[MarkWalsham]

Hi everyone, new here, and wanted to ask some advice!

Background

I have been a long term Apple user, originally using an iPod, then various models of iPhone, right up to today, using an iPhone XS Max. I listen to a mixture of music styles, ranging from Classical, Rock, Electronica, Jazz and Funk, and have started to move toward hi-res audio.

Why?

Over the last few months, I have got back into building a hi-fi system, and using this, it is abundantly clear that the standard of music offered up from Apple, Spotify and others leaves a lot to be desired, especially when put through even the most modest of hi-fi systems (comprising of reasonable components from the late 90's). The more I have listened to various sources (M4A, MP3 etc) the more it has pushed me into the position I am in now.

Problem

I have started to investigate so called 'Lossless' formats, and some of the other audio formats that promise much, and have moved a lot of my library toward AIFF, WAV and FLAC. But as these are all from Redbook CD sources, they are constrained by 16/44 format. I then dived into DSD format and have found these sound much better than standard audio formats.

The iPhone does not easily support FLAC, DSD or PCM formats.

I want a device in the £200-£250 price range that will be a significant step up from the audio output from the Apple iPhone XS Max.

My ideas

So given that I am not happy with the audio file support, nor the hardware support with my iPhone XS Max, I am starting to think that maybe a separate DAP might be an idea. I have also read extensively on this forum, that the LG V30 seems an alternative too.

I also want to move away from my existing Bose QC35's and Sony IEM's, both of which were not budget items, but do not cut it for me.

So - sorry for the long post, but I am really asking this - would a DAP or a LG V30 offer a significant step up over the iPhone when paired with a (and please recommend) pair of IEM's.

I do not have a big budget - probably £400 Maximum for a device, storage and IEM's that offer the step up I am looking for.

No easy task I guess, but appreciate any guidance you can provide to this novice.

Cheers, Mark.

 

[voxie]

Hi Mark, within your requirements and budget maybe check out Fiio's range of Dap's and FinalAudio E Series iems.

 

[buke9]

Hi everyone, new here, and wanted to ask some advice!

Background

I have been a long term Apple user, originally using an iPod, then various models of iPhone, right up to today, using an iPhone XS Max. I listen to a mixture of music styles, ranging from Classical, Rock, Electronica, Jazz and Funk, and have started to move toward hi-res audio.

Why?

Over the last few months, I have got back into building a hi-fi system, and using this, it is abundantly clear that the standard of music offered up from Apple, Spotify and others leaves a lot to be desired, especially when put through even the most modest of hi-fi systems (comprising of reasonable components from the late 90's). The more I have listened to various sources (M4A, MP3 etc) the more it has pushed me into the position I am in now.

Problem

I have started to investigate so called 'Lossless' formats, and some of the other audio formats that promise much, and have moved a lot of my library toward AIFF, WAV and FLAC. But as these are all from Redbook CD sources, they are constrained by 16/44 format. I then dived into DSD format and have found these sound much better than standard audio formats.

The iPhone does not easily support FLAC, DSD or PCM formats.

I want a device in the £200-£250 price range that will be a significant step up from the audio output from the Apple iPhone XS Max.

My ideas

So given that I am not happy with the audio file support, nor the hardware support with my iPhone XS Max, I am starting to think that maybe a separate DAP might be an idea. I have also read extensively on this forum, that the LG V30 seems an alternative too.

I also want to move away from my existing Bose QC35's and Sony IEM's, both of which were not budget items, but do not cut it for me.

So - sorry for the long post, but I am really asking this - would a DAP or a LG V30 offer a significant step up over the iPhone when paired with a (and please recommend) pair of IEM's.

I do not have a big budget - probably £400 Maximum for a device, storage and IEM's that offer the step up I am looking for.

No easy task I guess, but appreciate any guidance you can provide to this novice.

Cheers, Mark.

Well have not heard a V30 but as you have said it is well regarded. I like my little HiBy R3 it is a very versatile player that will play just about any format PCM 384 32 bit and DSD 256 as well as DLNA,WiFi,Bluetooth and AirPlay. It has a balanced 2.5mm output as well and they suggest 8 to 100 ohms head/earphones but with a balanced 2.5mm cable it will play the HD-6xx’s just fine. It says 11 hour playback time but have not tested it but it does give me 9 hours for a workday but not balanced with 30% or so left so I think they are close. Can use up to a 2TB micro sd card with a 20k song limit and no onboard memory.
Iem’s so many it is crazy at this price range. For a fun one iBasso IT01 I think is very good.

 

[PurpleAngel]

Hi everyone, new here, and wanted to ask some advice!
Background
I have been a long term Apple user, originally using an iPod, then various models of iPhone, right up to today, using an iPhone XS Max. I listen to a mixture of music styles, ranging from Classical, Rock, Electronica, Jazz and Funk, and have started to move toward hi-res audio.
My ideas
So given that I am not happy with the audio file support, nor the hardware support with my iPhone XS Max, I am starting to think that maybe a separate DAP might be an idea. I have also read extensively on this forum, that the LG V30 seems an alternative too.
I also want to move away from my existing Bose QC35's and Sony IEM's, both of which were not budget items, but do not cut it for me.
So - sorry for the long post, but I am really asking this - would a DAP or a LG V30 offer a significant step up over the iPhone when paired with a (and please recommend) pair of IEM's.
I do not have a big budget - probably £400 Maximum for a device, storage and IEM's that offer the step up I am looking for.
No easy task I guess, but appreciate any guidance you can provide to this novice. Cheers, Mark.

