[beerguy0]

I just went through some computer problems, PC kept getting slower, and finally looked like it was dead. (Programs not loading when booting up, things not displaying properly, etc.) When I looked inside the case, I noticed that the CPU heatsink was pretty much clogged with dust, preventing airflow through the heatsink. After I cleaned it all out, my PC now runs like it hasn't in a long time. Boots faster, programs load faster, etc. Lightroom is no longer an exercise in sheer frustration.

(If your PC is getting slow, check the heatsink

Anyway, since it's now running better, I want to upgrade the memory. The system is an Intel D865PERL, with a 3.2 GHz P4 and 1 GB RAM, running XP Professional. The mobo supports dual channel operation. The thing I'm wondering about is whether I should upgrade to 4 GB of RAM, or just 3 GB? I've read the XP only supports 3 GB, so is 4 GB a waste? I have an AGP video card, so some of the system memory is used for graphics. Most of my PC work is Lightroom/Photoshop, so I think running dual channel is worth it.

Also, there is the issue of memory bus speed vs. latency. Is it better to look for faster (400 MHz) memory with normal latency, or slower (333 MHz) with lower latency? Does it really matter that much? I'm buying all new memory, since the memory I have now is 133 MHz. I'm sure more RAM will help immensely, I just want to get the best bang for the buck.

(I was thinking about a new PC, but I'm saving for another lens and don't want to spend it on a new PC. It's adequate for what I need to do.)

 

[roastpuff]

Wait, how can your board be using 133Mhz RAM? Are you sure it's not 266Mhz instead or 333Mhz?

Intel® Desktop Board D865PERL - Product features

Windows XP only takes advantage of 3.5GB of RAM maximum due to OS limitations, so go with 3GB instead. Just add to the 1GB you already have. It won't particularly matter between 400Mhz and 333Mhz for your purposes, but 400Mhz is the most common type still available, so you should be at no problem.

At any rate, buying DDR RAM has become a more expensive exercise as the RAM is no longer produced, so your choices are a bit more limited.

Here's a fairly good choice for RAM at Newegg: Newegg.com - Kingston ValueRAM 2GB (2 x 1GB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) System Memory - Desktop Memory Kingston's a good brand, and they have a lifetime warranty on their RAM if needed. Though the prices on that DDR RAM kit matches the price for a new 4GB DDR2-1066 or DDR3 kit...

If you can spare the cash, though, upgrade to a newer desktop. The difference will be like day and night to you with a modern dual-core or quad-core processor and DDR2/3 RAM.

EDIT: Here's the reason why only 3.5GB are supported.

Quote:

Windows XP or Vista 32-bit edition can not use 4 GB, there is nothing to do, it is a mathematical limit. 32-bit system can address: 2 to the power of 32 = 4.3 Giga different addresses, corresponding to 4.3 GB of RAM as it needs to manage other stuff than the RAM (motherboard, expansion cards, including the graphics card), it remains only about 2.8 to 3.3 GB of RAM addressable following configuration PC.

 

[appophylite]

I'm planning on upgrading my X200 that only has 2 GB of RAM up to 4 GB. Lenovo states that it can support it and the computer is running XP so I don't believe there should be any problem with upgrading your desktop machine to 4 GB unless the mobo prevents it.


**EDIT** It seems roastpuff has info I don't....never realized that XP only recognizes 3.5 GB of RAM...

 

[El_Doug]

This is DDR1 memory - in general, its latency is so low across the board that you DEFINITELY want DDR400, do not even consider DDR333. The prices are about the same these days, anyways (that is antiquated memory).

XP will only recognize 3.25gb of RAM. That being said, sometimes the 865 chipset (which you have) doesnt really like having all 4 RAM slots filled, and can act up. I'd highly recommend only going for 2 sticks.

I dont know what you do with your PC, but since you mentioned that this ancient socket 478 machine is adequate, I'll go on the assumption that you dont use any power-hungry programs. To that end you'll be more than happy with 2gigs of RAM, and if I were you, there would be a nice 2x1gig matched pair in my future

 

[soidera]

Your pc definitely needs upgrade, not memory but faster cpu, i recommend e8400, or if you want later upgrade you could choose e2160, can be oc up to 3.1 ghz
But to do that you may also upgrade your vga for new cpu supporting PCIexpress, 96gt is adequate , for motherboard choose that support min 3 pci slots
then memory 2gb is more than enough for xp pro
in my country this wouldbe cost not more than $350-400?
this system will still great for probably two years

 

[Nick 214]

