[ComfyCan]

Can anyone explain, in English, what the difference is between a "Maxout" version of the SuperMacro IV and a standard version? I've read everything on www.Fixup.net, and I'm hopelessly confused. So much information is outdated, or simply above my head.

I am considering one of these jewels as my primary amp since I love the SuperMicro IV, but would like something more durable that I could tweak to match my different phones. (My specific issue is the Micro IV sounds lousy with the GS1000's).

I don't mind buying/trying different opamps later, but I'd like to buy the amp in a state that will permit maximum flexibility--the first time. Given that, does it make more sense to buy one of the 2 "max" versions or stick with the default? (And if so, what's the difference between the 2 "max" configurations?)

Putting aside the very real possibility that Dr. Xin may change the entire design at any time, I'd like to buy what I need from him just once, so I don't have to return it if it turns out it would sound better with "stacked buffers" or something that doesn't come with the stock configuration.

On Dr. Xin's forum, there seem to be two groups of people:
1) those who understand all about tinkering with these amps; and :
2) the clueless.

The people in category one communicate with each other on a very technical level, which is utterly meaningless to the people in category 2.

Sadly, I fall in the later category, and I have a feeling I am in the majority rather than the minority.

I know the usual response is "just buy the default and worry about changing later." That may still be the only reasonable response to my question, but if there is something more that can be explained to a mere mortal, I'd be grateful.

 

[mrarroyo]

I had a Supermacro III Version 6 which I recently sold to order the Supermacro IV. My supermacro III Version 6 originally came with an AD8397 OP Amp and no buffers (the AD8397 has no need for buffers). After a couple of months I ordered an OPA2134 with two High-C (C=current) buffers and I liked them quite a bit.

For the Supermacro III Version 6 Dr. Xin had two max out versions, one based on the 8620 chip and the other on the 637 chip. I contacted him and told him what I wanted (detail and punchy sound) he sugested teh 8620 which I ordered. However before he could ship them out the Supermacro IV came out so I canceled the 8620 (the same as two 8610 chips) to get the Supermacro IV.

If this is going to be your first amp from Dr. Xin I would recomend you get the stock (based on OPA134 with a High-C buffer at each of channels 1 and 2 and OPA2134 on channels 3/4. It would look like:

You could ask him to replace the channels 3/4 with an 8397 but I personally would not like it. I like the detaila and punch of the 2134 better.

The max out option get expensive because you double up on buffers and use more expensive chips like the 637. It would look like:

Good luck.

 

[sidewinder]

Doesn't this thing get hot? I mean, so many opamps and buffers in a small package. Is this amp class A biased?

 

[crypt@]

I hadn't noticed mine (SMIII - 637 Class-A, stacked BUF634 Hi-C) being hot when running on batteries, though with all 8* rechargable it is only getting 9.6V. It does get warm when charging though.

The 637 picture in mrarroyo's post is Class-A biased as well as having stacked BUF634 in Hi-C mode.

 

[mrarroyo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidewinder Doesn't this thing get hot? I mean, so many opamps and buffers in a small package. Is this amp class A biased?

NO!

 

[ComfyCan]

Thanks mrarroyo. (I'm still confused, but that's probably unavoidable, and I do appreciate the feedback)

One more follow up question: If I order in stock configuration and later decide to try a max configuration, is it just a matter of buying the extra components and plugging them into the proper sockets like "leggo" blocks, or is it something that would require returning the amp to Dr. Xin to be rebuilt?

 

[RockinOut]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComfyCan Thanks mrarroyo. (I'm still confused, but that's probably unavoidable, and I do appreciate the feedback) One more follow up question: If I order in stock configuration and later decide to try a max configuration, is it just a matter of buying the extra components and plugging them into the proper sockets like "leggo" blocks, or is it something that would require returning the amp to Dr. Xin to be rebuilt?

Yeah, it's just like leggo's

. All the info for tweaking and putzing around with the Super Macro, is on fixup.net/talk. You'll have to search and dig deep in the forums but it's all there.

