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Originally Posted by SoundCarrier /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hi,
A few months ago I bought a pair of AKG K701 headphones. I love audio and was so excited about getting them, but to be honest I've been very disappointed I find them to be harsh, cold and lacking in low end. To hear any sort of detail in the music, they have to be run at high volume levels, which I really don't like.
I know that these are very highly regarded headphones, so either they are just not to my taste or there's something else wrong (possibly the amplification). I would *really* appreciate your opinions this, as I'm at the point of selling the 701s and treating my brief foray into the world of high end headphones as an expensive mistake
My current setup:
Emu 1212m -> Balanced Cables -> Tapco 6306 Mixer -> K701
The 6306 mixer is basically a budget Mackie mixer which cost around £70 new. (I make music and use the mixer to control the volume of my main monitors.) I assume that its headphone amp is terrible, and not doing the 701's justice. I'm sure that some of you are recoiling in horror right now
Could the problems I've been having (cold, harsh sound, lack of bass, no detail at low volumes) be explained by the headphone amp? Could a good amp make such a big difference to the sound? I appreciate that these may be slightly stupid/obvious questions for you, but I'm new to the head-fi way!
I'm sure you will appreciate that after my initial disappointment, I'm reluctant to spend even more money unless there's a good chance that it will solve the problem.
I read about the Benchmark DAC1, which sounded very interesting, as it would allow me to get rid of the 6306 mixer, giving my main monitors the benefit of the new DAC and freeing up the analogue outs on the 1212m for other things. However, I've read on this site that some people find the DAC1->k701 combo to be overly harsh, which is exactly what I'm trying to get away from!
So, the question: could I buy a DAC and amp (or maybe a DAC containing a good amp?) for under £600 which will transform my headphones?
Sorry for the long post. Any help is much appreciated.
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Sound Carrier, several things here. But most importantly don't give up on this level of audio. You just haven't found what rings your bell yet. Part of your problem sounds like your amplification. And some of what you describe sounds like my impressions of the 701s (cold, lacking bass and I'll add lifeless) at whatever level of amplification balanced or not. I've heard the 701s burned in and through some very good amps, including balanced amps. They definately improve with better amplification and balanced 701 through a high end amp was as good as they got for me. But in the end the 701 has always been very uninvolving for me. I just came to the conclusion that I'm not a 701 person even though intellectually i can hear some good things in them. But lacking details is not one of the raps against the 701s and that sounds like an amp issue.
If you are looking at DACs you might consider the Apogee MiniDAC. I don't know this from personal experience, but from my research (it's a piece of gear on my short list) it is supposed to be one of the warmer DAC in the under $1000 (US) category.
You could almost break down head-fi into 3 camps, the AKG camp, the Sennheiser 580/600/650 camp, and the Grado camp. You will get folks who are very passionate about one of those three and the more passionate of the camps regularly throw rocks at each other. (I may get some rocks thrown for this post-we'll see.) And the truth, according to me, is that there are good cans in each camp and but they are different flavors and what you like is based upon personal preference. And you are the only one who can decide where you fall--and that takes some experience. I also am one who believes that I shouldn't have to work too hard to try to get myself to like soomething. There are too many options out there to try to shoe horn me into one. That said I believe that burn is is a real thing but I never expect a nigh/day difference. (And I have had one of the most burn in intense and dependent cans in the Ultrasone 750.)
So you might start looking around for where you could gain some of that experience. Meets are a great way to get samples (but usually not a detailed exposure) of sound signatures of different gear. Plus you could take you 701s along and hook it up to some of the better amps there and see if your experience of the 701s change.
Another thing you might do is to fill out your profile. Let people know where you live and what you have. Also fill in your musical preferences as some cans just go better with certain types of music. You might find someone near you who would let you hear some of their gear. Or there might be music store resources near-by, especially if you are in a major city. If I knew you were in LA for example, I could point you in several directions (but you probably wouldn't be mentioning a budget in pounds if you were here). And another thing I do is to look at peoples profiles to see where they are coming from/ their point of reference. If someone tells me that 701s and Senn 650s and Ultrasones etc are junk, and then I see in their profile that they have Sony MDR-10 or Senn HE90s (two of the more expensive and good out of production headphones) then I can adjust what they are saying. Likewise if someones best headphone is the Koss KSC 75, then any major full size headphone is going to be a big improvement. (And this is not to knock the KSC 75, one of the truly great bargains (at $15-25 US) in audio IMO--just not high end. But check my profile.)
If I had to pick one of the three camps, I'd put myself in the Sennheiser camp--to let you know my bias/preference. But (and her comes my plug) recently I've been more into Ultrasones. I mention this because one of their top mid level headphone is the PROline 750 ($260-400 US depending on the outlet). It is a closed can and is one of the favorites of recording studios in LA according to one of the top Pro/SemiPro shops in the area that I've frequented over the years.
For music listening I find it a very enjoyable sound that has a lot of bass and is very different from the 701s. It also has a lot of detail, a big soundstage, yet a lot of bass that makes it more involving than the 701s for me. Its pretty easy on amp needs (the 701s and the Senns can put a lot of requirements on the amp and it seems that he Grados can be picky too but I'm less sure of this point). And the 750s could do some double duty for monitoring your mixes. I should think that a muscian supply store would have some of these that you could hear as they are pretty popular in the recording world.
Plan on spending time to aquaint yourself with the differnet options out there. I did a lot of reading on this site to get a sense of the the sound signatures of the different headphones and amps. Then I went out and was able to hear most of what I'd read about. And when I got the "ears on" experience, I found that a lot of what I'd come to in my reading turned out to be very close to my listening experience. But I had to learn to filter out the more rabid and absolute statements to get to a more accurate sense of the reality behind the hyperbole. Remember that in the end it is people arguing for the rightness of their personal taste.
There are other sub camps out there like the Beyer folks and AudioTechnica that fall somewhere in between the Big Three (my perception/my term).
Keep looking and you'll find it, but it will probably cost you more than you were planning. Good luck and have fun.
I sign off with the Head-fi salute (as it bears repeating): Sorry about your wallet.
