[BlueScorpion33]

Hi, this my first post in the Head-Fi discussion threads.

I am new to higher quality sound, so my terminology is not very clear. I'm still having trouble describing sound liek you guys.

Anyway, I have been using JVC RX700s (bought it after some good reviews from here and for their value) for a year now to lsiten to music and movies and I have been loving them, but I wanting to try out other headphones for quite some time. That is why I have been looking on ebay for used DT150s, 770s, 880s, 990s, SR60s, HD55s and D2000s at resonable price for the past few months and I finally won an auction for a pair of used Beyerdynamic 150s at a good price (£50). I like the way the DT150 sounds, it sounds somewhat similar to the RX700s but more clearer and with more and better bass.

I listen to mostly to Hip-hop, rap and R&B, but also some electronic genres so I like bass but not overly boomy out of control bass like how the Skullcandys sound (I used to own a pair of Skullcandy before I got the RX700). The DT150 sounds great but I find them quite uncomfortable as their headband pressure is fairly high and their thin edged leather earpads are not as comfortable as the RX700 wider earpads.

Thats is why I now want to upgrade to higher quality headphones to listen to my music (I will keep using the RX7000 for movies and games) that sound better than the RX700 or even the DT150 but with more comfort.

After some research on these forums I have come down too these two headphones to buy next:

Sennheiser HD650 and Denon AH-D2000

Now I don't how much they each cost in the states, brand new, but here in the UK the HD650 are currently selling for £230 on amazon and the D2000 for £200 from AdvancedMP3Players.com (good and reputable company), brand new. Those prices for brand new 650 and D2000 seems quite like a deal cos they cost a lot more at RRP and even used ones at ebay sell very close to those prices. At brand new, those prices are just within my budget so I am thinking of buying one, just don't know which one.

I also looked at DT880s and DT990s but even used one of those are selling near £230 so they are out of my budget at the moment.

So can you guys help me out and suggest which heaphones (HD650 or D2000) I should buy?

Things to factor in:

which are better for Hip hop, RnB and electronic genres?

which is more comfortable?

which has better bass overall?

which would sound better with my equipment (I mainly use the heaphone out on my Marantz SR4200 receiver but I also have a cmoy and PA2V2 amp)?

Or do you guys think that a DT770 80 (priced at £130 new) is as good as a DT150 but with more comfort and so I shouldn't bother wasting more money getting a HD650 or a D2000?

I would also welcome other headphone suggestion that are suited to the genres I listen to, but please don't suggest any headphones with a coiled stock cable as I can't stand coiled cables on headphones.

Thank you.

 

[Crazy*Carl]

People here are going to argue that a good electronic or rap headphone should have lots of bass, like the D2000. I disagree. These genres have alot of bass to start with, so why would you need to add more with a headphone with alot of bass?

If you really like alot of bass, then the D2000 or Ultrasone HFI series is a good choice. It is powerful and punchy but not bloated or bassy.

Also, do you have dedicated amplification? The neutral headphones I listed are benefited by it. However the ultrasone HFI780 does well out of anything. If that is out of your budget, the HFI580 is still a good headphone.

It comes down to what you like, but the more neutral headphones (HD600, K701, DT880) can still be great for these genres.

 

[socalguy124]

definitely take hd650 off your shortlist...they're not suitable for your music preferences.

if your not using an amp, the ultrasones would be a good choice. on the other hand, if you do have a good amp, i like the d2000 for your genres.

 

[BlueScorpion33]

Thanks Crazy*Carl for your reply, I will take your suggestions into consideration.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl /img/forum/go_quote.gif Also, do you have dedicated amplification?

The only heaphone amps I have at moment are a PA2V2, a cMoyBB and a FiiO E5. However I use the headphone out on my Marantz SR4200 receiver, which is connected to my PCs Xonar D2 sound card via a s/pdif coaxial cable.

I compared the sound produced by my headphones amps to the sound produced by the Marantz SR4200 with my DT150s (250 ohms) and I couldn't hear much of a difference, if anything I think the sound produced by the Marantz receivers headphone out socket sounded a bit better than my headphone amps.

I think my Marantz SR4200 receiver is good enough to drive most heaphones well enough.


Quote:

Originally Posted by socalguy124 /img/forum/go_quote.gif definitely take hd650 off your shortlist...they're not suitable for your music preferences.

Really?

