Pimeta Offset Issue.
May 20, 2007 at 9:17 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 11

mminutel

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I have heard of people using a DPDT switch to get rid of the power down offset. Can anyone elaborate on how this is done? I had asked this before but nobody had been able to give me a solid answer. I know that it needs to drain the caps straight to the ground channel instead of through the headphones, but I am not sure how to achieve this.

Off Topic Question: When people make DIY interconnects and put heatshrink over the terminations, do they use adhesive or just regular shrink? Also, when they make the Y-splits, how do they make it like a barrel?
 
May 21, 2007 at 11:51 PM Post #2 of 11
Sorry for the bump, but I am getting the final parts for the amp this week and need to figure it out before I get to work. I know that a good bit of people do it, I am just not sure what I connect to the terminals.

Also, I figured out the Off Topic question.
 
May 22, 2007 at 1:49 AM Post #3 of 11
One method is that if you have DPDT or SPDT switch then you no longer wire the PSU direct to the amp, you break that positive PSU rail connection then connect the amp positive power rail to the common, center switch pin(s). Connect the PSU positive power rail to one end/throw of the switch pins (the "on" throw) such that when the switch is in on position it completes the circuit, amp gets power.

On the other throw of the switch, the "off" switch position, the other end switch pin(s) are connected to the amp negative rail (not power or virtual ground) through a low Ohm resistor. Since the resistor is not a continual load, current only flowing for a moment when power is turned off, it doesn't need to be a very large value, but if you had a pile of different wattages lying around you might as well use a a higher value (within reason, no need for more than 2W) rather than some little 1/4W. You might try around 10 Ohm and if the problem remains choose an incrementally lower value.

If you were going to short the caps to virtual ground instead of what is described above, with a DPDT, you'd wire the amp positive rail lead to one of the switch's center/common contacts, the amp negative rail lead to the other center contact. To the switch's "on" position end contact, wire the PSU positive on the same contact row as the amp positive. Make sure it is on the same contact row so you aren't shorting out amp positive rail with PSU negative! Use a multimeter to confirm proper wiring before trying it with power on. To the other switch "on" position contact wire the PSU negative. On the switch "off" position contacts, each contact has a small ohm resistor as mentioned above, connected to a lead going to the power ground on the amp board. You can connect both resistor ends together leading away from the switch (but not those two switch pins directly connected) to take only one wire from the resistors to the amp power ground if you like. I think one possible place to connect that wire is to a power ground hole labeled "PG". So in summary when the switch is on it then connects both of the PSU leads to the amp V+ & V- leads. When the switch is off, the amp rails each separately drain through a resistor to power ground. The key is that these resistors only connect the power rails to ground when the switch is in the off position so they aren't always using up a lot of current and getting hot, only conducting momentarily when the amp is turned off. Because of this, you can also get away with using a very small wire from the resistors to the virtual ground position as it won't carry high current for long enough to heat up significantly.

When you get it wired up, confirm with a meter resistance readings tests that at no time, on no switch throw are the PSU positive and negative ever shorted (practically 0 ohm), at no time is the PSU positive shorted to amp negative nor PSU negative shorted to amp positive, AND at no time are the amp positive and negative rails ever shorted together or to virtual ground, that they only conduct to virtual ground through the expected resistor values you added. All these things should be confirmed before you plug the PSU into the amp or turn it on. If your pimeta had a 2nd switch (like in the little alps pot) that switch should be left on for amp use and for these tests but the amp itself would not be allowed to run until you are sure the wiring is right.

There are fancier ways you could do it instead of blindly picking a resistor value if one rail is draining faster than the other. By monitoring the rails you could use a slightly lower value of resistor on the rail that doesn't drain as quickly (if they aren't close enough) or use same resistor values and add a 2nd parallel resistor to the slower draining rail so the paralleled resistor values result in nearer an equal drain. Either way you want to drain the caps quick enough that there is minimal time in an unstable voltage region but not directly shorting them so the current isn't very high.

If neither of these configurations work well enough, you might look at how much capacitance you are using and reduce that some by swapping in different caps. In theory someone could have upwards of 10,000 uF per rail (maybe more) if they just fit the biggest caps they could find but it doesn't need caps so large. IMO, 3000uF per rail might be the highest value you might need and many people find it acceptible to use nearer 1000uF per rail.

Some people might use connector shells for the "Barrel", or just a piece of round or oval plastic of high enough diameter. I think somebody makes split boots too but I don't recall who or where to buy 'em. IMO, adhesive lined, double walled heatshrink tubing is better in that it's a more durable and secure, permanent solution. I don't worry about that much though, it's not like it'll just fall apart otherwise and sometimes you may not want the glue squirting out the ends as it will inevitably do at least a little bit.
 
May 22, 2007 at 1:57 AM Post #4 of 11
Wow. Thank you very much. That was all that I needed to know. That was incredibly in depth, and I thank you for that.
 
May 22, 2007 at 2:07 AM Post #5 of 11
A general warning - I never get my posts right the first time. Re-edits come even several minutes later if I'm interrupted for some reason. Therefore, what I wrote previously has slightly changed after you had read it but mostly just clarification not a terrible flaw.
 
May 22, 2007 at 11:08 AM Post #6 of 11
Well, I thought that I understood. When you say "(not power or virtual ground)", where do you connect it on the Pimeta board?

-EDIT- Do you mean not to connect it to PG? Do you connect it to the negative power input?
 
May 22, 2007 at 3:36 PM Post #7 of 11
When I wrote "not power or virtual ground" it meant not power ground, not virtual ground. I have seen some people make a mistake in thinking a "negative" rail is ground because they aren't used to working with a power circuit where there is negative voltages (I assume?), so it was a clarification meaning as litterally as possible, "not those".

The negative power rail (V-) was the first reference made. The off position contact of switch has a resistor, then wire from the resistor to the negative power rail on the amp. This negative power rail on the amp is referred to as "V-" on the Pimeta schematic.

Just think about how a DPDT or SPDT switch works and what you're trying to do which is drain caps faster across that resistor only when the switch is in amp "off" position meaning the switch is breaking one circuit but making the resistor-as-bleeder circuit. Thus you need at least a SPDT switch, could not use a SPST switch to do what was described.
 
May 23, 2007 at 2:08 PM Post #9 of 11
I had actually thought about that. I am not sure if it would work or not, but I would rather go with the way that most people do it.
 
May 23, 2007 at 7:35 PM Post #10 of 11
I don't know that most people do it at all. I suspect they just accept whatever pop they have instead.

Yes you could use a 3 pole switch to disconnect L & R. I would wonder if the switch contacts become a capacitive coupling over time though, unless using a high grade sealed and/or plated contact. It may not be significant, I don't mean to suggest that is a reason to automatically reject doing it that way but it is not what was asked.
 
May 23, 2007 at 10:30 PM Post #11 of 11
I can live with the pop, but I read on Tangent's site that headphones aren't made to stand up to very high voltages. It was in the mV range, and mine is a little over a volt so I thought I was pushing it a little.
 

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