Martial Arts...
Dec 9, 2011 at 12:16 AM Post #47 of 87


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I remember "flow" stood out in Systema for me, out of all the martial arts I have trained in, fluidity was what stood out. What I mean is, the way we were taught to move. But the one thing that bothered me was that it somehow felt a bit choreographed. It felt like this training would only work if the other person was also in a "fluid" state. (Anyone know what I mean ? , again, its kinda hard to explain/understand unless you've done it)



I know exactly what you are talking about. I only learned a bit of Systema though. I learned more Krav Maga in the ways of military martial arts. They are both wildly effective though.
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 12:55 AM Post #48 of 87


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If you are training for RBSD (reality based self defence) you should train to get hit otherwise you are not preparing for reality..

Well said.. but I enjoyed MMA when there was much emphasis on ju-jitsu and wrestling. Now there is more standup mode where opponents use sloppy circular punches and defenders rarely exploit the openings.  Why step back? There is nowhere to go so might as well step in and have at it. Obviously, training with regular boxing gloves and patterns has not helped their art.
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 3:10 AM Post #49 of 87


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Well said.. but I enjoyed MMA when there was much emphasis on ju-jitsu and wrestling. Now there is more standup mode where opponents use sloppy circular punches and defenders rarely exploit the openings.  Why step back? There is nowhere to go so might as well step in and have at it. Obviously, training with regular boxing gloves and patterns has not helped their art.



UFC is pretty weird becuase they always have to worry about a takedown coming and also know the other guy has an iron jaw.  Personally I don't like to watch UFC much, K1 has gone to cr*p also.
 
Sanshou is pretty interesting to watch - nice to see some more varied techniques:
 

 
Dec 9, 2011 at 7:17 AM Post #51 of 87
In UFC/Pride FC fighters usually take to the ground if that's where they have an advantage as that is where they can do the most damage, and their opponent can do the least.
 
In real life though if you get thrown to the ground and your opponent is still standing it's pretty much game over though - you could get head-stomped etc (AFAIK head stomping is banned from UFC)
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 7:30 AM Post #52 of 87
American History X - curbstomping gets you jailed and butt____
 
I had a white belt in Taekwondo. Was gonna take the white yellow but decided that spending $30 on a small piece of yellow tape wasn't worth it. Probably the most choreographed martial art ever. I like Muay Thai though. Lots of kicking, very entertaining to watch. Edit: I took kickboxing up for one semester. It would've been better if the instructors weren't chinese. It's supposed to be a Western kickboxing class... felt like I was doing wushu or something. Sparring was fun, even though they disallowed face punches (one guy got sent to the hospital earlier that week), no knees, elbows, heels. 
 
 
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 7:38 AM Post #53 of 87
 
Well I think Taekwondo is more of a sport and art, while Muay Thai is more the science of 8 limbs.
 
500 Muay Thai fighters against 500 Taekwondo fighters, I think the former will win, but as always it's the individual that's important, someone like Bruce Lee would have become a high-level fighter in any martial art, imho.
 
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 8:58 AM Post #54 of 87


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Well I think Taekwondo is more of a sport and art, while Muay Thai is more the science of 8 limbs.
 
500 Muay Thai fighters against 500 Taekwondo fighters, I think the former will win, but as always it's the individual that's important, someone like Bruce Lee would have become a high-level fighter in any martial art, imho.
 



I disagree on the grounds of it depends on who is doing the teaching... I have a second degree black belt... I had 4 masters in the time that it took me to get there (really 5, but I never considered the 5th to be my master)... My 4rd master, the one who trained me in the higher ranks to black belt and a bit after taught me the military style of TKD along with the sport style (to keep the owner happy). The two are so radically different it isn't funny. From the execution to the stance and even the mind set. Sport TKD you don't arm lock an opponent and proceed to destroy their nose to prevent breathing, military style you do. Sport TKD you have a lot of spinning kicks and fancy techniques, military style you stick to simple effective and hard to determine and aim for certain areas (knee pelvis solar plexus throat eyes upper lip). 
 