The 650 is on my shortlist because I looked on a few threads here at head-fi about which headpones are good for hip-hop and the 650 seemed to be a popular choice for hip-hop by many members.

 

[socalguy124]

hd650s are popular for classical music, jazz and other laid back genres. i don't think they would be a good match for you.

i respectfully disagree with crazycarl's assessment on neutral phones being good for your taste. i think you do need a phone thats fun...a phone that will make you want to bob your head. neutral phones don't do that for me when i listen to rock, hip hop, trance, or electronic.

i have the d7000 with a good dac/amp and they are fantastic for hip hop and electronic. the d2000 should do well with those genres if you can EQ them. the d2000 bass can be overbearing and fatiguing at times...many members claim that the d2000 respond really well when EQing.

 

[Crazy*Carl]

I listen to about 30-40% trance, and the HD580 are wonderful for it. Harder Rock is their weakest area, but they are still more than adequate for it. I think the strongest area is pop and classical/orchestral, though I really consider the 580/600 a great all rounder. When you listen to a wide variety, it is important.

EQing can turn the most bass light headphones into a monsters, but I don't believe in doing it. It really messes with the sound. I used to be a bass EQ addict. Neutral is the way to go.

 

[richierich]

Do not go with the HD650's for your music preferences. I would go with the D2000s.

 

[socalguy124]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl /img/forum/go_quote.gif I listen to about 30-40% trance, and the HD580 are wonderful for it. Harder Rock is their weakest area, but they are still more than adequate for it. I think the strongest area is pop and classical/orchestral, though I really consider the 580/600 a great all rounder. When you listen to a wide variety, it is important. EQing can turn the most bass light headphones into a monsters, but I don't believe in doing it. It really messes with the sound. I used to be a bass EQ addict. Neutral is the way to go.

yeah i imagine that juicing up the bass on a bass light phone would not benefit the overall sound. but when i eq my d7000 to tone down the bass a bit, i get really good results.

 

[Crazy*Carl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by socalguy124 /img/forum/go_quote.gif yeah i imagine that juicing up the bass on a bass light phone would not benefit the overall sound. but when i eq my d7000 to tone down the bass a bit, i get really good results.

I dunno, I just would not want a headphone that I would have to do that with.

 

[NapalmK]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy*Carl /img/forum/go_quote.gif People here are going to argue that a good electronic or rap headphone should have lots of bass, like the D2000. I disagree. These genres have alot of bass to start with, so why would you need to add more with a headphone with alot of bass? If you really like alot of bass, then the D2000 or Ultrasone HFI series is a good choice. It is powerful and punchy but not bloated or bassy. Also, do you have dedicated amplification? The neutral headphones I listed are benefited by it. However the ultrasone HFI780 does well out of anything. If that is out of your budget, the HFI580 is still a good headphone. It comes down to what you like, but the more neutral headphones (HD600, K701, DT880) can still be great for these genres.

I completely agree with this statement. My listening preferences are about 90% or so trance. I also consider myself a basshead and if you want bass I'd go with Ultrasone HFI-780's or Pro 750's (which are the bassiest phones I've tried so far) followed by the D2000's. For the genres of music you listen to I think it's hard to beat the Ultrasone or Denon sound.

 

[BlueScorpion33]

Thank you for your suggestion guys.

Now I am leaning towards the D2000.

I am also looking at the Ultrasone HFI780, but their design looks nearly the same as the Skullcandy SK Pro DJ headphones and I used own those Skullcandys a couple of years ago and I hate them. There very uncomfortable, as they clamp down on your head and their synthetic leather ear pads are not good for longtime wear at all and it seems that the Ultrasone HFI780 uses the same headband and synthetic leather ear pads as the Skullcandy SK Pro DJ, so I am reluctant to buy the 780s.

The D2000s on the other hand are suppose to be very comfortable and I like its design, so even though the D2000s is bit more expensive than the 780s, I guess I will buy the D2000s and try them out.

 

[jeremyzone]

I've owned or currently own the DT770 Pro (80 ohm), HD650s, and DT990 Premium (600 ohm).

I would say definitely NOT the HD650s for your listening preferences. They are great cans but not for hip hop or R&B. My favorite for this music type is the DT990 but you already said it is out of your price range. (B&H Photo still has the DT990 at $229, but shipping to UK would be $57 so it would be £186 according to Google). The DT990s need a dedicated headphone amp though, especially the 600 ohm version. The DT770s are decent cans, but I ended up not liking their muddiness so I sold them. I don't think I would recommend them.

