New Esoteric P-05/D-05
Sep 30, 2007 at 3:20 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 91

milkpowder

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Might not be news to some, the Esoteric P-05 Transport and D-05 DAC

http://www.teac.com/esoteric/P-05.html

http://www.teac.com/esoteric/D-05.html


At $7000 a piece, they're not cheap, but not that expensive considering Esoteric's other offerings. My main question about this new duo is where it fits into Esoteric's line-up. $14k for the two units is not that much more than the X-01 Limited, let alone cheaper than the X-01D2. Both can do native DSD decoding, PCM to DSD upconversion, etc... The P-05/D-05 does have seemingly superior equipment, eg 32-bit DACs, dual mono architecture, newest VRDS mechanism, etc... It seems to me there is a lot of overlap in price effectively rendering the X-01D2 and especially the Limited pointless. IIRC, the X-01 Limited does its decoding in PCM. The D-05 is probably a great upgrade for the more basic X-03SE or X-01 Limited enabling native DSD decoding and PCM to DSD upconversion.
 
Sep 30, 2007 at 4:20 PM Post #2 of 91

HiWire

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Has this duo been released yet? Their English-language website doesn't list the specs yet. I'd be interested if I had that kind of money to spare... Esoteric is high on my list when it comes to technology and build quality. I've only listened to one of their older transports so far, though.
 
Sep 30, 2007 at 5:37 PM Post #4 of 91

humanflyz

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I think the P-05/D-05 as the next step up from the DV-60, but there are gaping holes in the Esoteric's lineup: namely, a one-box player that has digital inputs and volume-control.

That said, I think the P-05/D-05 might actually be affordable a year from now on, so I'm already beginning to save
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Oct 1, 2007 at 4:32 AM Post #5 of 91

vcoheda

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looks cool. by the time i can afford one, there should be plenty of used available at pretty reasonable prices. probably won't even want it by then (someone newer will attract my eye). but i am definitely a source first person. i often wonder how much better things may sound with a $10K source (or more). i am by no means unhappy with my G08, but one cannot help but to wonder. i don't really see myself upgrading or changing amps for some time - not even sure what would be a real upgrade other than a B52 - and there aren't many other headphones i am interested in (GS1000, L3000, Ed.9). i doubt anything - minus R10 - is better than what i already have; maybe just different. right now, trying to tweak a little - am considering purchasing some nordost balanced cables (heimdalls).
 
Oct 1, 2007 at 6:18 AM Post #6 of 91

wower

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Your Apache screams for a two box Esoteric front-end Vcoh!
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About the economics of the overlap; that's a very good catch milk. IMO these overlaps and gaps in product lines quickly seperate a good CEO from a bad one. Does these one-box X01L use DSD natively? ( can't understand their product lit.) That would certainly be a plus after my great experience with SACDs.
 
Oct 1, 2007 at 10:22 PM Post #8 of 91

milkpowder

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Quote:

Originally Posted by wower /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Your Apache screams for a two box Esoteric front-end Vcoh!
wink.gif


About the economics of the overlap; that's a very good catch milk. IMO these overlaps and gaps in product lines quickly seperate a good CEO from a bad one. Does these one-box X01L use DSD natively? ( can't understand their product lit.) That would certainly be a plus after my great experience with SACDs.



From the literature of the X-01D2, I can only guess that the X-01L does DSD to PCM then D/A conversion. Forget about the X-01D2. The P-05/D-05 seems like much better value and a more flexible option for future upgrades, eg ditch the D-05 and upgrade to a D-03 whilst still keeping the stellar transport.
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Also, 2 boxes > 1 box
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j/k

For your reference:
"In addition to multi-bit D/A technology, the D2 version includes native direct stream digital (DSD) decoding using 1 bit signal processing converter chips (Analog Devices AD1955), and allows optional PCM to DSD signal conversion capability."
 
Oct 1, 2007 at 10:34 PM Post #9 of 91

immtbiker

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I've had the DV-50 since inception and the only way to get it from me it to pry it out of my cold dead hands (or whatever the saying is
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)
 
Oct 2, 2007 at 5:57 AM Post #10 of 91

wower

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I don't really want a universal player but the new SV60 player, the one that only plays redbook and SACD, looks great. Your compliments about the DV50 are encourging biker.

Reading the reviews on the two-unit Esoterics, the one unit versions are reported being so close sonically that's its hard to justify the space and extra cost really IMO. (They were talking about the P01/D01 compared to the X01L.) One author, I think it was the 6moons, purposed that perhaps at this level there are sonic trade offs in having a two-unit system in regards to having transport and DAC super close in the same chassis. Who knows....? I kind of work on the premise that once you hit $5000 or so it's really about picking what sonic pretension one perfers rather than which player is emperically better. Those Esoterics get so much detail off the disk over the whole bandwith it's amazing, in that case, its fair to question the musicality of the players. I should add I've never even gotten remotely close to a dedicated listen session with one of these units, having basically only stood beside a couple of them and watch them spit out disks... Love the brand though, you could roll them down a hill without a scratch.
 
Oct 2, 2007 at 6:41 AM Post #11 of 91

Icarium

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Having talked to Alex Peychev of APL hifi who has modded/examined many players in his work and through his partnership with Esoteric.

He tells me the transport in the X-01 Limited (And X-01/UX-1/UX-1 Limited) is actually superior to the transports used in the P-03/X-01 D2 (Which shares the same transport as the P-03) as it is the same transport as in the P-01. Basically those units have the all steel/magnesium platter transport while the P-03/X-01 D2 and probably the UX-1 Pi or whatever the upcoming version of the UX-1 is have/will have some sort of steel/aluminum version of the VRDS Neo. Cheaper to make and all that.

Does that difference matter? Probably very minimally if at all. But just to clarify things.

Having heard the flagship APL re-designed UX-1, the NWO 3.0 GO through both Alex Peychev's speaker rig in his treated room and my Singlepower SDS/Qualias. I can conclusively say that the DAC/output stage solutions that Esoteric offers both in my UX-1 and the P-03/D-03 I've heard is not the best possible ;p Nice transport/power supply and chassis though.
 
Oct 2, 2007 at 9:50 AM Post #12 of 91

wower

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It boggles my mind that the output stages are not perfect in these high-end units and can be improved on. Not having heard them myeslf, I can believe your comments simply because the modders wouldn't offer them if they weren't needed (or their wasn't demend). This connects with the another thread about the top-teir Marantz SA-7 being modded. To concluded: this hobby is stupid.
 
Oct 2, 2007 at 8:28 PM Post #14 of 91

Icarium

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I like how the Esoteric sounds and its enough to tide me over until I have the cash for various mods. What bothers me the most is that the balanced output is actually just single ended split with opamps :/ Which is sad panda in a top notch player.

When Alex was re-aligning my transport (Got dropped in shipment and the tray was heavily misaligned i.e. wouldn't come fully out when you hit open) he pointed out all the op amps in the thing. There are fricken tons all over the place. Not even the more highly regarded ones. Meh, APL's redesign is fully discrete though.
 
Oct 2, 2007 at 8:37 PM Post #15 of 91

milkpowder

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Like wower, I would've expected a top-end manufacturer to Esoteric to not skimp on parts.

@ Icarium: It's interesting you say that the bal. XLR output is merely a split SE. I swear the XLR out of the X-03SE sounds better than the SE
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Have you compared the two on your UX-1?
 

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