[gregorio]

It seems like the objects are placed differently than in the original mix.

Yes, that’s the whole point of an object based format such as Dolby Atmos. Namely, that the objects are “placed differently” in the channels/speakers in order to more closely reproduce the intended perceived location.

With the sound bar, there was no attempt to move the footsteps. Instead it placed a different sound object in the rear and didn’t move it.

I think it’s incredibly unlikely there “was no attempt to move the footsteps”. Far more likely is that the attempt simply didn’t work as intended, due to poor processing, your perception, your listening position and/or your room acoustics.

The sound bars I know of (those bose models) aren't that large, so the sweet spot would be rather close in right?

No, or rather, not necessarily. The width of the two stereo speakers (the distance between them) can be adjusted either physically, obviously by simply placing them physically closer together or further apart, or adjusted psychoacoustically, for example by making the stereo signal more mono, to create the effect of the speakers being closer together than they are physically or by adjusting phase/level relationships (EG. “shuffling”) to create the effect of the speakers being further apart than they are physically. As far as I’m aware, most/all soundbars do the latter.

G

 

[bigshot]

Its main selling point seems to be that it decodes just about every audio format.

If it was trying to follow the positions in the Blu-ray mix, it failed dismally. It’s the same with the AirPods Max. Occasionally some element will be separated out, but I never hear anything potting, except right to left. Maybe as soon as the object moves, the illusion falls apart. It seems a stretch to call this Atmos, but I guess it’s doing the Atmos stuff under the hood whether or not that results in something you hear the way it’s intended or not.

 

[The Jester]

With Atmos there are “suggested” positions for surround and particularly overhead speakers, from memory with 4 overhead speakers they are placed two ahead of, and two behind the listening position, with a single pair slightly in front of the listening position, a studio setup for mixing Atmos would likely conform to “ recommended” speaker positions so it would make sense to setup a home system as similar as possible, for a soundbar to even approach such a system it would require a level of processing that would likely be more expensive than the soundbar an TV combined,
Don’t get me wrong, some soundbars in friends houses sound great on movies etc, but don’t come close to a fairly “basic” 7/2/2 system …
For music, if done correctly it can be quite impressive but as in the early days of stereo, exaggerations to “Highlight” its presence, singer in the left speaker, musicians in the right, can spoil the experience, instruments suddenly moving around the room just destroy any sense of immersion in a performance, likely that will improve as Atmos encoded music becomes more popular …
For most people, and the $$ involved, a TV plus soundbar works just fine for watching TV, and movies …

 

[bigshot]

It seems they dilute the brand when they slap it on stuff that can’t possibly deliver on the promises. I wasn’t expecting a surround experience, but I’m sure some people do. And of course there are “reviews” saying it does things it doesn’t.

 

[The Jester]

Using angled drivers to provide delayed reflected sound from side and rear walls as well as the ceiling, add the built in amps for each driver plus the sound processing involved and they do a pretty good job for the $$,
Trying to go “higher performance” soundbars would likely push them up into the cost of a basic Atmos receiver and speaker setup ?

 

[bigshot]

I think that trying to fake the speaker placement doesn’t work. It sounds different, but it doesn’t sound the way it’s intended to.

 

[The Jester]

Bit like the old Sony SQ system in the 70’s worked “sort of” …
If you have it try something like Jean Michel Jarre’s “Aero” 5.1 version … tried it at friends houses and sounds impressive on a basic soundbar, even though it’s not Atmos it is very well recorded …

 

[gregorio]

It seems they dilute the brand when they slap it on stuff that can’t possibly deliver on the promises.

In a sense it maybe true that it somewhat dilutes the brand, although it can “possibly deliver on the promises”. It very much depends on the interaction of the individual soundbar, the room acoustics and the resultant sweet spot, if there is one. As mentioned, I experienced one that certainly wasn’t as good as a proper Atmos setup but I was surprised that it got moderately close, positioning was quite reasonable, although smooth pans weren’t convincing. Still, a fairly reasonable surround (inc. height) experience for a fraction of the cost and effort of setting up a proper system. The problem is, that soundbar might not have worked anywhere near as effectively in a different room, due to acoustics.

Therefore, generalising and saying they can or cannot deliver is not true, a particular one or even most/all of them might not deliver in your room but might in another. It’s a bit of a minefield for consumers because there’s no real way to know how well a particular soundbar will cope with your particular room acoustics. Certainly one with room correction *should* provide a higher probability of it delivering but in practice that depends on the sophistication of its room correction and the acoustic issues it has to try and compensate for. One of the least impressive ones I heard did have room correction though. So much so, I thought my friend must have done the calibration incorrectly, so we did it again but got the same disappointing result.

