[Fitz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davesrose Humm.....where are the other Sennheiser fans for this thread!!! There was another thread not too long ago where us Senn fans where really outnumbering AKG 501 fans. Looks like I'm the only HD580 one here tonight. For me, recessed means really huge soundstage and a roll off in highs and lows. I think they're related for the 501s because the drivers are so far back. There's a lot of space between them and your ears. Also with the fact that they aren't angled towards your ears (the HD580 series is like this too), means that they aren't going to be as bright as Grados (or the HD595). So that's what I mean by recessed......

If that's how you define recessed, then I don't disagree with you on the K501s. But how I've always understood recessed is having the midrange pushed back behind the lows and highs (aka 'smiley face' equalization), and would call what you describe as having rolled off extremes. Man if only audiophool lingo jingo wasn't so ambiguous.

 

[Davesrose]

Well if that's what audiophile "recessed" means, then there's no arguement....there's certainly not any rolled off mids. OK, now I see where you guys are coming from

I've been using recessed in the more literal/physical meaning.....of the drivers being really recessed and causing huge soundstage.....or is that headstage?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz If that's how you define recessed, then I don't disagree with you on the K501s. But how I've always understood recessed is having the midrange pushed back behind the lows and highs (aka 'smiley face' equalization), and would call what you describe as having rolled off extremes. Man if only audiophool lingo jingo wasn't so ambiguous.

 

[micaela]

I'm going to 2nd the W100's but also throw in the RS1's. The W100's have a wonderful warm full sound that just melts my ears! I found the 650 veil to be a reality - but maybe if I'd had my SP amp when I had them it wouldn't have seemed so veiled to me. The W100's do what the 650's did but better to my ears.

On the other hand the RS1 detail does blues right to me. I just can't get enough accoustic guitar w/the RS1's.

 

[HFat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davesrose Could you describe to me what makes Sennheiser "dull and their headstage unbearable" if you're coming from Grado? Seems like a lot of Grado folks here have gotten 580s because of it's intimate headstage, and the complimentary tonality it has towards Grados.

I guess I can answer that as it's not totally off-topic. I used to love these Senns... but after a steady diet of AKG and Beyer, I grew somewhat estranged to them. This happend slowly. I remember the first time I was disgusted after putting them on... this wasn't a feeling I expected and this is why I'm saying that *I* would probably not care for them that much coming from DT880 and Grados. Obviously different people have different tastes and listen for different things so I'm not saying everyone would necessarily feel like that.

Why dull? because of the polite treble I guess. The headstage on the other hand is probably due to the shape and depth of the cups... you've heard of the three blobs, right? I used to not hear or mind that but now I do... not always and not with all recordings but it makes me reach for the crossfeed switch more often than not.
I still give the Senns a spin sometimes (lust for a bass massage, a treble-happy recording, whatever). They're good 'phones and they certainly provide (too much of) a counterpoint to Grados as well.

EDIT: K701 pads should angle the drivers for what that's worth.

 

[alex_cs]

Michael I tihnk youll find the HD600 with an aftermarket cable like a headphile blacksilver or blackmax, or a cardas will be a treat with the MPX3 for blues. i tihnk youll find the 650 might be a bit overwhelming in the bass with an mpx3, of course it depends what tubes youre running as well.

 

[Davesrose]

No, I don't think a good debate on the merits of the AKGs vs Sennheiser is off topic

Seems like we're hitting on what the traits of both phones could be for a non biased person to read and gather what they might like better. In theory at least

I have found that Grado people just getting into Senns can run into problems if their setup is a warm tube amp. That's when they have too much treble roll off, and a bass heavy "veil". So on some Grado setups, a Senn will not work and the person has to decide if they want to work on another system. My HD600s just seem to keep on getting more detail with my solid state upgrades (looking at getting a DAC1 as my next upgrade).