I would say to buy (spend) for whatever headphones or IEMs that you like the sound of,
before looking for something else, besides your iPhone, for driving the headphone/IEM.
So after buying the headphones/IEMs (that you like the sound off), see how much of your audio budget is leftover, for buy a DAP.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Problem

I have started to investigate so called 'Lossless' formats, and some of the other audio formats that promise much, and have moved a lot of my library toward AIFF, WAV and FLAC. But as these are all from Redbook CD sources, they are constrained by 16/44 format.

If you ripped Redbook 16/44.1 to FLAC you get a lossless copy of the original Redbook 16/44.1.

If you want a "lossless" copy of the master disc where that Redbook copy comes from buy it from HDTracks in 24/96.

I then dived into DSD format and have found these sound much better than standard audio formats.

DSD isn't more lossless than 24/96 considering the audio tracks aren't usually digitized direct to DSD, it just gets converted.

Also the really telling difference is made by how much better the mastering is for the DSD versions, ie they're not designed to be played over the radio among other things and is specifically for audiophiles, but there are quite a few badly mastered DSD copies as well so look out for those.

I want a device in the £200-£250 price range that will be a significant step up from the audio output from the Apple iPhone XS Max.

Provided the files being played through are the same, almost all that improvement will be due to the cleaner amplification circuit providing a lot more power...provided whatever you've been using on the iPhone actually ends up needing a lot more clean power than the iPhone can dish out (meaning the iPhone was distorting with it).

So given that I am not happy with the audio file support, nor the hardware support with my iPhone XS Max, I am starting to think that maybe a separate DAP might be an idea. I have also read extensively on this forum, that the LG V30 seems an alternative too.

Either way just be aware that you're not just changing hardware, you'll be changing software too.

So - sorry for the long post, but I am really asking this - would a DAP or a LG V30 offer a significant step up over the iPhone when paired with a (and please recommend) pair of IEM's.

I do not have a big budget - probably £400 Maximum for a device, storage and IEM's that offer the step up I am looking for.

You'd probably hear a lot more difference blowing most if not all that money on an IEM and just using the iPhone for a while.

 

[Subdusted]

Most likely. Another question is whether you want your setup to be portable or it's going to sit on your desk. Right now there are plenty of decent chinese players of Cain, Fiio, Shanling, iBasso type. This is the easy way. But gradually building a full-blown setup with separates is a lot more fun...a lot more expensive too. You need to decide whether it's going to be your full-time hobby or it's just something you're not ready to invest your time and money in.

 

[PaganDL]

Hi @MarkWalsham,

Agree with @ProtegeManiac & to extend on his points,

Good quality, well recorded source material makes a lot of difference, regardless of format, so I suggest looking into finding said sources & decent IEMs FIRST AS PRIORITY before anything else, even a DAP...
Streaming services & even Youtube can help determine whether something sounds good to you or not too...
Though I be curious to know which Sony IEMs you have or had which weren't budget & not good for you.
What do you actually listen to in both music & media so a better sense can be had on what to recommend as regardless what head gear or DAP, some complement &/or synergise better with different genres over others.
As @ProtegeManiac, a lot of Redbook & DSD is quite poorly recorded which is kind of ridiculous but that's often like life but I digress...

Lots of demos, lots & lots of demos help a lot on deciding what is good for you sound wise as no one has your hearing, ear & head shape.

Cowon Plenue D & Plenue D2 I would also suggest looking at as more than decent DAPs which fit your budget & requirements.

Hope you have a great day !

 

[MarkWalsham]

Thanks everyone for your kind help and replies, I hadn't appreciated that there were so many different perspectives on this stuff!! But then again, I am quite new to this area.

OK, so the general advice I see is 1) decent source material and 2) decent IEM's.

Given that I will need to do a bit of research on 1) above, as I think the catalogues of the bands I listen to most (Queen, Level 42, Robert Cray Band, Yello, Chris Rea, Camel, Caravan) are not readily available in high bit rate high depth recording formats (and a lot of the music is 30+ years old too), I shall have to concentrate on 2).

I value clarity, detail, wide sound stage, good separation and clean and sharp mids and treble. Yes bass is nice, but I am not a bass head, I prefer a more neutral bass reproduction, weighty but not booming. IEM's need to be comfortable too, as I moved to the Bose QC35's over the ear headphones, as I found ear buds were uncomfortable after 60mins of use.

Given these criteria, and a budget of say max £150 - can anyone recommend a few models that I could try out of IEM's?

I have also found a bargain Sony NW-A45 for £50, which I am in the process of obtaining too - second hand, as this would be my first DAP, thought it might be a good stepping stone to more exotic and invariably more expensive kit as time rolls by. I did a search for reviews of the A45 on here, but just found a very long thread talking about it's release, features and not much about SQ or day to day usage. What do you folks think about this player - waste of money or good starting point?

