[Pixel Eater]

I must confess I've never wanted to think about DACs. I don't really "get" them and as soon as I run into a lot of audiophiles talking about thousands of dollars in equipment I try sneaking out the back way, which is what DACs always made me think of. When I saw how much it could cost to further my Auzentech X-Fi Prelude's cause, I decided maybe it's time to learn something new.

So, I'm trying to either justify an upgrade or prove it's time for a change. Auzentech with its replaceable op-amps reckons the nicest thing you could do for your card is feed it one of these, the Burr Brown OPA637SM's for near as makes no difference $250. There seems to be no shortage of praise for this configuration. Some people feel the Auzentech actually rivals ~$1000 DACs in some ways, while some have much fewer kind words for it, either way this would have its total cost encroaching on DAC territory. Which got me thinking I'd really like to move forward with whichever is going to net the best damn sound, but that's a point I'm not clear on at all.
 
I could put money like that towards something like a $350 Schiit Bifrost instead. My problem is with no prior knowledge of this whole business about DACs, I can't even decide on paper which approach is better, or how they compare if at all. I mean should the Bifrost have something that's going to rival sound as filtered through OPA637SM's? I wish I knew. I'm just trying to decide, should I consider this pricey Auzentech upgrade, or for somewhere in the area of $500 or under could I do much better with a DAC? Or neither, maybe someone has a better idea. A third possibility is if there's some reason to consider an Asus Essence STX, I have read some highly subjective opinions on whether Xonars or the Prelude performs better. I may try one in my HTPC anyway... or could it be a DAC would be well-shared between both computers? In any event, I'll be directing this signal towards an old Sansui G-8000 (120 WPC) and a wonderful pair of ADS 1590/2s. What do you guys think? Apologies if this seems an awfully unread question, I don't even know where to begin really.
 
Edit: Another path I wouldn't rule out... ordering an Onkyo SE-300PCIE and hoping for the best?

 

[ROBSCIX]

There really is no better approach.  Cards and externals both have their place as it just depends on what you are after and what features you need.
What features do you need?

 

[Pixel Eater]

Sound quality, in stereo, usable by the Sansui, more than anything else. I really do appreciate the featureset of the Auzen, but could always fall back to it on an as-needed basis. I think it's a great sounding card, but it's time to either enhance it or move on. I just have no idea realistically how to compare reasonably priced DACs to the best consumer soundcards and if they blow them out of the water or not.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Sound quality, in stereo, usable by the Sansui, more than anything else. I really do appreciate the featureset of the Auzen, but can always fall back to it on an as-needed basis.

The BiFrost has been getting alot of great feedback and there is a thread about it in the dedicated Source Component thread.  Have a look there as it might help you with your decision.
 
 

 

[PurpleAngel]

If all your doing is music (2.0 channel, stereo), then you really do not need a sound card, sound cards are great to have when your a gamer or watching movies on your PC.
Something like the HTF Music Streamer II DAC ($150) might be as much as you would want to spend for an "upgrade".
Your other audio equipment is a little "dated".
 
How about just upgrading the receiver?
You would not need a sound card, just run a digital signal cable (USB, optical, coaxial) from your PC computer to the new receiver.

 

[Pixel Eater]

Well I actually go back to surround sound, and do watch movies and game, but that is really 1% of the time. I may or may not go down stereo for a while.
 
I am super happy with the Sansui
 
So for just $150 you feel the HTF Music Streamer may best the afore mentioned op-amp upgraded cards or the Bifrost?

 

[PurpleAngel]

Quote:

Well I actually go back to surround sound, and do watch movies and game, but that is really 1% of the time. I may or may not go down stereo for a while.
I am super happy with the Sansui
So for just $150 you feel the HTF Music Streamer may best the afore mentioned op-amp upgraded cards or the Bifrost?

I'm not really sure at what level, what for sure is going to improve the sound, that Sansui might be the limiting factor.
I'm guessing when you game or watch movies (or listen to music), the Sansui is providing the sound?
 
