[jpr703]

In my search for a new source, I was lucky enough to be able to audition a Naim CD5x for a few days. Coming after the Apollo and the CD5i (my local dealer has been very generous with demo time) this player was by far the best of the bunch.

As I mentioned before, I really liked the CD5i, but the CD5x really does take the music to another level. Comparing the two, the 5x added quite a bit of speed, detail and instrument seperation that just wasn't there on the 5i.

At first, the 5x seemed to loose a little bit of the extreme "groove" that the 5i had. As I listened more it became apparent that the bass on the 5i is tighter. After more time with the player I could hear that "groove" again, but it was more in the upper bass region. As a standalone unit, the 5x does not have as much low bass as the 5i and this gives it a different sound. However, the 5x is upgradeable via an add-on power supply and I'd suspect that adding a Flatcap or Hi-cap might change that bass difference.

Music really flowed through the 5x. As I listened carefully, there were many great technical merits to the unit that I took note of. However, I found that critical listening was actually difficult to do for long periods of time with this unit. As I sat trying to concentrate, I would just loose myself in the music time and time again. The Naim players really just suck you right in and provide a tremendously enjoyable experience. I've never had as much fun listening to a new CDP as I did with the CD5x.

Unfortunately, neither unit is cheap and I just don't think I have the budget right now for the 5x. As much as I'd like to swing it, I may need a pimp to come up with that kind of coin!

 

[milkpowder]

May I tempt you with the CDX2?

It's really worth it! I dare you to audition it...

Can you imagine the CD5x, but better in almost every conceivable way?

I'll shut up.

 

[tyrion]

I am not happy about this. My local dealer just got a 5x in and it's sitting in a box. I hope he never takes it out of the box. I am really happy with the CD5i and don't want to be tempted.

 

[jpr703]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyrion I am not happy about this. My local dealer just got a 5x in and it's sitting in a box. I hope he never takes it out of the box. I am really happy with the CD5i and don't want to be tempted.

Don't listen to it!!! Naim gear is more addictive than crack--more expensive too!

 

[tyrion]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpr703 Don't listen to it!!! Naim gear is more addictive than crack--more expensive too!

If it was only that easy.

I think I will borrow it for the meet on 6/10. We can do a little CD5x v. CD5i shootout.

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkpowder May I tempt you with the CDX2? It's really worth it! I dare you to audition it... Can you imagine the CD5x, but better in almost every conceivable way? I'll shut up.

Actually, I prefered a CD5X even with an Olive HC over a bare CDX2 for the money.

I thought that a bare CDX2 is just too much $$ for what it delivers at the price. This player really needs an XPS2 to be worthwhile.

 

[milkpowder]

The CDX2 is very expensive with the XPS2 PS. I haven't listened to this combo, but apparently, it brings the CDX2 closer to CDS3 level.

I personally found the CDX2 superior to the CD5x. I auditioned using speakers (ProAc D38) driven by Naim NAP250/NAC282/HiCap. I think that the CD5x is rather limited when used with slightly higher end gear. The CDX2 seemed to fit in perfectly. On the other hand, the CD5x fit in better with Naim NAP200/NAC202 driving Naim Allaes. I haven't listened to either on headphones.

 

[kuma]

milkpowder.
Certainly you are not going to get any argument from many Naimies.

A CDX2 is a better player than a CD5X.

But take it outside of a Naim context.
A 5k$ is a lot of money for a CD player and there are many others that can compete within the peer group.

Have you tried a *capped* CD5x?
You'll be surprised.

Personaly I won't spend an over 5k$ on a CDX2 but I would on a CDX2/XPS2. The latter just has more going for it even at almost twice the cost compared to other similarly priced CD players. imho.

BTW, a CDX2/XPS2 does not sound like a CDS3/XPS2.
A CDS3 is a different kettle of fish. ( it's more roundearth )

 

[JayGee]

Maybe my ears are more sensitive than most but the CDX2 is too bright or digital for me. Not a natural sound like other Naim CD players I've heard.

