Notebook Computer Recommendation?

Sep 1, 2005 at 2:21 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 28

la_marquise

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I am due for a new laptop so now I am seeking advice...

1.I do a fair amount of graphic design and often work with 10 windows open.
2.Must be PC.
3.This is a desktop replacement! I don't need small, cute and light...
4.Don't require media centre requirements
5.SPEED!
6.Light gaming. I only ever play Civilizatio, Rome, or Age of Empires/Mythology on my computer.
7.Decent sound. But I guess I should look at buying an external soundcard instead?

I was looking at alienware or the acer ferrari, but I can't help but feel a little ripped off there. Almost felt like I was paying more for the branding than anything else!

Any help would be appreciated!!
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 2:45 AM Post #2 of 28
My friend is kinda into graphic design and stuff and he got a Tablet PC and it's been working great for him. He's got one of the 1st-gen Acer ones, but my friend just got a new one with a 128MB geforce video card, that's crazy!! He says it's freaking amazing so yeah.

If I were into graphics I would definetely pick up a tablet PC just because, ya know, on screen stuff is easier
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Sep 1, 2005 at 2:47 AM Post #3 of 28
If you can work with a Pentium-M the Dell XPS-2.

The best buy in desktop replacements is the HP ZD8000 (was ZD7000) series, the unit I'm using now.

The top configuration for the 8000 is a 3.6gHz P4HT 600 series, up to 2GB RAM, up to 120GB HDD, DVD+/-RW, 256MB ATI Radeon X600, WSXGA 17" widescreen, 801.11G Speedboost or G w/Bluetooth, WinXP Pro or Media.

Now, note those specs and figure out what you want. HP's custom order website is dynamic and only shows what components are actually available in stock - it will not let you order what is not stocked. But wait and come back later, and if stock is available you can then order it. So you must pre-figure what you want, not what shows up on the site as if that is only what you can truly get.

A completely topped-out config should end up less than $2500.

A very good buy.

http://www.zd7000forums.com/index.php

The Dell is a great unit but will cost you quite a bit more. If it is in your budget you certainly can't seem to go wrong there.

Alienware's customer service has gotten some *really* mixed reviews lately
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I mean, HP's service gets mixed reviews but not THAT mixed!
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And, as you see, I think very overpriced.

Note that the desktop replacements that use desktop CPU do run hot and don't get great battery life - I get max about 2 hours on my 3.4gHz Northwood P4HT 7000. The 8000 uses the even hotter-running Prescotts but they seem to have gotten a better hand on cooling, surprisingly, and they are reported to run a bit cooler. You lose the parallel port on the 8000 and only 1 IDE channel - see the posts in the forum (yeah, I'm there).

Sony makes some "desktop replacement" units as well, and I've used the 15 inch K series. It was a dog to me, but then I'm used to this 3.4! They have the A series with 17" widescreens and P-M 700's. They haven't gotten great reviews as game machines but they should be OK for other things.

Toshiba makes a nice unit, the G25. A lot of good feedback, even from those who switched from the ZD's.
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 3:04 AM Post #4 of 28
If you want a DTR Notebook, I think you should really take a look at the Fujitsu N3511. I've had one for about a month, and I just love it. The screen is fabulous, with better color, contrast, and brightness than the Dell 1905FP on my wife's home rig. The keyboard is awesome, and what made me want to get this system in the first place after demoing it at COMPUSA. The keys have a nice weight to each stroke, and do not feel very dinky like most laptop keyboards. I prefer it to IBM notebook keyboards, which I feel are a little mushy in each keystroke, though they are very rigidly built.

It has a 1.86GHz 2MB 533FSB P-M which benches almost as fast as the 2.3GHz 1MB 460FSB A64 in my home rig (the difference is about 3%), and can run on greatly reduced voltage through CHC (meaning an extended battery life and less heat/noise, as the fan hardly has to come on). It gets about 4 hours battery life while surfing with wifi and the screen at minimum brightness (still looks brighter than the IBM XGA screen at full brightness). The Radeon X300 is good for lite gaming, and can be severely underclocked with CHC to also extend battery life and reduce heat. The system is very solidly built, with no pressure points behind the screen, and IMO it is better built than the legendary IBM T-series.

On the audio side, the built-in audio jack sounds about as good as my IHP-120 when used with my E5's, however the biggest benefit is that it can pass 44.1 PCM (redbook) audio out with an optical cable, enabling you to use your external DAC of choice for great sound quality. It's also a very good looking system without being flashy or overstated (i.e. you could take it to a business meeting, but it is not as boring looking as an IBM).

