[rcgrant]

I've been wondering about this for a while and haven't seen any suggestion of an answer in previous threads: is there any set of high-end headphones considered superior to the DT880 but with a similar sonic signature?

Having just "completed" (we'll see if I stick to that claim in a few months

) my system, I have no immediate plans to upgrade, but I'd like to have something in mind as a basis for future research, if nothing else.

I'm ultimately asking for recommendations here, so I should point out two criteria that I would consider critical if I were to upgrade:
1) The soundstage should be as large or larger than that of the DT880. I A/B'd with a friend's HD600 tonight and IMMEDIATELY realized the superiority of the DT880 soundstage.
2) There should be at least as much bass as the DT880. Uh, let's just say I immediately noticed something else upon switching back to the DT880.

Hmm...I suspect that the AKG K1000 meets the first criterion but not the second. However, if you think it's a good upgrade, go ahead and suggest it (or anything else) for the sake of other curious DT880 owners.

 

[Kirosia]

I've heard the dt880 + HD650, and the latter is better in most respects. Including bass. Alll my opinion of course. =)

 

[bigears]

rcgrant, hi

Take a look at this thread:
http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showt...ida+micro+meet

and this review of Ferbose:
http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=99359

The amp in question is the cheap long hoped amp for the Akg k1000.

Amp:
Sonic T-Amp ($30 USD + $20 USD for PSU = $50 USD) !!!!

Is new digital technology and a huge surprise for the price.

I havent searched much about this, but it seems very promising...

 

[wallijonn]

From the DT880 or CD3000 you'll probably be looking at Grado 1000s or K1000s. Other than that you'll probably be looking at electrostatics and their ilk.

 

[Iron_Dreamer]

To me the OmegaII is the most DT880-like high end headphone. The K1000 lacks the bass extension of the DT880 and can be a bit bright/sharp compared to the DT880 (depending on amplification). The Omegas expand on the best points of the DT880 (soundstage & smoothness) while adding gobs more detail.

 

[rcgrant]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron_Dreamer To me the OmegaII is the most DT880-like high end headphone. The K1000 lacks the bass extension of the DT880 and can be a bit bright/sharp compared to the DT880 (depending on amplification). The Omegas expand on the best points of the DT880 (soundstage & smoothness) while adding gobs more detail.

That's exactly what I wanted to know about the K1000: whether or not it compares to the DT880 in bass. That rules it out.

I've been developing a very strong interest in electrostatic phones. The Omega II is far beyond my price range for the time being, but the SR-404/SRM-313 combo, which seems to be regarded as one of (if not the) best values for headphones, is extremely enticing.

 

[saint.panda]

I thought the Stax 404 resembles the Beyer 880 in some ways: brighter presentation than most headphones with bright in a good sense as opposed to dark. Both have a very-well defined bass with the Beyer 880 having a tighter and more controlled bass than the HD 650 for instance and both headphones share a very good soundstage with the Stax having a more frontal and three dimensional soundstage. The Stax has more liquid highs and mids, too. The Beyerdynamic, however, is more comfortable and has more of that dynamic oomph. If driven adequately, the Beyer 880 is an excellent headphone.

The AKG really is an entire beast on its own: huge soundstage and a sharper sound than both headphones. Actually, I think the AKG K1000's bass is very, very good. Punchy (definately more than the Stax) and clean (cleaner than the HD 650's bass). With my current amplification (cheap Yamaha integrated amp), however, the sound is still a little bit thin and the midrange albeit realistic sounding needs more foundation. It doesn't sound very coherent yet, not a round musical picture.

If you put a lot of priority on soundstage, both the AKG and Stax might be worth and consideration. All Grados save for the PS-1 with bowls have considerably small soundstages so they probably won't be for you. The Stax 404/313 system goes for $700-850 on the used market. An AKG K1000 can be had for around $300-450 on the used market and apparently the Sonic Impact Amp for $30 matches the AKGs quite well. I should be receiving my Sonic Impact hopefully soon so I can't comment on the sound synergy yet. The Stax is quite an value but the AKG with the Sonic Impact should be even more of an value if the expectations can be met (which I hope they will). In the end, it's hard to say what value something has unless it sounds good to you. If you can give the Stax an audition, that'd be good of course. Both the Stax and AKG K1000 are great headphones.

 

[mrsl]

I am looking for a upgrade for my favourite phones which are Stax3030 and Grade SR325 and I wonder if the Beyer DT 880 or AKG K1000 would just be fitting my needs.

I prefer clean and frontal presentation. I love my Grado 325 with my Gilmore Lite, they sound very dynamic, upfront, clean, punchy and have good bass, but they are a bit too bright (can be fixed with equalizing) and also a bit too much coloured in the upper mids. This colouration is often very sweet, especially when listening to female vocals, however it is too much for my taste. My HD-600 and Stax3030 sound more realistic.

In the moment I listen with the Stax3030 system most of the time, since they sound more neutral than Grado 325, very detailed and liquid with nice soundstage and they have the first row presentation I like. But they really do lack the bass punch of the dynamic phones.

I do not like the laid back, a bit dark presentation of my HD-600, so I do not consider the HD-650 as an upgrade.

Reading Taos post I just wonder if the Beyer DT880 would be just perfect for me. I wonder if I should get the AKG K1000, but there seems to be some complaints that they do not have enough deep bass. Is the bass punch of the AKG K1000 better than Stax3030 (or 4040) System?

