you said makes a lot of sense . Whatever you end up with, just be careful with your ears!

 

[Redcarmoose]

I have a question, maybe it's been answered (if so direct me to where I can find the answer), maybe it's a silly question.  But I'd rather ask it and end up coming across like a fool, than constantly be curious and wondering. 


I love headphones but I have trained my ears over the years to listen louder and louder and louder.  It's to the point now where I listen to a Fiio X3 2nd gen on high gain at 100-120 steps almost always.  My hearing at least at 32 is still very good, my yearly ear doctor always passes me.  I hear fine for now anyway. 


I love to listen loud, I can't go back.  I just don't have fun going quiet.  But headphones are not all equal.  Some will clip/distort and I feel like it is 100% due to the fact that they can't handle the volume.  Too much.  They clip/distort before getting to the volume I prefer.  When a headphone does that, it's basically useless to me.  I've returned so many headphones because of clipping/distortion. 


So my question is....is there anyway to know if a headphone can handle loud volumes before buying them, so I don't always have to return them.  It's fatiguing to return a headphone all the time.  It's even got me banned at a few stores.  Too many returns.  I know specs aren't always accurate but is there some spec that would tell me, this can go loud. 


To give you a few examples of headphones I had that distort at loud volumes that I use:

Beyerdynamic DT770 80 ohm

Beyerdynamic DT990 250 ohm (yes I used an amp)

Beyerdynamic Custom One Pro Plus

Philips Fidelio X1

Bose QC25


To give you a few examples of headphones I had, that do not distort at loud volumes I use:

Audio Technica M50X

Audio Technica AD700X

Sony MDR-V6

Sennheiser Urbanite On-Ear

Beats Solo 2


 I do feel that higher end headphones seem to distort more than lower end.  That over ear headphones distort more than on ear or earphones.  It could just have been a coincidence though. 


So is there anyway to know before buying, if a headphone can get loud enough?  Any technical specs way or anything to help.  If so, please let me know.  Also why is it, some headphones get loud while others seemingly distort.  Is it just the way the companies design it. 


Thanks for the help.


 

I have been an extremely loud headphone listener also. Still I'm surprised that you can handle the treble of both the Sony V6 or M50 loud?

Also be careful I started daily loud headphones in 1981 and had tinnitus by 1982.