Owning and playing with a Super Macro is a whole world and a hobby onto itself. It takes times, it's just part of the fun.

That's what's so awesome about the IV series: It's like two amps in one, a pre-amp and an amp. That's why you have FOUR (IV) sockets to deal with now plus the buffer sockets. It used to be easier with just two opamp sockets to deal with.

Yes it gets technical with ZILLIONS of options like diff buffers, Hi-C mode (adding resistors), output bypass OB, Class A CA, both OBCA.

It's just like learning about DAC, amps, and headphones, but with opamps. It's not hard. It would be nice to have FAQ here or on fixup.net, but it is what it is.

The default is good for a warm, smooth non-fatiguing sound. That's always been Xin's personal preference because he listens to his amps 8-12 hours a day at low volumes.

If you like a more crystal clear, powerful sound then try the maxed out options, though battery life is shortened. As Xin states the default is very smooth and warm with nice voluminous bass with great battery run time. You'd be surprised, Xin is pretty dead on with his default configs. He spends a lot of time deciding on it not just sound but battery life--his real big on battery life.

I used to LOVE super crystal clear sound. On my SM3 i used SA5534 for 6 months and loved the clarity.

Then it was a bit harsh and fatiguing. Why? Tastes change, just like diff headphones, music, food, hobbies, (women?

).

Now I LOVE a smooth, warm, airy sound with voluminous and bass I can feel in my bones (especially with E5c and Xin bass boost). That's how it sounds with NE5534. I listen to it 4-6 hours a day. Not fatiguing at all, especially with Xin crossfeed on. So for my tastes, I trust, Xin's default settings.

The Super Macro goes great with Micro DAC, especially with optical and DC power. (I have ground noise when I use USB with AC power on the Xin amp and Micro DAC. Solution: use Xin with DC).

I remember from past posts how you've progressed with your rig with Micro DAC. Super Macro is a whole 'nother world. The switches allows you to INSTANTLY shape the sound to different moods and different types of music. With one switch you can get a smoother sound with Xinfeed on. With another switch it's more powerful with the amp gain switch. When I want to get really stupid, I turn on the bass boost and my head rocks like I'm in a concert (works best with bass capable headphones, not as strong with ety's). When I want to be normal again, just a switch shuts everything off, no messing with EQ's. It's INSTANT.

For me the switches is the option that sets him apart from the competition.

Short term shaping with switches, Long term shaping with opamps. The complexity is what's so great. We're all lucky Xin makes them for us. He could just decide to stop making them, and just do it for his friends and himself.

I STILL love my SM3. It's simply perfect. Just because he constantly improves his design does not make my amp sound worse. I LOVE IT.

Having said that, I'm gonna get SM IV, just out of boredom and wanting a toy to waste endless hours. But that's just me.

It's not for everyone, but I still highly recommend it, and searching and browsing over at fixup.net.

I still don't know half the technical stuff, all I know is that it sounds great and give me so many options.

The good thing is that you have backup amps if you decide to get and play with a Super Macro. Some people only own one amp, and wait for months to receive it or to get it back from repairs or upgrades.

 

[sidewinder]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrarroyo NO!

What no? Class A?

 

[RockinOut]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidewinder What no? Class A?

I don't know either what mrarroyo meant, but

for me it doesn't get too hot.

Also Class A for Xin's amps is an option by using resistors or adapter sockets with resistors on them. I may be wrong, I'm too lazy to look it up.

From what I remember output bypass, OB, is set my manipulating the pins on the opamp or the adapter socket and CA is by using a resistor between the pins.

Sorry about technical inaccuracy, just wanted to answer the question that class A is a tweakable option. One can DIY or buy a socket from Xin.