I've listened to the CDX2 it in several set-ups and I like it at first but there is something in the sound that just makes my ears tired.

Jaygee

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayGee Not a natural sound like other Naim CD players I've heard.

An even a CDX/XPS2, or better yet, CDX/555PS have more of that than a bare CDX2. A lot closer to an LP12/ARO/XX2 in my rig anyways.

 

[fishski13]

jpr703,
dude, welcome to the fold. you have an excellent kit, and as much as i like the nad 542 at the price, i think that you're on the right track by looking at more capable sources if you feel the need to improve. i would also suggest looking at s/h cd5 at around $1200. but then again life's short, sometimes you just gotta jump off the deep end and see where it takes you. it's only hi-fi, but if you're posting here, you must be a bit passionate and weird

. so here's what i would do. what could you get for all of you gear s/h with the exception of one pair of your grados? sell it all and get a headline2/flatcap2(x) or hicap/cd5(x). s/h, you could get into this for a little bit more than $2k, especially if you went for a cd5 instead of cd5x. try it - you only live once.

PACE

 

[jpr703]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishski13 jpr703, dude, welcome to the fold. you have an excellent kit, and as much as i like the nad 542 at the price, i think that you're on the right track by looking at more capable sources if you feel the need to improve. i would also suggest looking at s/h cd5 at around $1200. but then again life's short, sometimes you just gotta jump off the deep end and see where it takes you. it's only hi-fi, but if you're posting here, you must be a bit passionate and weird . so here's what i would do. what could you get for all of you gear s/h with the exception of one pair of your grados? sell it all and get a headline2/flatcap2(x) or hicap/cd5(x). s/h, you could get into this for a little bit more than $2k, especially if you went for a cd5 instead of cd5x. try it - you only live once. PACE

Freaky, I was just thinking about that. The problem is finding all that stuff second hand. Plus I'm a little concerned about how a Headline 2 will compare to my MPX3 Slam (that Slam is a hell of an amp).

One thing I noticed with both Naim units is that their RCA implementation still isn't quite right yet. Both players exhibit a slight buzz in the right channel when using the RCAs. With the DINs they're both dead slient. Even though the buzz isn't noticeable with the music playing, it can't help but make you wonder whether or not switching to the DINs might have some additional SQ benefits.

I'm also a little confused on how much power supply I'd need for the Headline. If I bought a Hicap, I'd probably want to use it with the 5x (I hear they go very well together) and I'm not sure how much money I'd need to invest in a seperate power supply for the Headline. Powersupplies definitely jack up the price of a system and I just don't know which is more important, the PS to the amp or the PS to the CDP.

Ugh, this stuff is confusing! I'd appreciate any advice on how to set up a Naim only headphone rig as well as any tips on good sources for used gear.

 

[fishski13]

jpr703,
i think the headline2 ps requirements are entirely dependent on what cans they're driving. you can get the wallwart i-supply for <$200 but i would shoot for higher right off the bat. a napsc2 or the newer psc2 would probably be the minimum - it can power only one piece, but was intended to be used with the headline2 or 202 preamp. the flatcap2 can power 2 pieces (cdp + hl2) and has been improved to the x version - supposedly both outputs are now on equal ground whereas the older version, one socket was superior to the other. i forgot to mention the orginal flatcap (olive only) - it can power only one piece and at the s/h prices represent poor vfm $350-400 vs flatcap2(x) $600-700. a hicap is sweet but costs $650-1200 depending on vintage (chrome is cheaper than the olive or black series). naim recommends recapping all amp and ps every 10 yrs. my olive is 13 yrs old and has never been recapped, that is until i send it in for service on monday (yipee!) to the tune of $500 or so - but you basically get a new piece when it's all said and done. these suckers hold their resale value, and have actually been increasing. i paid fair market value for my hicap nearly 4 yrs ago, and i could sell it for a profit today.

a hicap on the cdp may be overkill. i prefer my hicap on my nait amplifier than i do on my cd3.5 - but i only have one, so it stays on the hl2. a *cap/nait5/intro2 is an endgame for my amp/speaker set-up, so i'm seriously thinking about getting a flatcap2x so i can power my nait, cd3.5 and hl2, and then calling it a day. the ps do make for excellent upgrades, but are a bit overpriced new.

keep your amp and shoot for a s/h cd5(x) first - the plain cd5 is underated in my view. then score a ps when the opportunity arises and place this on the cdp until you can find a headline2. new, the hl2 isn't that much more expensive than s/h though.

kuma will be by shortly and will be able to talk more about cans and ps requirements for the hl2.