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Doug /img/forum/go_quote.gif This is DDR1 memory - in general, its latency is so low across the board that you DEFINITELY want DDR400, do not even consider DDR333. The prices are about the same these days, anyways (that is antiquated memory). XP will only recognize 3.25gb of RAM. That being said, sometimes the 865 chipset (which you have) doesnt really like having all 4 RAM slots filled, and can act up. I'd highly recommend only going for 2 sticks. I dont know what you do with your PC, but since you mentioned that this ancient socket 478 machine is adequate, I'll go on the assumption that you dont use any power-hungry programs. To that end you'll be more than happy with 2gigs of RAM, and if I were you, there would be a nice 2x1gig matched pair in my future

Very good points. If the MB can handle higher speeds, I'd take the ram well beyond 400. IMO, RAM speed can be more crucial than size.

NK

 

[zotjen]

Quote:

Your pc definitely needs upgrade, not memory but faster cpu, i recommend e8400, or if you want later upgrade you could choose e2160, can be oc up to 3.1 ghz

IMHO, if you're going to upgrade your processor, you might as well get a new PC. Upgrading the memory to 3GB should show substantial improvements, and memory is still pretty cheap these days.

 

[Makenshi]

I vote for getting another 2 400mhz 1gb sticks. Most economical option and all matched up for dual channel mode. As a general rule of thumb the highest fsb supported by your processor is usually the one you want to buy. Though, to be honest, unless you are gaming or doing cad, anything over 2 gigs is overkill, unless, of course, you upgrade to Vista. I don't know about 865s, but my 965s and 855s didn't have any problem with 4 sticks of RAM.

Also note that if you upgrade your memory now, the new memory sticks will not be able to go towards the next computer you purchase. Practically all PCs manufactured today use DDR2 or DDR3. If you are going to keep this computer around for another 3-5 years or retire it to a server or a workstation then it shouldn't be a problem, but if you plan on purchasing a new computer in the near future it's something to keep in mind.

 

[olblueyez]

Redline Memory - XP4000 DDR - Mushkin Enhanced

MUSHKIN 2 GB (2x1GB) Redline XP4000 DDR 500 NIB- 991493 - eBay (item 130297453045 end time May-30-09 20:51:28 PDT)

All you need is 2 1GB sticks. I have some of these in my desktop and its the best memory I ever had. Even if you get Vista 32bit then it will still be limited to 3 gigs. Snap those suckers up before they are gone.

 

[roastpuff]

Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif Redline Memory - XP4000 DDR - Mushkin Enhanced MUSHKIN 2 GB (2x1GB) Redline XP4000 DDR 500 NIB- 991493 - eBay (item 130297453045 end time May-30-09 20:51:28 PDT) All you need is 2 1GB sticks. I have some of these in my desktop and its the best memory I ever had. Even if you get Vista 32bit then it will still be limited to 3 gigs. Snap those suckers up before they are gone.

At that price he might as well buy a new computer... OP doesn't seem to be the tweaking type. $159 for 2GB?!

 

[beerguy0]

Quote:

Originally Posted by roastpuff /img/forum/go_quote.gif Wait, how can your board be using 133Mhz RAM? Are you sure it's not 266Mhz instead or 333Mhz? Intel® Desktop Board D865PERL - Product features Windows XP only takes advantage of 3.5GB of RAM maximum due to OS limitations, so go with 3GB instead. Just add to the 1GB you already have. It won't particularly matter between 400Mhz and 333Mhz for your purposes, but 400Mhz is the most common type still available, so you should be at no problem. At any rate, buying DDR RAM has become a more expensive exercise as the RAM is no longer produced, so your choices are a bit more limited. Here's a fairly good choice for RAM at Newegg: Newegg.com - Kingston ValueRAM 2GB (2 x 1GB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) System Memory - Desktop Memory Kingston's a good brand, and they have a lifetime warranty on their RAM if needed. Though the prices on that DDR RAM kit matches the price for a new 4GB DDR2-1066 or DDR3 kit... If you can spare the cash, though, upgrade to a newer desktop. The difference will be like day and night to you with a modern dual-core or quad-core processor and DDR2/3 RAM. EDIT: Here's the reason why only 3.5GB are supported.

It's DDR memory - the actual DRAM frequency is 133 MHz, running at 266 MHz. I noticed the prices for DDR memory are pretty high, compared to the newer stuff, but I can probably get by with 2GB. I could build a new PC, and I'm sure I'd love a new dual or quad core machine, but I really don't want to spend my money on a computer right now. (I hear a Canon 90mm TS-E calling my name

)
.