(From what I remember OB can only be used with certain opamps like 5534 while CA can be used with any opamp, i might be wrong. Check fixup.net. OBCA makes things clearer and tighter and better soundstage. That's what I hear with NE5534 with OB, OBCA, or just with opamp by itself. Confusing, yes I know, sorry)

 

[ComfyCan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockinOut I don't know either what mrarroyo meant, but for me it doesn't get too hot. Also Class A for Xin's amps is an option by using resistors or adapter sockets with resistors on them. I may be wrong, I'm too lazy to look it up. From what I remember output bypass, OB, is set my manipulating the pins on the opamp or the adapter socket and CA is by using a resistor between the pins. Sorry about technical inaccuracy, just wanted to answer the question that class A is a tweakable option. One can DIY or buy a socket from Xin. (From what I remember OB can only be used with certain opamps like 5534 while CA can be used with any opamp, i might be wrong. Check fixup.net. OBCA makes things clearer and tighter and better soundstage. That's what I hear with NE5534 with OB, OBCA, or just with opamp by itself. Confusing, yes I know, sorry)

Thanks; this sounds like one of those things that you just have to play with to figure it out. If I decide to order a SuperMacro, I think I'll just go stock and take it from there. Chances are, Xin will come out with something new that makes the whole think obsolete long before I figure out what configuration I prefer anyway. (or, alternatively, the whole design will change before it gets delivered).

I figure if I order now, I'll be sure to have it by Christmas

(Edit: I'm sort of kidding. I really think it is probable that Xin is going to start shipping soon, and he'll probably sell amps for awhile before he pulls the plug again on his entire product line. When I bought my first Xin amp (Micro III) it was delivered in about 3 weeks).

 

[mrarroyo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidewinder What no? Class A?

That is correct, the Supermacro does not get hot in operation. Only slightly warm when charging up.

 

[aluren]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComfyCan Thanks; this sounds like one of those things that you just have to play with to figure it out. If I decide to order a SuperMacro, I think I'll just go stock and take it from there. Chances are, Xin will come out with something new that makes the whole think obsolete long before I figure out what configuration I prefer anyway. (or, alternatively, the whole design will change before it gets delivered). I figure if I order now, I'll be sure to have it by Christmas (Edit: I'm sort of kidding. I really think it is probable that Xin is going to start shipping soon, and he'll probably sell amps for awhile before he pulls the plug again on his entire product line. When I bought my first Xin amp (Micro III) it was delivered in about 3 weeks).

wow, another xin amp huh? at least now you have the supermicro to keep you busy while you wait for the macro... unlike some of us here that have no amp/cheapo amps...

are you getting the maxout option? i got the opa627 maxout knowing that i'll want to upgrade if i got the default. since i'm not too familiar with this stuff either, i'd rather have xin do the upgrade for me than doing it myself...

 

[ComfyCan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aluren wow, another xin amp huh? at least now you have the supermicro to keep you busy while you wait for the macro... unlike some of us here that have no amp/cheapo amps... are you getting the maxout option? i got the opa627 maxout knowing that i'll want to upgrade if i got the default. since i'm not too familiar with this stuff either, i'd rather have xin do the upgrade for me than doing it myself...

I haven't pulled the trigger on one yet, but I probably will soon. Ideally, I'd like to wait until someone posts impressions on a configuration that sounds really good with the GS-1000's. I'll probably just order when I'm having a bad day and want something to cheer me up--nothing like ordering a new toy. Unfortunately with Xin amps, that is generally followed by a anxiety-filled waiting period.

aluren, I hope you and the others who are still waiting on your amps will get them soon. For one thing, you've clearly waited long enough. For another, I'd like to hear more impressions from new owners who have listened to the amp in different configurations with different phones. While impresssions from past Xin amp owners can be helpful, nobody really knows how well those impressions will carry over to the new ver. IV design.

 

[aluren]

thanks. we've been crossing our fingers for a month now. yeah let's see how different configurations turn out. in fact, i wouldn't mind swapping opamps with fellow headfi'er either.

 

[ComfyCan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aluren thanks. we've been crossing our fingers for a month now. yeah let's see how different configurations turn out. in fact, i wouldn't mind swapping opamps with fellow headfi'er either.

I can't wait to tell my wife I'm going to a little get together in Cleveland to swap opamps with a bunch of internet friends.

Would be cool though...