[manfred77]

I know this thread has been repeated and discussed but I can't seem to find anything that will ultimately answer my questions. I have been making my own interconnects, mostly to make them the right length that I actually need between components and to clean up the clutter of overly long cables. I have been using 22 gauge silver plated copper-teflon for the + and 18 gauge silver plated copper teflon for the ground. Decent plugs and soft braided sleeving. Would there be any noticeable sonic difference in using smaller gauge wire? Say, 24 and 20? Any difference in using the same gauge for + and - ? So far they have been working very good, no radio interferance or extraneous noise, etc. I may eventually buy some 24 gauge solid silver wire, but for now these seem to be okay.

Any helpful hints would be appreciated.

 

[warrior05]

i had originally recabled a pair of headphones using 22 awg silver coated copper wire. for an experiment i redid them with 26 awg silver coated copper wire. i didn't notice any difference in the sound sig or SQ which made me happy since obviously the 26 is more flexible. i've always used the same wire for both hot and ground. not saying this is THE way to go - just what i tend to do.

for interconnects i stick with 22 just for durability. though i did make a cotton ic with 28 awg 99.99% pure solid silver and they are terrific.

uh... don't know if any of that helps.

 

[manfred77]

It does help! Thanks, I just wanted to make sure my use of 22 gauge was somewhat in the ballpark.

 

[nikongod]

i use 30ga in my full diy interconects.

since they are never moved, and i bought about 1500ft for $10 it works well for me. if they ever break (i am upto 6 months old now, with 2 meets) i can build new ones recycling the plugs for like $0.01

i woudl say use the same wire for both halves of the interconect.

 

[zanash]

Don't use silverplated copper ...its the worst of both worlds....

Go for cat5 if you want pure copper or go the whole hog and use silver.

 

[MASantos]

Quote:

Originally Posted by zanash /img/forum/go_quote.gif Don't use silverplated copper ...its the worst of both worlds.... Go for cat5 if you want pure copper or go the whole hog and use silver.

COuld you elaborate that opinion? I use SPC for my interconnects and I find it very neutral and non fatiguing.

 

[Hevimees]

So far I've used three differents kinds of microphone cables for my interconnects. The first one had 24 AWG SPC conductors, the second one had 23 AWG copper conductors and the third one has 20 AWG tinned copper condutors.

The first and second cable sounded almost identical, but the silver plated one had worse bass response. The third one with tinned connectors is the best of these three, with best bass response and all around more clear and natural sound than the other two.

I'll probably try some solid silver interconnects at some point, but for now I'm happy with my tinned copper cables

 

[The Monkey]

I have never had a problem using silver plated copper and I think many here would agree that it is very well-suited to making interconnect cables.

 

[warrior05]

Quote:

Originally Posted by zanash /img/forum/go_quote.gif Don't use silverplated copper ...its the worst of both worlds.... Go for cat5 if you want pure copper or go the whole hog and use silver.

yeah... this is a pretty bold statement to throw out there without any backing. do i notice a difference between my 28 awg solid silver cotton interconnects and my SPC interconnect? yes - but slight. i've always used SPC and very happy with it and has brought nice improvement to stock wiring.

 

[zanash]

Yep .....

I've only 25 years of experience building IC's so you don't need to take my word for .

Go ahead reinvent the wheel ...its no skin of my nose


Those are only my opinions ...your aloud to have them on here arn't you ?


IMO............Keep things simple and don't bother with a shield.......unless all you've got is coax..... never run the signal return through the braid...remeber your dealing with ineffect ac ...not dc so you need to do the same to the +&-.



Solid core silver say 0.2mm in oversized ptfe tube 0.7mm id tightly twisted using light weight rca plugs .....this will be hard to beat at in a commercial product for less than $500....



I've just reterminated a set of Accoustic zen refference cables with eichmann silver bullets ...they sounded worse than my home brew design [as outlined above] at 70 times the cost. In my system !

 

[MASantos]

Nobody is denying your right to an oppinion, but:

1.You've registered recently, only have ten posts and are not known around here, so people don't know your background in Audio or DIY.

2.You should give some fundament for your opinion, as you did on your second post in this thread, it helps people understand your point of view.

3. Opinions and tastes in music differ, so maybe you don't like SPC and prefer silver, in your sistem with your music preferences, but others may prefer SPC or pure copper, in their systems and music tastes

That said:

Welcome to head-fi and sorry about your wallet

Quote:

Originally Posted by zanash /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yep ..... I've only 25 years of experience building IC's so you don't need to take my word for . Go ahead reinvent the wheel ...its no skin of my nose Those are only my opinions ...your aloud to have them on here arn't you ? IMO............Keep things simple and don't bother with a shield.......unless all you've got is coax..... never run the signal return through the braid...remeber your dealing with ineffect ac ...not dc so you need to do the same to the +&-. Solid core silver say 0.2mm in oversized ptfe tube 0.7mm id tightly twisted using light weight rca plugs .....this will be hard to beat at in a commercial product for less than $500.... I've just reterminated a set of Accoustic zen refference cables with eichmann silver bullets ...they sounded worse than my home brew design [as outlined above] at 70 times the cost. In my system !

 

[zanash]

My aim was to save a few years of trial and error......