Sorry I can't comment about the D2000. I liked the D7000 when I tried it at a meet so I guess I liked the Denon sound signature.

 

[Poetik]

I've owned both the HD650 / D2000's and you should definitely go with the D2000's for the genre's you listened to. I wanted so bad for the sennheiser 650's to be my ultimate go to phone especially because of all the encouraging reviews on here. I wanted to really like a more neutral/open sound but after I heard the beauty of a Denon I knew that I had to have one. Sure the HD650 is a great headphone and all but I'm not a person who spends his evenings listening to Beethoven or the lords of the rings soundtrack.

Also feel free to mess with the EQ (I was real adamant about not touching the eq before, probably because of the "degrading" of sound quality that I've read about on here) but I found that a couple DB boost in the 2-3k region of the Denons doesn't hurt at all. Maybe it does "technically" degrade the sound quality a little bit but I felt like it helped immensely with the vocals. After all the mid range is what most people on here knock about the Denons. There is no perfect headphone out there but there are headphones that can fit the basic essentials of what you consider perfect. I believe I found mine with a pair of D7000's with a slight mid-range boost.

To answer your questions:

Which are better for Hip hop, RnB and electronic genres? I would say the D2000 because with bass heavy genre's why not have a headphone that can depict the bass better. The HD650 is bass heavy for an "open" headphone which is not too much at all. It can depict a kick drum well but it's inability to really produce those sub frequencies hurts it in those genre's. I would say that the 650's do vocals a bit better and the sound stage is noticeably larger. To get the best out of the HD650's bass you need a nice amp for it as well. With the D2000's even though the sound stage is small you can always add J$ pads to increase it a bit. It wont be as spacious as an HD650 but it'll probably be the best a closed headphone can offer.

Which is more comfortable? I would go with the Denon's here as well especially if you get the j$ pads. On my sennheisers the clamp is a little tight (there is a thread which shows you how to fix this though so it's not a big deal). It's just that the leather J$ pads are so plush and leather so it feels more solid on my ears. I'm a buyer/seller by nature and with the HD650's I felt that if I wore them too long the earpad foam would loosen too much and my resale value would go down. I have yet to test out the J$ pads in the summer time though so I'm not sure if the leather will be a burden. I always make it a point to be out talking / mingling with barely dressed females during summer time anyways so I will probably never experience the cons of leather pads in the summer time.

Which has better bass overall? I would say that HD650 has a more accurate reproduction of the the higher bass notes while the D2000 reigns supreme in sub frequencies. I do like quality over quantity but when comparing the two in bass heavy genre's the HD650 just doesn't have enough bass. As you can tell I preferred the Denon.

(I'll add in one more for you) Value? As for as value I'd go with the D2000's. They are low impedance so you can run them off of a lot of sources. When I had the HD650's I ended up buying 2 woo audio amps because they need power (had to try a modded and unmodded WA6 so I could see what the fuss was about). This site is definitely not good for your wallet. I came to my senses (well sort of) and figured out which 1 headphone I wanted to keep for myself. I ended up going with the D2000's and selling everything else. I already I knew that with keeping the D2000's I would always yearn for the higher end of the Denons lineup. With reading this site it made me spend an extra $500 to upgrade to the D7000's, which later on lead to another $200 on the LA wooden cups, and which will probably lead on to spending $400 on a ridiculous jena cable upgrade. In a time where the economy here isn't it's best I still can rationalize a $400 headphone cable upgrade... Thanks head-fi.

Anyways I hope that helps man.

 

[Crazy*Carl]

Ya, I understand you about the excessive spending of money here. Can be ridiculous at times. Get headphones first, then worry about DAC's and amps later. Headphones by far make more of a difference.

BlueScorpion33, you'll be in good hands with the D2000.

 

[Crazy*Carl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NapalmK /img/forum/go_quote.gif I completely agree with this statement. My listening preferences are about 90% or so trance. I also consider myself a basshead and if you want bass I'd go with Ultrasone HFI-780's or Pro 750's (which are the bassiest phones I've tried so far) followed by the D2000's. For the genres of music you listen to I think it's hard to beat the Ultrasone or Denon sound.

90% trance and basshead, so its understandable you disagree.