[wilyodysseus]

I bought one of those Tivoli Radios for my kitchen a couple of years ago, and realized it sounded better than my 1980's A/V receiver and tower speakers. I realized I had to upgrade. My budget was very limited. I did a lot of research on the internet, and eventually purchased a Sonic Super T-Amp, and Oppo DVD player, and a pair of Infinity Primus 150's. I think the system totaled under $500. I was a huge improvement.

In the last six months, I've started getting into headphone audio. I bought a HeadRoom Micro DAC, a Musical Fidelity X-Can v3, and AKG K701's. Most of my music listening moved to headphones, and my loudspeakers were used mostly for movies. Shortly thereafter, for the utility of multiple inputs and a remote control, I bought a NAD C325bee. The Sonic T-Amp went into storage.

This week, after rearranging my living room (which is approximately 12' x 24') into a more listening-friendly configuration. I thought about buying new speakers, and I started really spending some time with the 325bee. I was not happy. The music sounded muddy, blurred, undetailed. I pulled the T-Amp out of storage, hooked it up with the NAD as a preamp, and things dramatically improved. Not sure I'm using the correct audiophile terminology, but the attack was faster, the silence blacker, and the music generally more toe-tapping.

So I'm in the market for a new amp and/or speakers. If I was to stick with the T-Amp, I would want to get much better speakers, but the selection of inexpensive (under $1000, preferably under $600) sensitive (T-Amp is only 15 Watts) looks very limited--especially considering what I can audition locally. Dealers near me (Detroit, Michigan suburbs) carry B&W, Monitor Audio, Totems, and Magnepans. None of those, as far as I know, are known as high-sensitivity speakers. I haven't been able to find any other high-end brands around here, and I'd rather listen to them before buying.

On the other hand, the local selection of inexpensive amps is even more limited. Local dealers carry mostly either A/V receivers, Yamaha, some Rotel, or stuff that's way above my budget.

Given that I like the sound of the digital T-Amp, I looked for a more powerful digital. I found the Onkyo A-9555. It's generally well reviewed, but I'm gun shy of buying based on reviews after my 325bee experience. Another option is to use the bee as a preamp, and buy a NAD C272, but I also can't listen to it before I buy. Would the combined NAD's give me the fast, detailed quality I hear with the T-Amp?

I found the C272 for $600, while the Onkyo is $450. If I'm also going to buy new speakers, $600 is a stretch for me. I listed mostly to jazz, classical, and some indie rock--no hip-hop or metal. Room size is about 12 by 24 feet. I live in an apartment, so I don't normally listen at very loud volume levels.

Please suggest speaker/amp combos. I a "WOW!" experience compared with the Primus 150's and T-Amp. Can it be done for around or under $1000? Sorry this was so long. Thanks for you advice.

 

[zotjen]

Well, I haven't heard the C272 but I can vouch for the Onkyo. It's a great amp. I wrote a little bit about it here, although it's more about it's ability to drive headphones.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/onk...9555-a-357405/

Note though that although the A-9555 is described as digital, it does not have any digital inputs if that's what you're looking for.

 

[wudai_e]

I have no experience with the NAD but been using the Onkyo for about a month now and so far no complains. It's sound is sweet and warm almost tube like because I really can't tell much of a difference between it and the Little Dot IV se. Not saying there isn't any. But I found pairing my Onkyo with my Little dot as a pre-amp can give me a very sweet and quiet sound stage. So definitly doesn't hurt to try.

after the past several weeks I've been tweaking and buying gear to get that WoW factor you just mentioned, but I finally find out what other says about their gear and their listening experience is completely inrelevant to your own because musical taste is such a subjective matter and what you usually read on the reviews does not translate to what you hear and most of the words that reviewers use to describe sound are overkill emotionally because most the difference they describe, doesn't matter for better or for worse are subtle when your source + amp + output hits say around the 4000 mark. Any thing higher than that is really subtle improvement on soundstage and shooting for subtle improvement in neutrality at a cost that most people wouldn't even consider worthwhile.

All that cable thingies are completely voodoo to me now, yes better cables dose sound different, but I can't say if it'll sound better than cheaper ones, only different.

So... if you want to save money hoping someone will give you a black and white answer... don't try it on the subject of hi-fi. Just find what is the best for you situation and budget and buy it and listen. if you don't like it, return it and keep going and when you found what you like, STOP, your wallet will thank you for the years to come. Just my humble 2 cents

 

[wilyodysseus]

wudai_e, you're right. It is very subjective, which is frustrating when you don't have the opportunity to listen before buying.

I guess my long winded question boils down to: if I like the sound of the T-Amp, will I like the sound of the A-9555? Or if not, can anyone recommend a different 80+ Watt amp which sounds more like the T-Amp than the NAD?

I'd be willing to consider $600-$1000 dollar speakers which would work with the T-Amp (probably 90+ dB), but I feel like I'll face this dilemma again down the road if I don't jump to a more powerful amp now. A more powerful amp would really broaden my choice of speakers, especially those available locally.

Thanks for the responses, everyone.

 

[wilyodysseus]

Zotjen, I just read the thread where you reviewed the headphone output of the Onkyo. A Good read, thanks. How did you find it as an amp for loudspeakers (if you used speakers with it??).

And, no, the lack of digital inputs is not a problem. I'll be using a separate DAC anyhow. (Still, it is strange that none of the digital amps I've looked at have digital inputs. I wonder what's the design issue.)

Thanks.

 

[zotjen]

Well, the only speakers I've used with it are the Fisher MS-108s, which came with a compact system I bought over 20 years ago. I recently tried to find specs on them but turned up nothing. FWIW, I always thought these speakers sounded pretty good and the Onkyo works well with them.

As you've probably read , all of the reviews for the Onkyo have been positive so I would think that it does justice to a variety of speakers. Note that the manual indicates that you should only use speakers equal to or greater than 8 ohms but less than 16 ohms.

 

[wilyodysseus]

Thanks for the help. I’m now of the opinion that the NAD was simply revealing the shortcomings of the Infinity speakers. I went speaker shopping this weekend. I auditioned speakers from B&W, Monitor Audio, Magnepan, and Totem. I took home the Totem Rainmakers. They sound great with the C325bee, although I may look for a Creek of Naim integrated down the road.

 

[priest]

sorry, posted on wrong thread.

 

[sunseeker888]

Never been a NAD fan, but between the two I'd opt for the 272. More audiophile-oriented IMO, but then again, wasn't there a heat issue/early failure issue with these NADs? The Onkyo may be the more reliable amplifier. Tough call, the Onk has quite the following too....

Now, Naim is where its at. Cut above the 2 others, to me at least.