Ocharaku Flat-4 KAEDE (Maple)

[shsh]

Hey shigzeo is it worth the upgrade from Sui to maple? Looking to get maple or the tralucent!

 

[shigzeo]

Quote:

Hey shigzeo is it worth the upgrade from Sui to maple? Looking to get maple or the tralucent!

I am not sure about that. I think I hinted at it on page1, but I'm not keen on the SUI sound. I find the midrange concentration to be too much. The two are the same regarding build, though the box that comes with the KAEDE is very sweet indeed. 
 
If I had the money, I'd gun for the KAEDE. But as I said, I'm not keen on the SUI.
 
EDIT: I'd like to edit my thoughts on the SUI a little. I would LOVE the SUI if it had the necessary edge in horns, in mid-high strings, in cymbals. Without that edge, the SUI really does sound veiled in the mid-upper midrange. It was my first impression. I thought it was the comply tips getting stuck in my ear canal. No, it simply is the SUI sound.
 
That fixed, the SUI would be the buy of the decade. The sense of space is similar between the KAEDE and SUI and bass power is comparable, though the KAEDE has a small edge. But the crisp lines of horns (especially) that you've heard all your life with great speakers and headphones are softened. Sad, really, as damn, otherwise, the SUI is very very nice. 
 
Folk: recommended
Rock: not recommended
Trance: not recommended
Orchestral: no
The list goes on and on, mostly in favour of a veiled sound, especially in comparison to the KAEDE. Space, of course, is completely off the charts with either earphone.

 

[shsh]

Oh I am using Sony hybrids on the Sui. Maybe I will compare them with complys. Are the cables on the kaede better or is it the same? Thanks for the impressions, really tempted to get the kaede.

 

[shigzeo]

Unless my eyes are mistaken, the cables are the same, or mostly similar. I'm equally impressed with both. I'm still finishing my review for TouchMyApps and very sorry to constantly be on the cusp, but never publishing. I am hoping to finally publish it by the end of Monday. One problem I have: my computer finally has bit it. My replacement will arrive by 7 February. That means my livelihood (product photographer) is put mostly on hold. The review is written and awaiting final editing, but the photos are stored as is, NEF without even a WB setting applied. (I use uniWB.) 
 
If I am horribly delayed, it is because my computer simply couldn't finish processing the files I need. My wife has a computer, too, but the software I need is on my computer, and runs only 64-bit, while her computer is 32. So, I cannot just target mode my computer and boot up from hers, or run the software from a CCC clone...
 
I hope I don't have to wait till 7-9 February. 
 
Suffice it to say that I LOVE the KAEDE and for the most part, feel very strongly toward the SUI. The proviso is that no Ocharaku earphone should be compared to mass produced earphones. According to Ocharaku's founder, Mr. Yamagishi, KAEDE is a very limited production earphone. He does this to ensure the wood is cured, treated, and laminated exactly the same, with as few anomalies as possible turning out in the final product.
 
SUI of course, uses no wood in the final product, so it isn't subject to the same production shortcomings. Aluminium is also much much easier to tool than wood is. The KAEDE shell is very finally tooled indeed. I got to see prototypes as well as early stage KAEDE wood cabinets. A lot of thought went into this design. Essentially, you are buying a hand-made earphone. You will pay for it, too.
 
If you are into saving money at every turn: from cars to bicycles, from shoes to shorts, from freezer food to a proper quiche, then neither earphone suits your bill. Ocharaku are not Trek bicycles, designed (maybe) in USA, but made in Taiwan. They are Vanilla, or Guru, handmade in Oregon or Quebec under the direct supervision of their inventors. The person who would purchase a Guru is very different to the person who would purchase a Trek. Very very different. 
 
I don't think either design will win price/performance accolades, but I doubt anyone will miss their open, natural sound. KAEDE I really want. SUI, I think is a novel, great-sounding design for a number of songs, but it simply doesn't have the end to end coherence of the KAEDE. 

 

[gidion27]

Quote:

 
 
If you are into saving money at every turn: from cars to bicycles, from shoes to shorts, from freezer food to a proper quiche, then neither earphone suits your bill. Ocharaku are not Trek bicycles, designed (maybe) in USA, but made in Taiwan. They are Vanilla, or Guru, handmade in Oregon or Quebec under the direct supervision of their inventors. The person who would purchase a Guru is very different to the person who would purchase a Trek. Very very different. 
 
I don't think either design will win price/performance accolades, but I doubt anyone will miss their open, natural sound. KAEDE I really want. SUI, I think is a novel, great-sounding design for a number of songs, but it simply doesn't have the end to end coherence of the KAEDE. 

Like how you justify the Ocharaku earphones. You are correct that some manafecturarse are more than the sum of their parts. That is why the SUI is still on my wish list. (KAEDE is out of my price range.)

 

[shigzeo]

Quote:

Like how you justify the Ocharaku earphones. You are correct that some manafecturarse are more than the sum of their parts. That is why the SUI is still on my wish list. (KAEDE is out of my price range.)

I won't go so far as to say 'more than the sum of their parts' as I don't subscribe to mass market economics in all of my purchase decisions. If I did, I wouldn't be impressed with either earphone, would probably lambast their use of materials and small labour shops, would probably demand them to get capital investment and buy out a cheap sweatshop somewhere so that you, me, and the next headfier could enjoy our gadgets at half price.
 
I prefer to determine sum of arguments by how a product fulfils its specific niche. Is its customer (not the customer down the street) satisfied? Does the customer have what s/he asked for? If that customer wants to spend 500$ and not 300$, does the product AND the company reflect that price? Ocharaku does. It is not Toyota or Trek, making everything from penny-pinching cheapmobiles to rather expensive sedans that at first, were copied from other designers.
 
