[Talonz]

Recently picked one of these up:

http://www.rscycle.com/s.nl;jsession...3&it=A&id=7943

By recently, I mean it's in the mail for a few days and it should be here tomorrow!

 

[crazyfrenchman27]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Morbid Well, not to toot my own horn, but $700 would cover the cost of only my fork. The total value of my bike is in the $4000 range. Most of my friends on Turners are in the 6000 range. With Turner, it's not a matter of cost, but the industry leading customer service, quality of build, purpose of design, and several intangibles.

I think it's silly to imply that you have to invest $4000 for an excellent mountain bike; it's quite evident that you start hitting major diminishing marginal utility after $1500 with full suspension. I'm pretty sure that the "performance advantage" gained by the additional $2,500 over something like a stumpjumper is easily dwarfed by rider skill level and fitness. Heck, on some tracks, singlespeeders have been winning it as of late (i.e. NO GEARS). In XC, cheaper hard-tails dominate. But spend your money how you please (S-Works or otherwise...).

For a hard-tail, I believe the barebones minimum for a quality entry bike is $400, which really isn't all that much money if you think about it. Have you ever taken apart your ipod before? What a simplistic device...yet it costs a whopping $400 to do what a a $40 cd player could do. There is no doubt in my mind that the expense to produce a $400 bike exceeds that to produce a $400 ipod. If biking is something you spend several hours a week doing, a $400 price tag is a small price to pay for reliability and performance.

-Matt

 

[Geoff Rymer]

$250 for a mountain bike? Don't even bother - crap bikes really, really make life a whole lot less fun. However, if you were to budget $350-$400 you could pick up something pretty decent. Personally I'd be tempted to stay fully rigid, especially at the lower end of that price scale- the money would be better spent on a good frame, wheels and componentry than a cheap suspension fork. Definitely don't go full sus at this price. Unfortunately fully rigid entry level bikes are a bit of a rarity these days, which seems to have had the knock on effect of driving up the price of a budget bike which is suitable for offroading.

EDIT: I forgot to add, we (my wife and I) are looking at purchasing a new bike for her- entry level mountain bike for maximum flexibility (slicks if we start doing lots of road work etc), and are looking at spending AU$900-1000. Shopping around, that can get you a reasonable hardtail frame running Deore, with a half decent XC fork. That's pretty much the minimum I would recommend.

 

[1911]

hey dr morbid,
i recently bought a bike for my wife and i and the owner questioned us about our habits and what we wanted to do with the bikes..i said mostly paved trails and nothing too hardcore...so he recommended a hybrid and we got 2 trek 2005 navigator 300s. i recently read about the whiskeytown race in redding where i live. you think a hybrid can handle trails or should be kept on the pavement? thanks

 

[Geoff Rymer]

Hey 1911, I know your query was addressed to the Dr, but my own 2c- Trek build some good bikes, and they may well be strong enough to handle a race, although I don't know if the wheels on hybrids are really that strong. The other thing is, you may find them a bit of a handful on more technical trails because of the geometry and the riding position being a bit upright. But then again, you may get on fine. Only one way to find out!

 

[Dr Morbid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazyfrenchman27 I think it's silly to imply that you have to invest $4000 for an excellent mountain bike; it's quite evident that you start hitting major diminishing marginal utility after $1500 with full suspension. I'm pretty sure that the "performance advantage" gained by the additional $2,500 over something like a stumpjumper is easily dwarfed by rider skill level and fitness. Heck, on some tracks, singlespeeders have been winning it as of late (i.e. NO GEARS). In XC, cheaper hard-tails dominate. But spend your money how you please (S-Works or otherwise...). For a hard-tail, I believe the barebones minimum for a quality entry bike is $400, which really isn't all that much money if you think about it. Have you ever taken apart your ipod before? What a simplistic device...yet it costs a whopping $400 to do what a a $40 cd player could do. There is no doubt in my mind that the expense to produce a $400 bike exceeds that to produce a $400 ipod. If biking is something you spend several hours a week doing, a $400 price tag is a small price to pay for reliability and performance. -Matt

Don't make this thread turn ugly; I have not implied that one has to pay that much and you also don't know the reasoning and features I was looking for with my type of riding which warranted cost. There are hidden features, for one, there is company backing for another. It's also quite funny how you established an arbitrary number for where there is diminishing returns, when that's generally the xc area for a company like specialized, whose pricing structure is based around the travel, whereas Turner's bikes are roughly the same price for each frame, but simply made for different purposes. They are also handmade in the USA and have very different geometries to the frames than Specialized. They also have a brutally strong and proprietary sealed bushing system that costs more than bearings.

You have also made several other assertions that make you appear to be stuck in 1996 mountain biking, which there are many of. They tend to assert things like the creaky old grandpas because they don't like change. Mtb has changed a lot since 1996.