Interesting you should bring up crossfeed....so you don't like it for your 501s? I tried switching it on and off when I was first burning in the 501s....did notice a slight difference in tonality. Maybe it is more effective for more transparent headphones....since it gives a better sense of things being in front of you. I have a HR amp, which I normally have crossfeed on. I find I really like it for my HD595s. For my 600s....I do like it for classical guitar. Seems like it slightly rolls off the mids for blues though.....ambience is good, and it does seem to center things pretty well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HFat I guess I can answer that as it's not totally off-topic. I used to love these Senns... but after a steady diet of AKG and Beyer, I grew somewhat estranged to them. This happend slowly. I remember the first time I was disgusted after putting them on... this wasn't a feeling I expected and this is why I'm saying that *I* would probably not care for them that much coming from DT880 and Grados. Obviously different people have different tastes and listen for different things so I'm not saying everyone would necessarily feel like that. Why dull? because of the polite treble I guess. The headstage on the other hand is probably due to the shape and depth of the cups... you've heard of the three blobs, right? I used to not hear or mind that but now I do... not always and not with all recordings but it makes me reach for the crossfeed switch more often than not. I still give the Senns a spin sometimes (lust for a bass massage, a treble-happy recording, whatever). They're good 'phones and they certainly provide (too much of) a counterpoint to Grados as well.

 

[alex_cs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HFat Quit blowing this source/amp business out of proportion. People have different references and tastes, that's all... that and different K501s. In fact, coming from DT880s and Grados, I'm pretty sure I'd find the Senns pretty dull and their headstage unbearable without crossfeed. Yeah, the soundstage is contrived but I like my 501 unreal. If you want it more natural and neutral, you know you can tweak the soundstage and bass with blu-tak (depending on your version) or pad rolling/modding, right?

When I recieved my HD600's stock, in about an hour I stopped listening to my DT880's completely. What the HD600's may have lacked in absolute detail, they made up for with better musicality, natural sound, and a more forgiving listening experience.

Not to mention headstage. It wasnt as large, but it was a lot more cohesive than the DT880's.

All of this was prior to getting an aftermarket cable, which made the response snappier and a bit more clear overall.

I bought an SR225 after recieving the HD600's, and while they were very clear and punchy, they too were quite fatiguing, and the on ear comfort was zero. Im clearly a circumaural kinda guy

Comfort to be honest comes first for me, to the extent id rather my ancient pair of HD570's to the SR225's.

OH and sorry for going off on a tangent and seemingly bagging your choices, but I thought id throw my hat in the ring. I come from a persepective of wanting a comfortable, nonfatiguing and musical headphone, and so far the Senns and the HP3000(nee CD3000) are the ones to have offered all of those points. Anything else for me is a bonus.

 

[Davesrose]

Nice to see another Sennheiser person's on this thread now!

But seriously, since there's some very passionate camps for either the HD580/600 or the K501 for blues.....it's good that these phones are now heavily discounted. Maybe the best thing to do is to pick up some 501s from zzounds ($100), and a pair of HD580s($140) from amazon. Who knows, you might like both. If you don't like one, there is a fs forum here!

Quote:

Originally Posted by alex_cs When I recieved my HD600's stock, in about an hour I stopped listening to my DT880's completely. What the HD600's may have lacked in absolute detail, they made up for with better musicality, natural sound, and a more forgiving listening experience.

 

[Michael415]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HFat Quit blowing this source/amp business out of proportion. People have different references and tastes, that's all... that and different K501s. In fact, coming from DT880s and Grados, I'm pretty sure I'd find the Senns pretty dull and their headstage unbearable without crossfeed. Yeah, the soundstage is contrived but I like my 501 unreal. If you want it more natural and neutral, you know you can tweak the soundstage and bass with blu-tak (depending on your version) or pad rolling/modding, right?

I am not sure anyone is blowing anything out of proportion, the source and amp make a large impact on the final sound of the headphones. I feel content with my amps and cd players as being able to do solid cans justice. I am aware I can try different pads on the Grado that would change the sound slightly but it won't be what I am looking for. I enjoy the grado sound but for the blues I would like a richer sound.

 

[Davesrose]

IMHO, richer=the warmness of the HD580/600

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael415 I enjoy the grado sound but for the blues I would like a richer sound.