[riddley]

Does anyone out there have any experience listing to the Eastern Electric Minimax CDP headphone out with Sennheiser 580/600/650s?

I'm interested in this player but I'm attached to my 650s and don't plan on getting rid of them any time soon. All the good reviews of the Minimax I've read focus on lower impedance phones... I'm just wondering if anyone's put in some hours with a Minimax and the Senns and what they thought.

Thanks!

 

[elnero]

I've been asked this question various times since I posted my review of the MiniMax. I have used the MiniMax with HD600's and recently I spent a weekend with the HD650's, both with good results.

When I tried the HD600's I also had a PPX3 for comparison and I would say on a performance level alone, meaning it's ability to drive the Senns, the MiniMax was about on par with the PPX3. The MiniMax seemed to drive both the HD600's and HD650's well with lots of gain to spare but as Srajan noted in his various headphone related reviews, when using the HD650's the MiniMax will be outclassed by higher end amps. That's to be expected though, the MiniMax isn't a miracle worker, but it does offer incredible value, for under $1000 you get an excellent tubed output CD player with an internal headphone amp that competes in at least the $500 region all in a nice neat compact package that has it's own synergy and can be fine tuned by swapping tubes.

So in essence I guess it depends on what kind of performance you are looking for and what kind of budget you have. I come from the source first school of thought so I think if you have $1000 to spend on a source and amp it would be pretty hard to go wrong with the MiniMax. If you have have $1500 to spend it might be a different story but I personally would still put the bulk, say $1000 into the source which leaves $500 for an amp so you might not gain much if anything by going separates, in my estimation it would still probably come down to a personal preference of sound. Now if you have $2000 to spend it would most likely be a different story, I would expect $1200 on the source and $800 for an amp would more than likely tip the scales in favor of separates. At least that's about what I figure I personally would need to spend to get a clear upgrade over the MiniMax's internal amp.

 

[Dred]

If it helps, I just replaced a Musical Fidelity 3.2 cd player. a 400$ Kimber IC, and a Sugden Headmaster amp with the Minimax. With the Senn 650's I replaced a very detailed analytical sound with a much more musical sound with a very real and easy to listen to midrange. I will play with tubes but I know I will keep the minimax/650 combo.

More tube impressions would be appreciated as more people try the minimax.

Thanks, Ed

 

[elnero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dred If it helps, I just replaced a Musical Fidelity 3.2 cd player. a 400$ Kimber IC, and a Sugden Headmaster amp with the Minimax. With the Senn 650's I replaced a very detailed analytical sound with a much more musical sound with a very real and easy to listen to midrange. I will play with tubes but I know I will keep the minimax/650 combo. More tube impressions would be appreciated as more people try the minimax. Thanks, Ed

Wow! That bodes well for the MiniMax. The Musical Fidelity is a fairly highly regarded player as is the Headmaster, did you find much of a loss of detail when you moved to the MiniMax? Are you using the stock Electro Harmonix tubes?

I have been procastinating on starting a "Tuberolling the MiniMax" thread but I will try to get my thoughts sorted and get something posted shortly. If you or anyone else has any tuberolling questions in the meantime feel free to PM me, I haven't done nearly as much as I would like but have tried a few different types.

 

[skullguise]

I tried the Minimax with Senn 650's with great results; upgraded tubes did help eek out more detail and focus as well. Volume levels were NO problem at all.

Apparently, there is a newer version of the Minimax, with different resistor sets in the headphone stage. Apparently, a few machines had some volume imbalance on efficient headphones (I did with my Sony CD-3k, but the Senn's were fine since I could turn the volume up more, and there was no imbalance at higher levels).

I have since gotten the upgraded Minimax (it also has different cap's in it from what I understand). It's too new to tell for sure, but it definitely seems a winner on all counts. I don't have my Senn's anymore to test, but my Sony CD-3K's and new Sony SA3000's are wonderful off it. And the volume control is only at about 9 o'clock for comfortable levels.

HTH....

 

[elnero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by skullguise I tried the Minimax with Senn 650's with great results; upgraded tubes did help eek out more detail and focus as well. Volume levels were NO problem at all. Apparently, there is a newer version of the Minimax, with different resistor sets in the headphone stage. Apparently, a few machines had some volume imbalance on efficient headphones (I did with my Sony CD-3k, but the Senn's were fine since I could turn the volume up more, and there was no imbalance at higher levels). I have since gotten the upgraded Minimax (it also has different cap's in it from what I understand). It's too new to tell for sure, but it definitely seems a winner on all counts. I don't have my Senn's anymore to test, but my Sony CD-3K's and new Sony SA3000's are wonderful off it. And the volume control is only at about 9 o'clock for comfortable levels. HTH....