I left my school because that master was fired (the owner figured out what was going on) I stayed slightly after because I was an instructor at that point and getting paid, but.... I wasn't learning anything new... After he left I started exploring other martial arts, and really I'm happy I did. TKD if taught correctly, is fantastic, unfortunately it became the primary McDojo style and lost all of its effectiveness in lieu of sports style (thanks to the Olympics). Now the new McDojo is MMA... I've trained in MMA, been to competitions (did alright, never won, but I did make 3rd place once, and always got at least close to placing, I was usually defeated by a BJJ practitioner which is why I started learning that...), and the MMA taught in schools is not MMA.... its BS. If a school says "MMA" you should avoid it, as it is just a gimmick to get you inside.
 
My issue with MMA actually is the same issue with TKD now, too many rules not enough pure style, where you learn what is completely effective. If you are going to teach someone something teach them the entirety and focus on showing them the rules later. Why? Because then they understand the history of what they are learning and come to respect it. If you learn something purely for sport you don't really respect it because that is all it is to you, a sport.

As for 500 Muay Thai vs 500 TKD, again type of fighters... If they were both military trained you would be surprised at how similar the two are. The main difference is kick delivery... The TKD doesn't curve their kicks and thus are a bit weaker, but gain a bit of speed, where as Muay Thai does and gains power but loses speed. What it would come down to is who can do the most damage first. I actually think it would be an interesting fight to see... NOW! If you got sports Muay Thai and sports TKD.... The fight would be over in minutes and would be insanely boring... Muay Thai... no points until you deliver damage... TKD points for a solid hit... Muay Thai anything goes except cheap shots... TKD has a bunch of  rules and regulations... It would be a no contest. I have fought a Muay Thai fighter and won, but he didn't expect me to have a similar style to his own because he knew my primary style was TKD. At the end we became friends and started teaching each other a bit.
 
Lastly... Real street fights actually do end up on the ground a lot... The question is will one be left standing or both fall together... If the former the fight is over unless you know how to defend from the ground and recover... the latter will depend on how well you know ground fighting...
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 9:19 AM Post #55 of 87
Any videos of professional taekwondo vs muay thai fights? I watched a few (jap tournament) a few months back but there were no high res videos and the fighters weren't pro. Even in Muay Thai itself there are many different fighting styles. I don't like the "boxer" style, which John Wayne Parr uses, I like the "kick that fellow until he goes weak and then go all out" style of Buakaw. :0 
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 9:29 AM Post #57 of 87


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Haha, thanks for the informative post.
 
How about we compare sports TKD style versus sports Muay Thai style with no rules?
 
 


It's quite rare to see well executed muay thai elbow strikes nowadays... is it disallowed or something? 
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 9:36 AM Post #58 of 87


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It's quite rare to see well executed muay thai elbow strikes nowadays... is it disallowed or something? 



Not at all... But think of it this way... An elbow to the head = knock out most of the time. That is their primary usage in Muay Thai. So if you are learning Muay Thai, one of the first things you figure out and hone is how to defend against those strikes. Why would a Muay Thai fighter waste his energy on a technique that will likely be countered or blocked? Especially one that opens up an entire side of his defense at close range (opening up his rib cage for knee strikes). 
 
As for no rules sports TKD vs Muay Thai, same thing occurs. If you were taught rules from white belt to black belt with the intent of using it for sport, you won't think to use an illegal technique no matter what, because you aren't programmed to think that way. Thus the result would be the same. Muay Thai will go for the knee probably slowing them down (because knee strikes aren't allowed in sport TKD) and the next strike would be an elbow to the head and the fight would be over (theoretically at least)
 
Dec 9, 2011 at 9:55 AM Post #59 of 87


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Any videos of professional taekwondo vs muay thai fights? I watched a few (jap tournament) a few months back but there were no high res videos and the fighters weren't pro. Even in Muay Thai itself there are many different fighting styles. I don't like the "boxer" style, which John Wayne Parr uses, I like the "kick that fellow until he goes weak and then go all out" style of Buakaw. :0 


K1 has gone WAY downhill lately - last time I watched it was buakaw vs sower - now its some 8 foot russian vs some 5 foot karate kid - terrible, atrocious and without any sport.  K1 could have been so much more but not it is just rubbish.
 
I think a lot of muay thai fighters become unstuck because they fight hundreds of fights against other muay thai - then when they face a different style they are not prepared as they are too used to fighting other muay thai.  
 

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