No, Ocharaku products don't pretend to be a cost benefit product. They are simply products that are engineered to stand out in their niche and stand out they do. Their competition is pretty much nil now. Final Audio went the way Japanese fire-on-the-wall-and-see-what-sticks way when they introduced their 40$ line. I believe very strongly in image. If I didn't there would be no reason to have more than one manufacturer for any single product line.

 

[gidion27]

Quote:

I won't go so far as to say 'more than the sum of their parts' as I don't subscribe to mass market economics in all of my purchase decisions. If I did, I wouldn't be impressed with either earphone, would probably lambast their use of materials and small labour shops, would probably demand them to get capital investment and buy out a cheap sweatshop somewhere so that you, me, and the next headfier could enjoy our gadgets at half price.
 
I prefer to determine sum of arguments by how a product fulfils its specific niche. Is its customer (not the customer down the street) satisfied? Does the customer have what s/he asked for? If that customer wants to spend 500$ and not 300$, does the product AND the company reflect that price? Ocharaku does. It is not Toyota or Trek, making everything from penny-pinching cheapmobiles to rather expensive sedans that at first, were copied from other designers.
 
No, Ocharaku products don't pretend to be a cost benefit product. They are simply products that are engineered to stand out in their niche and stand out they do. Their competition is pretty much nil now. Final Audio went the way Japanese fireon-the-wall-and-see-what-sticks way when they introduced their 40$ line. I believe very strongly in image. If I didn't there would be no reason to have more than one manufacturer for any single product line.

That is what I ment

 

[shsh]

Quote:

Unless my eyes are mistaken, the cables are the same, or mostly similar. I'm equally impressed with both. I'm still finishing my review for TouchMyApps and very sorry to constantly be on the cusp, but never publishing. I am hoping to finally publish it by the end of Monday. One problem I have: my computer finally has bit it. My replacement will arrive by 7 February. That means my livelihood (product photographer) is put mostly on hold. The review is written and awaiting final editing, but the photos are stored as is, NEF without even a WB setting applied. (I use uniWB.) 
 
If I am horribly delayed, it is because my computer simply couldn't finish processing the files I need. My wife has a computer, too, but the software I need is on my computer, and runs only 64-bit, while her computer is 32. So, I cannot just target mode my computer and boot up from hers, or run the software from a CCC clone...
 
I hope I don't have to wait till 7-9 February. 
 
Suffice it to say that I LOVE the KAEDE and for the most part, feel very strongly toward the SUI. The proviso is that no Ocharaku earphone should be compared to mass produced earphones. According to Ocharaku's founder, Mr. Yamagishi, KAEDE is a very limited production earphone. He does this to ensure the wood is cured, treated, and laminated exactly the same, with as few anomalies as possible turning out in the final product.
 
SUI of course, uses no wood in the final product, so it isn't subject to the same production shortcomings. Aluminium is also much much easier to tool than wood is. The KAEDE shell is very finally tooled indeed. I got to see prototypes as well as early stage KAEDE wood cabinets. A lot of thought went into this design. Essentially, you are buying a hand-made earphone. You will pay for it, too.
 
If you are into saving money at every turn: from cars to bicycles, from shoes to shorts, from freezer food to a proper quiche, then neither earphone suits your bill. Ocharaku are not Trek bicycles, designed (maybe) in USA, but made in Taiwan. They are Vanilla, or Guru, handmade in Oregon or Quebec under the direct supervision of their inventors. The person who would purchase a Guru is very different to the person who would purchase a Trek. Very very different. 
 
I don't think either design will win price/performance accolades, but I doubt anyone will miss their open, natural sound. KAEDE I really want. SUI, I think is a novel, great-sounding design for a number of songs, but it simply doesn't have the end to end coherence of the KAEDE. 

Hey thanks for your review! Really appreciate it! Now im thinking of keeping my Sui and getting the Kaede.

 

[shigzeo]

Quote:

Hey thanks for your review! Really appreciate it! Now im thinking of keeping my Sui and getting the Kaede.

Don't mean to bankrupt anyone. I'm thinking seriously if I can afford the KAEDE as I really like it. 

 

[shigzeo]

I'm still behind. I hope to have time this weekend to finish the review and publish it. If fast: friday. If slow, Monday. Very sorry yet again. Good news: new computer (hence the photos and full edit) to be delivered Friday or Saturday.

 

[gidion27]

Quote:

I'm still behind. I hope to have time this weekend to finish the review and publish it. If fast: friday. If slow, Monday. Very sorry yet again. Good news: new computer (hence the photos and full edit) to be delivered Friday or Saturday.

No worries pay day is 14 days away

 

[shigzeo]

Oh dear Lord... paydays. I remember them fondly.

 

[shigzeo]

I am getting the review prepped. At the moment, three new images KAEDE images are up at ohm-image.

 

[gidion27]

Quote:

I am getting the review prepped. At the moment, three new images KAEDE images are up at ohm-image.
 

I would love to hear your thoughts and maybe a comparison between the Flat 4 and your Heir IEMs

 

[shigzeo]

My dear sir, neither the KAEDE nor the Heir are mine. I borrowed both for review. But, if you have the patience and don't mind the strange fit, there really is nothing as lusty as the KAEDE. It isn't the sound you get from balanced armatures. There is no comparison. If you love BA sound, the KAEDE will not do it for you. The KAEDE is about openness, layers, and a bit of wonk. But when it is on, it is on like no other earphone I've heard. But it never sounds as precise nor as practiced as a balanced armature.