If you would like to know more, then please PM me to keep this from getting ugly on the boards. Read my other posts on this thread and you will see. I have also posted on other boards about how I'm being priced out of mountain biking and how it's becoming too costly. Regardless of cost, mtb is something I love and I will save to use the equipment that will allow me to love it more. It doesn't matter what equipment one uses, just as long as they're out there and doing it safely.

 

[Dr Morbid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1911 hey dr morbid, i recently bought a bike for my wife and i and the owner questioned us about our habits and what we wanted to do with the bikes..i said mostly paved trails and nothing too hardcore...so he recommended a hybrid and we got 2 trek 2005 navigator 300s. i recently read about the whiskeytown race in redding where i live. you think a hybrid can handle trails or should be kept on the pavement? thanks

Geoff answered it well. There are wheels and hubs. Basically, hybrids are for light fireroads and dirtpaths at the most. The thing about them is that they're mostly road, but they try to use advertising to make people think there's even greater utility into the trail realm. The reality is there's little utility in the dirt realm, but they make them for people not wanting the LOOK of a strict comfort bike, but something closer to the LOOK of a mtb, believe it or not. Commercial mtb marketing is really dirty.

 

[crazyfrenchman27]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Morbid Don't make this thread turn ugly.

I suppose we'll just have to argue on www.mtbr.com .

If recent race results (2006!) among elite competition aren't evidence enough for you, then I suppose nothing is.

-Matt

 

[immtbiker]

Jim Thorpe, Pa with 2000 foot dropoff behind me into the Lehigh Valley:

Wife and friends at the highest point on Skyline Drive (Blue Ridge Mountains):

Water crossing in Upstate NY:

My older GT LTS Thermoplastic at the Slatyfork West VA. Mountain Bike Fest:

 

[Dr Morbid]

I *think* you and I have ridden years ago, perhaps meeting at Jericho.

Sevendust and I are off the Junkie then BP for a couple hours.

 

[Dr Morbid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazyfrenchman27 I suppose we'll just have to argue on www.mtbr.com . If recent race results (2006!) among elite competition aren't evidence enough for you, then I suppose nothing is. -Matt

I don't care about racing, and neither does the other 99% of mountain bikers. We care about riding and riding equipment that lasts because we don't have sponsorship. A SID for DH runs is not my cup of tea. I love the people that pull racing out of their hats, like it's 1999. How about the fabled 3 pound hardtail with a lifetime warranty and purple anodized cranks that last 3 months? There's a reason why manufacturers beefed everything up and now they're trying to get away from the weight weenie mentality that made us accept in the last part of the nineties.

 

[immtbiker]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Morbid I *think* you and I have ridden years ago, perhaps meeting at Jericho. Sevendust and I are off the Junkie then BP for a couple hours.

Then you must know Doug and Linda from Bike Junkie (they are my buds). Let's ride there in August and anyone else in the Tri-state area is welcome for a Head-Fi 16 mile Greenbelt excursion.

 

[skudmunky]

I like mountain biking. I only get a chance to do it a few times a year when I go to a camp in NH though. I used to ride a decent Gary Fisher bike, but a few weeks after the front wheel fell off in mid air the bike just broke down. Took it into a shop, and found it would have cost as much to fix it as the bike had originally cost. I haven't bought a new bike since, so I just use the crappy bikes at the camp now. Still fun though.

 

[Geoff Rymer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Morbid I don't care about racing, and neither does the other 99% of mountain bikers. We care about riding and riding equipment that lasts because we don't have sponsorship. A SID for DH runs is not my cup of tea. I love the people that pull racing out of their hats, like it's 1999. How about the fabled 3 pound hardtail with a lifetime warranty and purple anodized cranks that last 3 months? There's a reason why manufacturers beefed everything up and now they're trying to get away from the weight weenie mentality that made us accept in the last part of the nineties.

Ahh purple adonised cranks, that takes me back to about 1993! Have to say I'm with you on this- like I stated previously, I bought my bike back in late 95- it weighed 23lb (yeah, it was rigid). Great. But all the bits that weighed bugger all wore out or broke quite quickly. Not sure what it weighs now but it's a lot heavier, and I don't break stuff as much...

 

[Dr Morbid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by immtbiker Then you must know Doug and Linda from Bike Junkie (they are my buds). Let's ride there in August and anyone else in the Tri-state area is welcome for a Head-Fi 16 mile Greenbelt excursion.

Yup. Known Doug and Linda for years. That place is always an experience. I'm down for a Headfi excursion- all skill and speed levels. It's a decently long run, even without running the SW loop, but I'd be in it for fun.

At this point, I'm riding Sprain and Blue more than I am on the Island. The people are great up there, no doofists spewing politics and ill-will, for the most part. Very classy bunch, those WMBA guys. In fact, I ride with Rob O a lot. 307 pounds and a powerful rider.