My only complaint is that it is a bit weigty (7.7lbs), but it is worth it for all the great features it has, and it doesn't feel too heavy in my backpack.

If you want all-out processing power, I'd look for a model with a hyperthreaded P4 (Sager), or perhaps the AMD Turion ML-40 (Acer Ferrari 4005). That's gonna cost quite a bit more,a nd have less portability/battery life though.
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 3:19 AM Post #6 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by Snake
If you can work with a Pentium-M the Dell XPS-2.

The best buy in desktop replacements is the HP ZD8000 (was ZD7000) series, the unit I'm using now.

The top configuration for the 8000 is a 3.6gHz P4HT 600 series, up to 2GB RAM, up to 120GB HDD, DVD+/-RW, 256MB ATI Radeon X600, WSXGA 17" widescreen, 801.11G Speedboost or G w/Bluetooth, WinXP Pro or Media.

Toshiba makes a nice unit, the G25. A lot of good feedback, even from those who switched from the ZD's.



I have one of the first generation P4s from HP that is so warm that my cat thinks it's a fellow feline! So warmth I can handle. What I am trying to figure out is that whether the Pentium-M's work as well as a traditional desktop P4. I am also open to considering AMDs (hence the Ferrari investigation...)

I am looking for biggest bang for the buck. Trying to stay below $2k as this headphone hobby is eating a hole in my pocket.

I seem to be cursed when it comes to Toshiba. Every Toshiba product I've ever had has either crashed and burned, died mysteriously, or stolen.
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 3:27 AM Post #7 of 28
I am a member of notebookforums.com and ive dabbled with DTR notebooks for a long time now. I am saving up for my next SAGER notebook which I will pick up soon.

Sager is a taiwanese brand based on the Clevo platform. They are absolutely the best bang for the buck notebooks money can buy. Stunning performance and reliability. Best of all - I love their service department's promptness and willingness to read the warranty the way a customer would LIKE it to read
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I always shop with these guys : www.pctorque.com

They were in FL when I was there and now they seem to have followed me to Austin TX
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Highly recommend the Sager NP-9880 from pctorque.com


gs
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 7:55 AM Post #8 of 28
Yeah I second Sager as a good pick for desktop replacements. Big, heavy, high spec. I'd hate having one, personally, but I have different needs. Alienware liked them too. Early Alienware notebooks were basically Sagers with fancy paint jobs.
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 3:03 PM Post #9 of 28
I almost got myself a Sager. But then I ended up getting a HP instead. The Sager is a very nice laptop, but it just didn't fit my needs as well (going to class taking notes, and doing homework). The HP was much cheaper and is essentially the same when only doing light work.

If you are looking for an Alienware laptop you should look into Sager. A lot of their laptops are the same just rebranded, but Sager is cheaper. Unless you REALLY love that alien head, of course.
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Sep 1, 2005 at 3:58 PM Post #10 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by la_marquise
I have one of the first generation P4s from HP that is so warm that my cat thinks it's a fellow feline! So warmth I can handle. What I am trying to figure out is that whether the Pentium-M's work as well as a traditional desktop P4.


No.

For desktop apps and some styles of graphic processes, it does a great job, especially considering its clock frequencies. It is a very efficiently laid-out processor!

But raw power is raw power. When that type of power is absolutely necessary the P-M doesn't have it, can't get to P4HT levels, contrary to what Johnny-come-lately reviewers wish you to believe about the P-M. Their reviews will say about battery life and great performance but it's all relative. I've used P-M's and they have all had lower performance than my P4HT - I was going to say this but now have numbers to prove it:

CNET's review of P-M desktop replacements:
http://reviews.cnet.com/Dell_Inspiro...5.html?tag=top

CNET's review of ZD8000 / XPS P4 desktop replacements:
http://reviews.cnet.com/HP_Pavilion_...5.html?tag=top

Note that the intro for the new P-M review claims P4 performance but their figures show otherwise. On the highest results: Dell Inspiron 9200 P-M, 181, Dell XPSv1 217 - a 20% difference. That's running the 3.6 P4 at the equivalent of 2.88gHz - which is actually what the desktop P4's get throttled down to when on battery power.

