[The8thst]

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Audio-Components/Hi-Fi+Audio/N-50

Has anyone looked into this? It seems like a pretty cool DAC with support for streaming services.
According to the Pioneer rep it supposedly has the same DAC circuit as their uber-expensive TAD products and has an asynch USB 192/32 interface, optical, and coaxial.

As far as I can tell the only thing missing is balanced outputs.

I am curious to hear if anyone has used this and to look at how products stack up when they are built by a company that has money and vast R&D resources vs small independent outfits (audio-gd, fiio, nuforce, etc).

Thanks,
Pete

(* disclaimer (in case it matters): I do program home automation systems and we do sell home audio products, but we are NOT a pioneer dealer *)

 

[project86]

I've got one coming in for review. It should be at the house any minute (come on, FedEx!).
 
I'm intrigued by the unit for the same reasons you mentioned. It will be interesting to compare to the NAD C 446 which I just reviewed, though they each have their own focus. 

 

[Maxvla]

Looks interesting. Let us know how it performs. The N-30 is $500, the N-50 is $700. Pretty reasonable, really.

 

[The8thst]

Looks interesting. Let us know how it performs. The N-30 is $500, the N-50 is $700. Pretty reasonable, really.

I didn't mention the N-30 because it doesn't have any other inputs besides the network port, so I wasn't sure if it would fit in with this forum's focus.

 

[Maxvla]

Quite right, I was just searching for prices and both were listed together.

 

[Maxvla]

Looking at the TAD cd player in question, it seems one of the main performance enhancements is the master clock, which of course this Pioneer lacks. The separate PSU as well. Course we're talking $34,000 vs $700. Not sure we can really draw any kind of performance cues from the TAD unit.

 

[project86]

So I received the N-50 and got it connected yesterday. I didn't have much time to mess with it, but here are a few very brief impressions.
 

1. Built like a tank. It weighs 16 pounds, and reminds me of some of the classic Elite gear from back in the day (minus the wood panels on the sides of course). At one point, the "Elite" brand was being misapplied to some pretty low end stuff, but it looks like Pioneer is coming back around. 
2. The screen is tiny! I knew 2.5 inches was small, but I didn't realize just how small it would be, especially when placed on a big component like this. It's usable in a headphone rig where you'll be sitting right next to it.... but on a component shelf across the room it is pretty much worthless. You better have an iPad or something.
3. Wireless is not built in. I didn't realize this at first. Pioneer sent along the wireless add on ($150) as well as the Bluetooth add on ($100), which was nice, but if I was buying I'd like to see one or both built in. Plus the wireless adapter wouldn't pair with my network, but I didn't get much time to spend messing with it. 
4. Playing FLAC files from a thumb drive, the sound is very good using analog outs. Good enough to where I'll need to do a lot of careful listening to see how it ranks. That's a good sign.

 
Obviously I need to spend much more time with it. Getting WiFi to pair with my router is the main goal, and then I can go from there. I'll update as I go along and then post a final review when I'm done. I can't wait to check out the internals myself. Here's a stock photo which looks promising:
 

 

[krikkevw]

Any more news regarding the sound quality? I'm considering buying this N 50.
 
Quote:

So I received the N-50 and got it connected yesterday. I didn't have much time to mess with it, but here are a few very brief impressions.
 

1. Built like a tank. It weighs 16 pounds, and reminds me of some of the classic Elite gear from back in the day (minus the wood panels on the sides of course). At one point, the "Elite" brand was being misapplied to some pretty low end stuff, but it looks like Pioneer is coming back around. 
2. The screen is tiny! I knew 2.5 inches was small, but I didn't realize just how small it would be, especially when placed on a big component like this. It's usable in a headphone rig where you'll be sitting right next to it.... but on a component shelf across the room it is pretty much worthless. You better have an iPad or something.
3. Wireless is not built in. I didn't realize this at first. Pioneer sent along the wireless add on ($150) as well as the Bluetooth add on ($100), which was nice, but if I was buying I'd like to see one or both built in. Plus the wireless adapter wouldn't pair with my network, but I didn't get much time to spend messing with it. 
4. Playing FLAC files from a thumb drive, the sound is very good using analog outs. Good enough to where I'll need to do a lot of careful listening to see how it ranks. That's a good sign.

 
Obviously I need to spend much more time with it. Getting WiFi to pair with my router is the main goal, and then I can go from there. I'll update as I go along and then post a final review when I'm done. I can't wait to check out the internals myself. Here's a stock photo which looks promising:
 

 

 

[project86]

Quote:

Any more news regarding the sound quality? I'm considering buying this N 50.
 


 

I'm working on the review now. In short, it's a very good sounding component. If you took away the "network audio player" functionality, and sold it as just a DAC, it would justify the $700 price. Maybe not an absolute standout DAC at that price (since the market is full of great choices), but reasonably competitive. 
 