G

 

[bigshot]

I definitely get “enhanced” sound, just not surround sound. I wonder what percentage of buyers get an audible improvement like that and assume that is what Atmos is? I’m thinking that the likelihood of an average consumer having the perfect room might be pretty slim.

 

[Davesrose]

I'm not experienced with speakers, but as I understand from some books I'm reading ATM, the sweet spot for a 2.1 system is a spot equidistant from the speakers with a 30° offset from center right? The sound bars I know of (those bose models) aren't that large, so the sweet spot would be rather close in right? And how does the AI pick up what that sweet spot sounds like to adjust it? That's interesting.

What model is this sound bar? Maybe there's some documentation buried online about it.

I have a Samsung Q series soundbar (that includes two satellite speakers and subwoofer unit) in my bedroom. It has a hassle free initial calibration, where the speakers emit a test tone, it records it, and then sets how reflections for your particular room are handled. I had previously had a couple bookshelf speakers, but when upgrading to a wall mounted 55" OLED, they sounded pretty muffled if behind the TV. The Samsung series are supposed to be good with movies: it just has a few EQ presets, and a limited amount of bass and treble you can set.

When it comes to the sound quality, the bass can sometimes get too boomy. The sound field sounds pretty nice, though: I do get a sense of sound that's all around me (the reflections going to the ceiling aren't as definite as the height speakers I have for my HT). So my HT gets deeper bass impact with its larger front firing subwoofer, and better height effects due to the physical speakers. Also with the size of the speaker cabinets (and being at least 2 way), the sound is more dynamic with my 7.1.4 home theater.

 

[gregorio]

I’m thinking that the likelihood of an average consumer having the perfect room might be pretty slim.

I have no idea. The friend who had the soundbar which delivered reasonably well had a pretty average European sitting room, it wasn’t acoustically treated in any way and I don’t know if treatment would have made the result better or worse. He may have been exceptionally lucky or just somewhat lucky and the soundbar was particularly good/flexible, I don’t know.

G

 

[bigshot]

Today I got the soundbar to output pretty doggone good surround sound. Oddly enough, it wasn’t an Atmos or even multichannel recording… it was the 50 Years of Devo CDs. I leaned forward while it was playing and suddenly it popped into surround. But I had to hold my head still leaning forward and looking at my feet. If I looked up, it turned back to flat. Very odd. Not a particularly comfortable position, and hard to watch a movie while I’m looking down at my feet!

One other weird thing… a synth was up front above a certain note and it popped to the back when it lowered in pitch. Maybe they had some sort of phase envelope on it. I don’t know.

 

[Davesrose]

Today I got the soundbar to output pretty doggone good surround sound. Oddly enough, it wasn’t an Atmos or even multichannel recording… it was the 50 Years of Devo CDs. I leaned forward while it was playing and suddenly it popped into surround. But I had to hold my head still leaning forward and looking at my feet. If I looked up, it turned back to flat. Very odd. Not a particularly comfortable position, and hard to watch a movie while I’m looking down at my feet!

One other weird thing… a synth was up front above a certain note and it popped to the back when it lowered in pitch. Maybe they had some sort of phase envelope on it. I don’t know.

You seemed to indicate this soundbar of yours didn't have a room calibration setup? It could be that it's just not designed for TV/movie surround....instead direct stereo is best. Streaming services like Netflix will let you switch a 5.1 track to stereo (it might sound better for your soundbar). Since my soundbar setup is a full "11.1.4" Atmos setup (that includes 2 satellite speakers with front, top, and side drivers) it is good with surround content.

 

[bigshot]

I’m very happy with the sound. It sounds quite a bit better in surround mode, kind of like open headphones, it just doesn’t put sounds to the side or behind me unless I’m in the exact right spot. It depends on bouncing sound from the top and sides of the soundbar off walls and the ceiling. The angles and distances are critical. A few inches forward or back and the rear channels melt into the overall.

 

[Davesrose]

I’m very happy with the sound. It sounds quite a bit better in surround mode, kind of like open headphones, it just doesn’t put sounds to the side or behind me unless I’m in the exact right spot. It depends on bouncing sound from the top and sides of the soundbar off walls and the ceiling. The angles and distances are critical. A few inches forward or back and the rear channels melt into the overall.

OK, I was just interjecting since you started this thread complaining about content having a weird presentation (especially, I think you're indicating native Atmos content). But if it's all working for you now, enjoy!