 
 

 

[Pixel Eater]

I've got to tell you the Sansui is not the limiting factor, that it hasn't nearly hit the roof on what it can do with a good signal. So I feel strongly the latter stands to improve, if only I can understand the best approach. I know I'm going to put my money one direction or other, but I'd hate for it to be the less effective route. Now don't laugh, but for surround I have a lesser Sansui and some lesser ADS in the back and, of all things a HSU center channel and HSU sub sorted out by a Yamaha HTR-5860 w/ pre-outs. I've never known on a scale from rigged to effective where this sits, but it's not too important as I have never emphasized surround. A majority of the time I enjoy music through foobar.
 
External DACs are just quite foreign to me. I assume at some point they take some of the same kinds of components and begin doing much more than a soundcard possibly can... and that dollar for dollar one would do more than the out-there $460 Onkyo. Sound cards seem attractive to me, but that could all be because they're familiar.

 

[PurpleAngel]

The dual OPA637SM adapter they want to sell you for $250, it costs under $60 for those 3 parts (Two OPA637SM op-amps + adapter) on eBay.
I was reading up on that Yamaha HTR-5860 receiver you have.
Remove the Sansui receivers and hook everything up to the Yamaha HTF-5860
Run an digital optical cable from your computer to the Yamaha receiver.
The Schiit Bitfrost is a nice DAC, but the Yamaha also has good DACs too, better than the Prelude.

 

[Pixel Eater]

I can't help but feel like you're assuming because the Sansui is old, it's bad. I'm not sure how well you know vintage solid state, but you can't imagine how much better it sounds than the Yamaha, it's beautiful. A top shelf stereo in its time that still sounds amazing today, it's not as if it's dethroned by just any BPC. Which isn't to say the Yamaha isn't awesome for the change I paid. God knows it was the last year before they figured out to upsell pre-outs. Naturally time to time I try it out in said configuration, s/pdif to Yamaha to speakers. Now since I don't believe I've tried pre-out* to Sansui with the ADS's I will trial that.. or would it be missing any DAC advantages from another output?
 
I have to wonder though, are we really saying as rule of thumb, a basically good receiver should trump any soundcard? I mean if that's common knowledge, it's just not something I had considered.

 

[PurpleAngel]

Quote:

I can't help but feel like you're assuming because the Sansui is old, it's bad. I'm not sure how well you know vintage solid state, but you can't imagine how much better it sounds than the Yamaha, it's beautiful. A top shelf stereo in its time that still sounds amazing today, it's not as if it's dethroned by just any BPC. Which isn't to say the Yamaha isn't awesome for the change I paid. God knows it was the last year before they figured out to upsell pre-outs. Naturally time to time I try it out in said configuration, s/pdif to Yamaha to speakers. Now since I don't believe I've tried pre-out* to Sansui with the ADS's I will trial that.. or would it be missing any DAC advantages from another output?
I have to wonder though, are we really saying as rule of thumb, a basically good receiver should trump any sound card? I mean if that's common knowledge, it's just not something I had considered.

I do hear from many how good vintage audio can be, I do believe the modern market for receivers is more driven by features on the outside, then the features on the inside, like the amplifiers.
But back in the day, I'm assuming people spent a lot more cash for for separate pieces, while today it's cheap enough to integrated more in to the receiver.
The Prelude is one of the first computer gaming sound cards to have nice audio features, before that sound cards were more about gaming features then real sound quality,
I just upgraded to the Yamaha RX-671, I had ordered the RX-V667, but i think they were out of stock, so they sent me the RX-V671, but I only had to pay the RX-V667 price.
So I'm on a Yamaha kick right now, they are one of the few receiver brands to come with true surround sound for headphones.
With modern motherboards coming with digital audio outputs (optical, coaxial, USB), it's much easier to send your computer audio to a modern receiver, modem receivers can handle music and movies audio just as well as any sound cards and receivers with their nice speakers will sound better then any "PC" speakers setup.
The Schiit Bitfrost I'm sure is a great DAC, but it's two (2.0) channel, where you for surround sound you need 5.1 or 7.1 channels for movies and surround sound games.