 
 

 

[project86]

For anyone who may be interested, here is a link to my final review of the Pioneer N-50:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/products/pioneer-elite-n-50-network-audio-player#reviews
 
It's a pretty great device overall, though not perfect of course. 

 

[gooky]

Hey, thanks for the review, a lot of good pictures and information there.  I'm trying to keep an eye out for sources better than a Squeezebox, so it's good to know that the N-50 won't work with portable hard drives.  Another reason that I use a Squeezebox instead of the computer, is that a computer screens is too bright, even on the lowest settings, and I don't like the idea of pointing and clicking while I'm listening to music.  You're trying to relax, and get away from the computer.  But you're right, there are lots of good reasons for companies to make products like this.  Thanks again.

 

[project86]

Quote:

Hey, thanks for the review, a lot of good pictures and information there.  I'm trying to keep an eye out for sources better than a Squeezebox, so it's good to know that the N-50 won't work with portable hard drives.  Another reason that I use a Squeezebox instead of the computer, is that a computer screens is too bright, even on the lowest settings, and I don't like the idea of pointing and clicking while I'm listening to music.  You're trying to relax, and get away from the computer.  But you're right, there are lots of good reasons for companies to make products like this.  Thanks again.

Good point - If you work at a computer all day for job or school, you don't necessarily want to be in that same scenario for your relaxation time. The N-50 has the option to turn off the screen altogether.
 
The lack of hard drive support kind of makes sense - I guess they figure you should be using one of the several methods (DLNA, AirPlay) to stream that content over the network rather than plugging in the drive directly. Still, I like the direct option sometimes. 

 

[povilkami]

 
Quote:

Good point - If you work at a computer all day for job or school, you don't necessarily want to be in that same scenario for your relaxation time. The N-50 has the option to turn off the screen altogether.
 
The lack of hard drive support kind of makes sense - I guess they figure you should be using one of the several methods (DLNA, AirPlay) to stream that content over the network rather than plugging in the drive directly. Still, I like the direct option sometimes. 

 
Well I actually have N-50 at home for a week now and listen from an external HDD. All you need to do is format it using FAT32 file system (Windows 7 does not do that). And it plays perfectly! Mine is 160GB but I am pretty sure FAT32 supports up to 2TB.
 
So this thing is tested and the external HDD works. Of course, FAT32 has a limitation of MAX FILE SIZE, which is 4GB, so you will not be able to store large movie files on the same disk. But, since I like to carry my music with me, I dedicate the HDD to music. NAS is good, but it is static. And, as others state, NAS does not produce the highest sound quality (I am not sure about that yet).
 
P.S. And it powers up the 2.5 inch HDD perfectly, although it is an old type UATA disk.

 

[project86]

Interesting. I did try FAT32 formatting on two different portable drives, with no luck. I think it must come down to being a power issue, and you just got lucky.

 

[povilkami]

I might be lucky However, if it works for me, one should be able find and test an external HDD that would work with the Pioneer N-50.
 
Pioneer N-50 vs. Arcam rDAC
 
We had a listening session a couple days ago and did a direct comparison between N-50 and rDAC. I thought some people might be interested in this comparison since, at least in Europe, rDac is one the most popular Dac's at the moment for the price of 330 euro (or less) or even up to 380 with Wireless dongle. N-50 can be purchased for 490 - 550 euros.
 
The test system was of comparable price range: ~400Eur amplifier (with upgrades), 900Eur professionally hand built shelf speakers, proper level interconnects and speaker cables. rDAC was played through a good quality USB cable and, most importantly, with JPlay (http://jplay.eu/) kernel streaming, which makes such a huge difference in the SQ, compared with ASIO, regular Kernel etc. N-50 was played from an external HDD directly connected to the front USB.
 
The very brief findings:
 
Only after several blind tests we were able to identify the differences. And the differences were very subtle. All in all, everyone agreed on the following statement: there is "more in music" when played with N-50. It sounds just a tad fullier. Also, there were subtle differences in the low range: while the rDAC had more bass, the N-50 had more control in the bass region and made sound bass instruments more detailed. To be very picky - female voice might have sounded a bit more pleasing with N-50, but that maybe due to a "more in music".
 
So in general the N-50 made a good impression, we agreed that the DAC part was a tad better than rDAC's. Having in mind that N-50 is also a Network player with so many features, we consider it being a good value for money. I personally was very pleased (because I own N-50) that N-50 was able to stand up against rDAC even from the external HDD, since mr. Project86 and other reviewers have indicated that the best SQ is N-50 using as a DAC through a rear USB port. I wanted to get rid of a PC and did it succesfully.
 
I hope this brief comparison was usefull as I was very much looking for such a comparison before I purchased the N-50.
If you have contradictory or similar findings it would be interesting to hear them.