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Doug /img/forum/go_quote.gif This is DDR1 memory - in general, its latency is so low across the board that you DEFINITELY want DDR400, do not even consider DDR333. The prices are about the same these days, anyways (that is antiquated memory). XP will only recognize 3.25gb of RAM. That being said, sometimes the 865 chipset (which you have) doesnt really like having all 4 RAM slots filled, and can act up. I'd highly recommend only going for 2 sticks. I dont know what you do with your PC, but since you mentioned that this ancient socket 478 machine is adequate, I'll go on the assumption that you dont use any power-hungry programs. To that end you'll be more than happy with 2gigs of RAM, and if I were you, there would be a nice 2x1gig matched pair in my future

Lightroom/Photoshop are my main uses besides web stuff. I'm not a gamer (mostly because I suck at games).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makenshi /img/forum/go_quote.gif I vote for getting another 2 400mhz 1gb sticks. Most economical option and all matched up for dual channel mode. As a general rule of thumb the highest fsb supported by your processor is usually the one you want to buy. Though, to be honest, unless you are gaming or doing cad, anything over 2 gigs is overkill, unless, of course, you upgrade to Vista. I don't know about 865s, but my 965s and 855s didn't have any problem with 4 sticks of RAM. Also note that if you upgrade your memory now, the new memory sticks will not be able to go towards the next computer you purchase. Practically all PCs manufactured today use DDR2 or DDR3. If you are going to keep this computer around for another 3-5 years or retire it to a server or a workstation then it shouldn't be a problem, but if you plan on purchasing a new computer in the near future it's something to keep in mind.

When I upgrade, this PC will become my email/web machine, so I plan to keep it for a while longer. It's certainly fast enough for that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by olblueyez /img/forum/go_quote.gif Redline Memory - XP4000 DDR - Mushkin Enhanced MUSHKIN 2 GB (2x1GB) Redline XP4000 DDR 500 NIB- 991493 - eBay (item 130297453045 end time May-30-09 20:51:28 PDT) All you need is 2 1GB sticks. I have some of these in my desktop and its the best memory I ever had. Even if you get Vista 32bit then it will still be limited to 3 gigs. Snap those suckers up before they are gone.

Ouch. A bit more than I was planning on spending.

Quote:

Originally Posted by roastpuff /img/forum/go_quote.gif At that price he might as well buy a new computer... OP doesn't seem to be the tweaking type. $159 for 2GB?!

Good guess. I like to use my computers, not fiddle around with them. I've had my fill of that in the past, nowadays I just want it to run.

Looks like I'm buying 2 x 1GB memory. Thanks for all the tips!

 

[ljokerl]

OP,

If you haven't purchased the memory yet and if you have a FRY's B&M nearby, you may want to stop buy and check their Crucial DDR ram. They often have very good deals, sometimes with rebates. I've gotten in on the 2gb Crucial 400Mhz DDR for $20 after rebate a couple of times.

Also, the 3.5 or 3.25 Gb ram limit under xp is not set in stone. The addressing depends largely on the other devices you have installed. Since I'm runnin 2x 512 mb video cards and several PCI devices my XP install only sees 2.25 gb of my 4gb ram. Also, having 3gb of RAM under xp, even if it is recognized, has dubious advantages imho, unless you intend to turn off your pagefile. I would just stick with buying a 2nd 1Gb stick if I had your hardware (and found a decent price).

 

[beerguy0]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljokerl /img/forum/go_quote.gif OP, If you haven't purchased the memory yet and if you have a FRY's B&M nearby, you may want to stop buy and check their Crucial DDR ram. They often have very good deals, sometimes with rebates. I've gotten in on the 2gb Crucial 400Mhz DDR for $20 after rebate a couple of times. Also, the 3.5 or 3.25 Gb ram limit under xp is not set in stone. The addressing depends largely on the other devices you have installed. Since I'm runnin 2x 512 mb video cards and several PCI devices my XP install only sees 2.25 gb of my 4gb ram. Also, having 3gb of RAM under xp, even if it is recognized, has dubious advantages imho, unless you intend to turn off your pagefile. I would just stick with buying a 2nd 1Gb stick if I had your hardware (and found a decent price).

No Fry's in my area. Best Buy is probably the only place we have around here now for that stuff. (Maybe Staples?)

I'm going to buy all new memory. The DRAM I currently have is slow, and I want to run dual channel. I'll start by replacing my 2 x 512 with 2 x 1024 and see how that works.

 

[iriverdude]

Upgrading from 1GB to 2GB will result in a faster PC- check if your motherboard supports 2GB. But dual core CPU's are so much faster.