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Mayan Calendar and Dec. 21, 2012
Jul 3, 2007 at 1:53 AM Post #31 of 59
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lazarus Short /img/forum/go_quote.gif
It can be a risky business judging another civilization or an older civilization by our own standards. They were probably founded and built on entirely different principles and values. Yes, the Mayans got a lot of things wrong, but our own [often uncivil] civilization has gotten so many things wrong:


Our civilization has gotten many things wrong as you point out, but...

A) As far as any evidence is available, the average educated person alive today has a greater scientific understanding of the processes of our solar system and galaxy than the most informed Mayan during the Classic time.

B) The only reason these theories are given any weight (however light) is precisely because we're judging them by contemporary standards and allowing modernity in to weight their achievements. If the Mayan hadn't developed an advanced civilization with some incredible achievements - "advanced" and "incredible" as judged by their successors, these theories would be even more dismissed. Are you comfortable giving them some credit by todays eyes, but not taking others away?

C) While I agree it is very risky to interpret through contemporary perspective much of what makes up a distant pasts social/cultural/artistic/religious/philosophic worlds (though we're having this conversation based on several individuals feeling comfortable doing just that), if we use currently accepted terms to discuss these theories, this threads subject either falls in the religious or scientific spheres. And it should be judged accordingly. If the former, you can believe the Mayan have some gateway into future galactic truth and most of mankind is doomed... and have fun with that. It doesn't matter anything else said here or elsewhere. If the latter, and we're answering specifically the questions of if they have insight, and if we should become prepared for an [at very least] massive global change in 2012, then we should use every available contemporary scientific advantage (even if flawed by future perspective - assuming the future is mostly ahead of now as now has mostly progressed beyond the past in scientific knowledge) to judge the theories* as harshly as possible, no?

There are certainly a variety of ways to getting to know parts of the Mayan knowledge base and belief system, but the questions posed here about mankind and Earth are primarily scientific aren't they?
[size=xx-small]
* Theories, plural, separating the evidence for possible events in 2012 from the possibility the Mayan, Hopi, etc. have insight into them.[/size]
 
Jul 3, 2007 at 2:13 AM Post #32 of 59
Quote:

Originally Posted by blessingx /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Our civilization has gotten many things wrong as you point out, but...

A) As far as any evidence is available, the average educated person alive today has a greater scientific understanding of the processes of our solar system and galaxy than the most informed Mayan during the Classic time.

B) The only reason these theories are given any weight (however light) is precisely because we're judging them by contemporary standards and allowing modernity in to weight their achievements. If the Mayan hadn't developed an advanced civilization with some incredible achievements - "advanced" and "incredible" as judged by their successors, these theories would be even more dismissed. Are you comfortable giving them some credit by todays eyes, but not taking others away?

C) While I agree it is very risky to interpret through contemporary perspective much of what makes up a distant pasts social/cultural/artistic/religious/philosophic worlds (though we're having this conversation based on several individuals feeling comfortable doing just that), if we use currently accepted terms to discuss these theories, this threads subject either falls in the religious or scientific spheres. And it should be judged accordingly. If the former, you can believe the Mayan have some gateway into future galactic truth and most of mankind is doomed... and have fun with that. It doesn't matter anything else said here or elsewhere. If the latter, and we're answering specifically the questions of if they have insight, and if we should become prepared for an [at very least] massive global change in 2012, then we should use every available contemporary scientific advantage (even if flawed by future perspective - assuming the future is mostly ahead of now as now has mostly progressed beyond the past in scientific knowledge) to judge the theories* as harshly as possible, no?

There are certainly a variety of ways to getting to know parts of the Mayan knowledge base and belief system, but the questions posed here about mankind and Earth are primarily scientific aren't they?
[size=xx-small]
* Theories, plural, separating the evidence for possible events in 2012 from the possibility the Mayan, Hopi, etc. have insight into them.[/size]


I agree with much of what you say. Your final words above about "questions posed" gets me to thinking. Primarily scientific? Maybe, but this is strange intellectual territory, "New Lands" as Charles Fort put it, and we proceed not knowing for sure if the old rules apply. Not so long ago, I read "Hamlet's Mill," a seminal book about very ancient myth and what it means. It covered things comparable to the whole 2012 thing. One theme in the book was the knowledge hidden in myth of the tilting/straightening of the pole, the "churning of the milky ocean" by that pole, and the BEGINNING, not just the end of the last ice age. Yes the Finnish national epic, the Kalevala, hints at the beginning of the last ice age, and that would easily make it the world's oldest body of literature. The book proceeded, and got more and more difficult. The authors paused half way with a parenthetical chapter entitled "A Guide for the Perplexed". What we are discussing is not easy stuff, which is why I declined to get on my soap-box in an earlier post. Let's preserve our sense of wonder, as well as our good sense, and let us remember that we really know very little about the distant past, even the distant human past.