I tend to want to use this equipment out and about - so not really looking for kit that will sit alongside the PC and Hi-Fi system, as my office is also my listening room with the Hi-Fi system in it, and I use that for music playback most of the time, and to be honest, that listening is less critical as it's for just background enjoyment. When I am out and about, I have the time to listen carefully, and hence wanting something better!

Thanks again everyone,

Mark.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Given that I will need to do a bit of research on 1) above, as I think the catalogues of the bands I listen to most (Queen, Level 42, Robert Cray Band, Yello, Chris Rea, Camel, Caravan) are not readily available in high bit rate high depth recording formats (and a lot of the music is 30+ years old too), I shall have to concentrate on 2).

Check HDTracks.com. I'm sure Queen is there. Even Dream Theater isn't even available in other formats than 24/96.

 

[MarkWalsham]

I checked out HDTracks.com and used the Artist option, clicked on Q, and then found Queen. What popped up was a summary/bio of the band, but then says below “no results”.

I notice that some of the albums have been released on MQA CD’s in Japan, but they are pricey!

Even if I bought them, I don’t know how I would rip them to enable them to be loaded to a DAP.

Shame.

 

[PopZeus]

FiiO is a good starter company to go with if you're new to audiophile gear. They tend to make products that are well designed and affordable, with good quality-of-life choices, such as ease-of-use, reliability, accessories included, and the like. So many audiophile companies are smaller, so they don't have the resources for R&D and manufacturing that FiiO does. DAC/amp or DAP-wise, FiiO is a pretty safe bet, even if there are other companies that might make gear that better suits your ears, they might not have the level of fit and finish you're used to coming from Apple or other mainstream consumer electronics companies like Sony.

As far as IEMs go, FiiO has the FH1, which is a pretty great deal at $75. But if you can step up to ~2x the cost, the Final Audio E4000, or the Moondrop Kanas Pro are kinda owning the below-$200 price range. What you're getting with those options is a neutral-ish sound with a small bass lift that makes them less boring. If you like a slightly brighter or V-shaped sound, people seem to love the iBasso IT01 at around $100, or the Campfire Audio Comet at $200. Tuning preferences are pretty subjective, and so everyone has to discover what their ears prefer on their own. All of these IEMs are solid technical performers for their price though, so besides differences in frequency response and design, they are pretty safe recommendations. What all these IEMs share is the ability to swap, replace or upgrade the cable.

 

[buke9]

I checked out HDTracks.com and used the Artist option, clicked on Q, and then found Queen. What popped up was a summary/bio of the band, but then says below “no results”.

I notice that some of the albums have been released on MQA CD’s in Japan, but they are pricey!

Even if I bought them, I don’t know how I would rip them to enable them to be loaded to a DAP.

Shame.

The thing is it is so hard to get a handle on HiRez as some 24 bit and others is remastered so it will sound different than the cd but mostly they just up the loudness on most remasters and if it is louder it usually sounds better at first glance. Does MQA sound a bit better from my Dragonfly Red yes it does but does it sound better than say a normal Tidal HiFi of the same song from my Yggdrasil the answer to that is not a chance and no. I do find a bit of difference in some 24 and DSD music but am I going to get my library re bought to get just a bit better I think not. If yo want to spend the money on HiRez audio then do it if it makes you happy .

 

[MarkWalsham]

The thing is it is so hard to get a handle on HiRez as some 24 bit and others is remastered so it will sound different than the cd but mostly they just up the loudness on most remasters and if it is louder it usually sounds better at first glance. Does MQA sound a bit better from my Dragonfly Red yes it does but does it sound better than say a normal Tidal HiFi of the same song from my Yggdrasil the answer to that is not a chance and no. I do find a bit of difference in some 24 and DSD music but am I going to get my library re bought to get just a bit better I think not. If yo want to spend the money on HiRez audio then do it if it makes you happy .

I have certainly noticed that a number of remasters released in 2011 (specifically Queen) that these seem to have been subject to the so called Brickwalling where the volume has been pushed, which is something I don’t really like at all. As you say, the first listen is attractive, but that soon wears off and listening fatigue kicks in.

So if hi-res files are difficult to source, are we saying that the best I can get is decent lossless encoded Red Book CD’s resolution only?

I am worried that getting a better pair of IEM’s will reveal more sonic impurities from my existing files, hence making the search for better material (which is tricky) the only option left.

Decent IEM’s are the way to go for sure, but I still not clear in my mind where I can get the best possible source material as I read so many conflicting messages about DSD, MQA and other formats that I am not sure where to go next.

Cheers, Mark.

 

[Subdusted]

The DSD hype is overrated. First of all, there is very little material actually recorded in DSD. 24-96 is still studios' standard. The fact that they were later upsampled to DSD doesn't mean that all of a sudden some new information appeared in the recording that previously wasn't there.
Also, the most amazing stereo setups I have ever heard ( and I've auditioned quite a few, it's part of my job ) were built on RedBook CD players/transports. The potential there is huge.