So have you heard both versions? If so I would be interested in your thoughts on the sonic differences between the old and new caps.

 

[chadh]

Dred,

I was interested to see you replacing the MF source and Sugden amp with the Minimax. I own a Sugden Headmaster (which I use with a Bolder modified smART DI/O and Rotel transport), but had my curiosity roused by the reviews of the Minimax.

I'm currently thinking of changing things around to set up a headphone listening station in another room. I could move the Headmaster there, and add a source. But then I'd need a new pre-amp in my main system. Alternatively, I could go with the Minimax and leave the Sugden where it is. Or, as the Sugden would just be serving as pre-amp, I could get rid of it and get a different pre-amp. I'd hate to pursue the latter course of action if the Minimax amp section suffers in relation to the Sugden.

Did you have a chance to compare the Minimax headphone output to the Minimax played through the Sugden headphone output? I understand that you feel that the total change in your system was for the better (delivering a more musical presentation), but this might well be expected by using a tubed source (especially in relation to the MF source - when I listened to the MF dac I found it a little cold).

Chad

 

[Dred]

Quote:

Originally Posted by elnero Wow! That bodes well for the MiniMax. The Musical Fidelity is a fairly highly regarded player as is the Headmaster, did you find much of a loss of detail when you moved to the MiniMax? Are you using the stock Electro Harmonix tubes? I have been procastinating on starting a "Tuberolling the MiniMax" thread but I will try to get my thoughts sorted and get something posted shortly. If you or anyone else has any tuberolling questions in the meantime feel free to PM me, I haven't done nearly as much as I would like but have tried a few different types.

There was a slight loss of detail but the lack of grain and the liquid mids more than made up for it. The bottom line is I was quitting half way through a cd and now I don't want to go to bed. Most of us have been there-if I only listened to "audiophile recordings" I probably would be happier with the more expensive solid state system.

I thought I was using the EH tubes but I just removed them and they are Sovteks. I bought the Minimax used. I will be trying Amperex Bugle Boys soon.

Please give us your tuberolling info because these NOS tubes are spendy.

Thanks, Ed

 

[elnero]

Thanks for the reply Ed. I'll give some brief thoughts on the tubes I have but I will try to get something more substantial together to start an actual thread where can post their impressions and serve as a central base of tuberolling information for the MiniMax.

Electro Harmonix 6922's - These are the tubes that came stock in my player. Apparently Alex switched to these from the Sovteks because he felt they sounded better (I haven't really heard anything very positive in regards to the Sovteks used in the MiniMax). This tube is suprisingly good for a stock tube, it's been awhile since I actually listened to it but my impressions were, nicely balanced and lively through the mids but the bass while it had good weight lacked a bit of punchiness. Treble region is nice but not spectacular and can get a bit grainy.

Amperex Bugle Boy 6DJ8's - To me these are close to the sound that one associates with tubes. Bass is a bit fat and round but has decent weight. Mids are lush and warm while the highs are reasonably smooth. Not as detailed as some of the other tubes I have but are quite musical.

Amperex Orange Label A Frame with dimpled getters - Highs are much more forward as are the mids. Initially I really liked this tube because it has a very lively, real, palatable midrange but it has some flaws in my system that I couldn't live with. Namely the bass is a bit flat, lacking in punch. The midbass has decent weight but loses it in the lower regions where extension is also lacking. There is also a strange quality in the upper midrange/treble that I can't quite put my finger on. It's actually apparent with both the Amperex tubes but the A Frames really drew my attention to.

Telefunken PCC88's - Technically this is probably the best tube in my collection, smooth refined well balanced highs, gorgeous warm mids, punchy, detailed and extended bass with great PRaT. Where these fall a bit short for me is they lack some of the realness through the mids that the Amperex Orange Label have.

RSD PCC88's - This is the current tube I'm using. These tubes are relabelled so I have no idea who the actual manufacturer is. They are basically a compromise although not much of one. Bass has good detail, weight and extension, mids have a realness and more forward, lively quality akin to that of the Amperex A Frames while the highs are closer to the Telefunkens although lacking some their refinement. They also have similar PRaT characteristics to the Telefunkens but again not quite as good. The RSD's tend to reach out and grab you but still have nice smooth, warm and refined quality whereas my other favorite tube, the Telefunkens, tend to draw one into the music with a smoother more seductive quality.

Well that ended up being a bit more substantial than I intended so I may just end up reposting this in it's own thread. I hope that helps.