Laz
 
Jul 3, 2007 at 5:46 AM Post #34 of 59
This may sound like crazy talk, but seriously folks. I mean SERIOUSLY FOLKS.

I gonna tell you what's going to happen.

1. All electric appliances are going to malfunction. Your electric iron is going to shoot steam and the iron is going to get soooo hot! It's just going to jump into the air and scream "THE TERROR"!!!

2. Birds are just going to drop dead in the air and just fall and hit people walking around on the street.

3. *** Religiously censored material***(Please do not post)

4. We are all going to be so scared and run around like ants.

5. The 4th dimension is going to open up and all of the imaginary demensionoids are going to come and terrorize you all.

Whaa Whaa Hooo!!! Be very scared, be very scared. Whaa Whaa Hooo!!!
 
Jul 13, 2007 at 4:31 AM Post #36 of 59
Quote:

Originally Posted by blessingx /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Okay, I've been hearing people reference this theory for a few years now, but it appears to be growing and the NYTimes did an article today titled The Final Days. Anyone else following the development of a community who believes the world (or at least human civilization) will change greatly based on the Mayan calendar cycle? More interested in the rise of a unusual shared belief than the likelihood of anything happening that day. Couldn't be worse than sitting through Apocalypto again.


I had dream about 2012.. The date was 10/16/95.. No dream I had ever startled me so much.. & was very unique. It won't be the end. It will be the start of a new ERA. Things will happen that day.. A change in the universe, planet alignment. Very, very, rare or first time events. Forgot what, but was documented.
 
Jul 13, 2007 at 4:38 AM Post #37 of 59
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wodgy /img/forum/go_quote.gif
As the article says, this phenomenon is being driven primarily by Coast to Coast AM, which has five million listeners on any given night. Their aggregate audience (people who tune in from time to time) is probably 20-30 million, maybe more.

They never mention though on the show that 2012 is not the end of the Mayan calendar, it's just the beginning of the next long count. Unless for some odd reason they only expected there to be one long count.


The world won't end. It will just be a new start. I been saying this for yrs.. I still think 2012 will be a significant yr for us & a turning point for all humanity, whether it goes out with a bang or a whimper..
 
Dec 3, 2012 at 7:25 PM Post #39 of 59
When the new period starts, I hope I get some.
 
Because the last period has not been going very well for me.
 
In case you are wondering what "some" is, you don't need to know.
 
Dec 4, 2012 at 10:36 PM Post #41 of 59
Guys, this is what really happened:
 

 
Dec 5, 2012 at 5:59 PM Post #42 of 59
billybob_jcv said:
I tend to believe the universe actually ended quite some time ago. We just didn't notice because the credits didn't start rolling.
Click to expand...
It did end, we're just waiting for the big suck. Something about seeing the light from before the event that saves us.
 
Dec 8, 2012 at 1:53 PM Post #44 of 59
From the time this thread was started, the world economy was set up and raped. As a result, debt has persecuted a lot of people. Even if you came through without incident, your property values are 70% of what they were. If you invested in the markets, you were fleeced. The natural disasters are becoming more frequent and fierce. The N pole is moving 40 mi a year toward Russia. The magnetic field is weakening at a time of peak sunspot activity. Our internal warning triggers are going off but we don't know where to find the threat.

While it is natural to have some heightened anticipation as it gets closer to this prophecy date, the world feels taxed to it's limits my many mechanisms. Even the most extreme deniers has to give notice to a change in the world. We may be witnessing a natural cycle of events that will indeed change the world as we know it. This isn't about one society in history making this claim. There are many observations in prophecy pointing to the same events and the same timeline by societies disconnected by time, distance, language barrier or religious/political belief. I hope we wake up and comment "That was it?" because the "What if" creativity is certainly not a pretty proposition. Eating bark and stealing mother's milk from infants will be the result of Hostess denying the world. Yes snicker but the first volley has been shot. A society looses it's snackfood, it's doomed. History has shown......
 
Dec 21, 2012 at 10:30 AM Post #45 of 59
Oddly quiet in here :)
 
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