The Dell XPS versus XPS-2 gets a lot closer

http://reviews.cnet.com/Dell_XPS_Gen...2.html?tag=tab

but it's still a 13% difference in SysMark content, 18% in BAPco

The new P-M series due will probably change this but it seems it won't be out until 2007

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-3121_7-5944171-1.html

So contrary to what CNET, et al, says P-M isn't quite there yet versus P4. It's getting closer, though.

Quote:

I am also open to considering AMDs (hence the Ferrari investigation...)


The Ferrari got terrible reviews and was considered way overpriced. I saw the review for the Ferrari - it spec'ed well but somehow didn't measure well. So...

Quote:

I am looking for biggest bang for the buck. Trying to stay below $2k as this headphone hobby is eating a hole in my pocket.


The Ferrari doesn't have it. Biggest bang are the HP's - the 8000 if you want P4 or the maybe the new 8230 - the Toshiba G25 (nice unit, good feedback), maybe a Dell or two and a few choice others. For instance some of the Dells can be really nice buys!...but only when you catch them on sale. Off sale they are tepid buys, a touch expensive (OK, for the XPS quite expensive)

The third-tier stuff seems pretty cool - "changable" GPU's and nice choices like AMD's - but as you noted they can get really overpriced for what they deliver! Some companies charge really good prices but other companies charge extra just for the 'name' (umm, can we say "Alienware"??
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). "Changable" because a lot of users are reporting that when the tech changes, and the components change, the company changes the interface and shape format...meaning that the new modules don't fit into the old motherboards.

Oooh, did those forum conversations turn ugly!
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Quote:

I seem to be cursed when it comes to Toshiba. Every Toshiba product I've ever had has either crashed and burned, died mysteriously, or stolen.


Yes, I know the feeling. What your curse is, is very common with the previous generations of Toshibas. This was due to the fact that the base system RAM was soldered into the motherboard and the Toshiba-sourced DRAM chips (they always used their own) always failed (probably heat). I've handled all too many customer systems with this particular problem (not to mention my own personal Toshiba...
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)

I cannot say yay or nay on how Tosh is doing now, but all their systems currently use SODIMMS just like everyone else IFAIK, hopefully killing this classic issue dead, dead, dead.
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 4:50 PM Post #12 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by 12thgear
I can see why Intel is pushing the Pentium-M architecture. It has some pretty impressive performance per clock and watt, especially for gaming. It seems like it still lags behind for content creation though.


Well, FWIW I personally don't think it's really performance, but profit. The P-M is a P-III architecture and a much smaller die size and it is on a larger nm process to boot. Lower costs...=higher profits, I'm sure.

Desktop sales are dull and somewhat flat so push into a growing market - laptops - with a less expensive to produce product that you can charge well for due to demand. Good capitalism, I guess.
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 6:39 PM Post #13 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by YamiTenshi
I almost got myself a Sager. But then I ended up getting a HP instead. The Sager is a very nice laptop, but it just didn't fit my needs as well (going to class taking notes, and doing homework). The HP was much cheaper and is essentially the same when only doing light work.

If you are looking for an Alienware laptop you should look into Sager. A lot of their laptops are the same just rebranded, but Sager is cheaper. Unless you REALLY love that alien head, of course.
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Screw the alien head. I was looking at Alienware because of the specs and performance.

I need raw power, good screen size. Storage wise I can always get externals if need be.

So why did you end up with a HP rather than the Sager?

I had a feeling that the Pentium-Ms were a but overhyped. I think a P4HT would work far better.....

Should I be looking at 64-bit configs as well or is that really for the next lappy upgrade?
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 9:01 PM Post #14 of 28
Have you seen the review of the Sager NP-9880 on notebookforums.com?

Just look at the SAGER reviews and benchmarks section.

PC Torque is a few miles away from me...on my way there to say hello
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gs
 
Sep 1, 2005 at 10:53 PM Post #15 of 28
Quote:

Originally Posted by la_marquise
So why did you end up with a HP rather than the Sager?

I had a feeling that the Pentium-Ms were a but overhyped. I think a P4HT would work far better.....



The Sager just didn't fit my needs very well. I wanted a laptop to take to class with me, do my homework on, play music and watch videos. I have a P4 desktop if I ever want to play games or edit videos. Personally I didn't want to get P4 on a laptop, it does get a lot hotter and louder then a PM and the battery life is worse. But that really depends on your needs.

Take Alienware off your list now. There's really no reason to get an AW over a Sager if all you care about is performance.
 

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