PACE

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Plus I'm a little concerned about how a Headline 2 will compare to my MPX3 Slam (that Slam is a hell of an amp).

Ask your same kind dealer how lent you the CD5X about the Headline2 and compare.
I am curious how a HL2/HC fairs with the MPX3.

One thing I know is that I recommend a Hicap with the RS1. It'll run okey with NAPSC ( I haven't tried the i-supply ), but the Grado fones benefit from having a better PS.

Both AT2002 and 5000, HL2/NAPSC run great without much niggle.

I didn't want to undermine a good helping dealer so I've purchased HL2/NAPSC new from the dealer who let me auditioned the amp but picked up a Chrom Bumper HC second hand. I had it serviced at NANA and runs good as new. What a bargain!

Quote:

One thing I noticed with both Naim units is that their RCA implementation still isn't quite right yet.

And they never will.
I know the DINs put many people off, but once you get used to it, it is a far better connection than you realise.
You ought to ask your dealer about DIN/RCA lead. Make sure dual outputs on a CD player is disengaged. You can program so that only one outputs are in use.
This is what I use when I connect a non Naim gear with a Naim source.

It has a 180º 5 pin DIN at the source end and RCA on the other.
A Chord Crysalis can be terminated any numbers of configurations to suit enduser's needs. I have tried other cables in the same configurations, but my favourite is the Chrysalis still.

Now, this is what you need if you want to use a non Naim headamp but via Naim preamp/integrated's tape out facility. Note the direction marker on a cable for a signal flow. All Naim cables are directional and indicated as such.
It is exactly the same as SE-X52P shown above, but it has a yellow band on DIN end which indicates that this lead has no output.

Finally, this is a 4PIN source end DIN to phono lead.
You need this cable when you are using an external PSU for a Naim preamp to non Naim headamp. All voltage carrying DIN cables are 4 PIN.

A new CD555 is equipped with WBT's Nextgen RCA analouge out connectors, but Naim still maintains that DIN outputs are better.

Quote:

Powersupplies definitely jack up the price of a system and I just don't know which is more important, the PS to the amp or the PS to the CDP.

For the RS1, a Hicap with the Headline2 is probably a sensible limit.
Adding on a Supercap to the Headline with the Grado, the improvements were so minute that it's not worth the expense.

However, using Stax SRX Mk. III or AT W2002 or W5000 which are more resolute than the RS1 benefited greatly from a powersupply upgrade on the HL2.

One thing Naim knows is how to design a proper ( I mean in terms of musicality ) power supply as all power supplies are not created equal.

You'll get many eyebrow raisings from others for spending that much on a mere power supply.

But once you hear it, you'll know.

As far as setting up a kick ass Naim rig, I recommend to work with a good dealer and do a demo. Which looks like you already have an access to one.
Buying used is a good deal with Naim, but you'll go through some learning curve with it. I advise you to go to the Naim Forum.
Once understood, it's not that confusing and I hope you get to know them better. (PRAT isn't the only thing they do well.)

Have fun discovering.

 

[jpr703]

Thanks Kuma. My dealer doesn't stock the Headline, so I'd have to place an order to hear it. Tempting, but I'm just not sure. As for the cables, I've never tried the DIN to RCA. I do have a set of Chord Chorus RCAs though and I love them. They're the third set of Chord RCAs I've heard and they've all been good.

Do you think Hicapping the Headline and using a CD5x bare would be better than getting a Flatcap and using it on both the Headline and CD5x? I'd be using my RS-1s with the rig.