Or maybe I should try an Alessandro MS-2, since it is reported that they sounds more neutral than SR-325 ? But I fear that the difference to SR-325 will not be enough and that they still sound too coloured.

Regarding my taste (frontal presentation + good quality punchy bass), which upgrade (DT880, AKG K1000, MS-2 or maybe R10, Qualia) should I consider ?

 

[ssportclay]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrsl I am looking for a upgrade for my favourite phones which are Stax3030 and Grade SR325 and I wonder if the Beyer DT 880 or AKG K1000 would just be fitting my needs. I prefer clean and frontal presentation. I love my Grado 325 with my Gilmore Lite, they sound very dynamic, upfront, clean, punchy and have good bass, but they are a bit too bright (can be fixed with equalizing) and also a bit too much coloured in the upper mids. This colouration is often very sweet, especially when listening to female vocals, however it is too much for my taste. My HD-600 and Stax3030 sound more realistic. In the moment I listen with the Stax3030 system most of the time, since they sound more neutral than Grado 325, very detailed and liquid with nice soundstage and they have the first row presentation I like. But they really do lack the bass punch of the dynamic phones. I do not like the laid back, a bit dark presentation of my HD-600, so I do not consider the HD-650 as an upgrade. Reading Taos post I just wonder if the Beyer DT880 would be just perfect for me. I wonder if I should get the AKG K1000, but there seems to be some complaints that they do not have enough deep bass. Is the bass punch of the AKG K1000 better than Stax3030 (or 4040) System? Or maybe I should try an Alessandro MS-2, since it is reported that they sounds more neutral than SR-325 ? But I fear that the difference to SR-325 will not be enough and that they still sound too coloured. Regarding my taste (frontal presentation + good quality punchy bass), which upgrade (DT880, AKG K1000, MS-2 or maybe R10, Qualia) should I consider ?

If you feel Sennheiser cans are too dark and you are looking for headphones with dynamic punchy bass,I don't think the DT880s will do it for you.Try a DT860 with a 120 ohm adapter.These will do the job but they are a bit on the dry side.They are more fun to listen to than the DT880s.

 

[ReDVsion]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrsl Or maybe I should try an Alessandro MS-2, since it is reported that they sounds more neutral than SR-325 ? But I fear that the difference to SR-325 will not be enough and that they still sound too coloured. Regarding my taste (frontal presentation + good quality punchy bass), which upgrade (DT880, AKG K1000, MS-2 or maybe R10, Qualia) should I consider ?

I haven't heard the SR325, so take my impressions with a grain of salt. I owned the MS2s for a time, and while they were not my personal cup of tea, I never got fatigued by their treble, so I suppose that solves your problems with treble energy (if that's what you were referring to). However, they can be somewhat strident in the mids, so I don't know how much of a change that will be from your SR325.

In regards to the DT880s, while they have a somewhat up-front presentation it is by no means as forward as Grados/Alessandros are. However, if you find your Stax system fine in this regard I doubt the DT880s would disappoint. But aren't the DT880s a downgrade, not an upgrade, from this system? Bass can be *quite* punchy, with proper amplification, although I don't know how they'd rate quantitatively to the grados. The Gilmore Lite should be fully capable of driving them.

Hope this helps, although it's hard for me to give you great advice without having heard the gear you have.

P.S. How are them K340s you've got there?

 

[mrsl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReDVsion I haven't heard the SR325, so take my impressions with a grain of salt. I owned the MS2s for a time, and while they were not my personal cup of tea, I never got fatigued by their treble, so I suppose that solves your problems with treble energy (if that's what you were referring to). However, they can be somewhat strident in the mids, so I don't know how much of a change that will be from your SR325.

Seems the MS2 have the same defect as the Grado 325. My Grado is definitely coloured, it has a very pronounced upper mids. To put it to an extreme: Sometimes high male voices would get close to female ones.

The goot point about my Stax3030 and Grado 325 is that they have a very forward (first row or on stage) presentation. The Stax3030 manages to stay amazingly neutral, but lacks a bit of punch in the bass (although bass is there and very clean and tight). The grado has some (not really utterly bad) unnatural colouration, but they have a great bass punch and sound very dynamic.


Quote:

Originally Posted by ReDVsion P.S. How are them K340s you've got there?

The K340 have very nice electrostatic mids. They are somehow unique, since they combine electrostatic and dynamic system.
But they sound dark (as most vintage phones) and have an unclean, distorted bass. I replaced the cables and internal wires, because with the original cables and wiring the top end was almost non existent. They are 20 years old, and for that age, they are amazingly good.

I am dreaming of a stax system combined with a modern high quality dynamic system for great bass punch

I will try my Stax3030 system with my home subwoofer system (a quite decent Canton AS25, which got good marks in German Stereoplay test).

I wonder, since my subwoofer can generate earthquake like bass, could it blow away these micro thin membrane of the Stax phones ?

 

[TonyTripleA]

You have a very nice and refined set of cans in those DT880s. I'd doubt that you'd see massive changes in say HD650s. Allessandro music series pros might give you something "different" - refined, but with punch. Lacking the very impressive soundstage of the DT880s but making their mark in sheer impact and clarity. They might make a nice counterpoint to the DT880s.

The other suggestion I have is etymotics. Only etys will give you even more refined sound for less dollars than the DT880s (IMHO). And they give you such clarity at low volumes, something that's very valuable if you have long listening sessions.

Hope this helps,

TonyAAA