Just because I have only 8 post doesn't make what I say of any less value than someone with 8000 posts.

I have 2000 + post on another forum ..... zerogain.com

I just spotted the requset for some help ...which I gave, I've not made anybody
take it, thats upto them !

 

[peterpan188]

Quote:

Originally Posted by zanash /img/forum/go_quote.gif My aim was to save a few years of trial and error...... Just because I have only 8 post doesn't make what I say of any less value than someone with 8000 posts. I have 2000 + post on another forum ..... zerogain.com I just spotted the requset for some help ...which I gave, I've not made anybody take it, thats upto them !

I do think everyone here at Head-Fi appreciate your opinion, its just that we would like you to elaborate your opinion further and give a little bid of background on it. I agree with you that number of post is irrelevant of the amount of knowledge/experience you have, but it's just that we would like to have deeper understanding of what you are advising us. I would think MASantos thinks the same.

Regard,
Peter

 

[zanash]

That's easy ......

make two ic cable for the first get some cheap wire in the second use expensive wire .... ie solid silver in ptfe tube use a duplicate set of plugs

if you can't hear any difference between the two ...you don't need to worry.

On the other hand if you can tell the difference ...you need to carefully asses the best materials for uses in IC.

Without you actually hearing the cables that I've made in the past....the best cables are in decending order .....

1-5 I'm not telling you!

6 twisted pair of 2silver in oversized ptfe [sounds as goods as Zen accoustic refference better than a KAS ]
7 as above but with copper magnet wire
8 a shielded version of 6
9 a shielded version of 7
10 cat5 twisted pair
11 screened 10
12 ptfe mil spec sp twisted pair in braided jacket
13 as 12 but in a coax [single central conductor]
14 spccs [silverplated copper clad steel]as coax
15 .......the list could go on

best rca plugs per price
neutrik nys series
http://www.neutrik.com/content/produ...=CatMSDE_audio

I can get these at $1 each

best rca regardless of cost

Eichman silver bullets cost $150 [set of 4]

What can you hear .....well not much. The bullets are sweeter and have a tad more resolution.... did a group of audiophiles hear the difference ...yes did they think the price was worth paying ...no

Best impress your mates rca plugs ....anything big fat and shiney ie WBT

thats not to say thay are no good ...just that they are very expensive for the performance offered, but they do look the part.

If you can make an IC costing $20 for the parts [cat5 twisted pair, nys rca's ] this will see off [assuming you can hear the differences for whatever reason] cables costing 10x that ....This is a generalisation as there are one a two very good cheap cables out there ...its just finding them.


Now for another experiment ...... you must allow 20+ hours of burnin time

The difference between the sound of multistrand and single strand. If you have not heard this its difficult to explain you just have to do it to convince yourself either way.

take any stranded wire and make an ic ..repeat with the closest you can get with solid core ie the same diameter and insulation. Listen to the two ...if you have a good resolving system you shoulkd be able to detect the stranded wire sounds muddled and bloated ......if your currently using stranded wire the solid core will sound bass weak and rather thin....

The stranded wire is wrong ......its used in cables as its more flexible and therfore cheaper. If you get used to the solid core wire you will notice that its not deficient in bass ...the bass actually goes deeper and is more controled the treble should be fast clean and have pin sharp imaging. The stranded cable will muddle the imaging.

An interesting aside is that the thinner you can make the hot conductor the better the sound ....fat cables are to help relieve your wallets ![IMO]
You can get stunning sounds if you hit a ratio of about 4:1 for the hot and cold conductors.

You must not takle my word for this ....you must try it out yourselves.

So if stranded IC sound bad where does that leave fat 500 strand speaker cables .....try solid core mains cable often called twin and earth say the 20 amp variety ....
again first impressions are a weak bass ....but if you can get over that its so much more musical.

I had someone borrow my own pure silver design speaker cable ...all I had to keep my system running was some nonedescript 300 strand copper..

Inserting that into my system [ML aerius i's, Consonance Cyber800, Arcam A5 [heavily modded] was a relavation in the wrong dirrection....

This produced a single bass note in the upper bass totally over blown and bloomy [not a typo] on a single female vocal you could hear a distored edge to the voice and the imaging and depth had collapsed.

It took me 3 minutes to decide I'd use head phones till my speaker cable was replaced with silver ribbon similar to what I'd taken out.

A great book is the Cable cookbook by Allen Wright.....90% I'm with !

I do have one or two cables I use to demonstrate these ideals .....I'm happy to loan them if theres any interest....obviously if a 150 people ask 149 are going to be rather disapointed ! But I'm prepared to put my ears/cables etc were my mouth is. Though in the end its not down to me, and its not my ears or my system you'll be listening through.





7

 

[MASantos]

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterpan188 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I do think everyone here at Head-Fi appreciate your opinion, its just that we would like you to elaborate your opinion further and give a little bid of background on it. I agree with you that number of post is irrelevant of the amount of knowledge/experience you have, but it's just that we would like to have deeper understanding of what you are advising us. I would think MASantos thinks the same. Regard, Peter

That's exactly what I meant. I only spoke about the number of posts to say that we didn't know what your experience was since your just arrived here at head-fi.

That said, very interesting post, very informative.

Manuel