[onurrus]

William Waltons Five bagatelles are great for classical guitar.I suggest Julian Bream Recording,

 

[lwd]

I would recommend anybody wanting to get to know 20th Century 'classical' music should go and read 'The Rest is Noise' by Alex Ross. It's a great telling of what has gone on in the past 100 years and even people who know their stuff (I have an M.Mus in Music) will find new things. It inspired me to go and check out a number of pieces I hadn't heard before.

 

[gregorio]

Don't know where to start!

A second vote for Britten's "Four Sea Interludes". Vaughan-Williams' "Fantasia on a theme by Thomas Tallis". Bartok's "Concerto for Orchestra". Walton's "Violin concerto". Elgar's "Cello Concerto". Almost anything by Prokofiev, Shostakovic Symphony 5. Khachaturian "Spartacus" might be worth a listen.

No one has mentioned "Night on a Bare Mountain" or "Pictures at an Exhibition" (Mussorgsky). Much film scoring is based on the work of the impressionists, so also have a look at Ravel and Debussy, Satie has a few lovely compositions. Holst's "Planets Suite" is an old favourite. Richard Strauss? Alipne Symphony is probably my favourite but "Four Last Songs" is worth a listen.

G

 

[scompton]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gregorio /img/forum/go_quote.gif Don't know where to start! A second vote for Britten's "Four Sea Interludes". Vaughan-Williams' "Fantasia on a theme by Thomas Tallis". Bartok's "Concerto for Orchestra". Walton's "Violin concerto". Elgar's "Cello Concerto". Almost anything by Prokofiev, Shostakovic Symphony 5. Khachaturian "Spartacus" might be worth a listen. No one has mentioned "Night on a Bare Mountain" or "Pictures at an Exhibition" (Mussorgsky). Much film scoring is based on the work of the impressionists, so also have a look at Ravel and Debussy, Satie has a few lovely compositions. Holst's "Planets Suite" is an old favourite. Richard Strauss? Alipne Symphony is probably my favourite but "Four Last Songs" is worth a listen. G

Mussorgsky was 19th century although Ravel orchestrated Pictures at an Exhibition in the 20th. x2 on all the others, especially Strauss who is one of my favorite composers. Another work of his that I really like is Metamorphosen.

 

[gregorio]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scompton /img/forum/go_quote.gif Mussorgsky was 19th century although Ravel orchestrated Pictures at an Exhibition in the 20th.

True, although he was rather ahead of his time. As I mentioned before, stylistically much film score music is based on the impressionists and the two pieces I mentioned by Mussorgsky are particularly film like and indeed both have been used in C20th films. In this same vein, we could also say that Wagner is very film like. If there had been no Wagner I don't think the John Williams' scores would sound quite the same.

Ther are so many C20th composers who are slightly off the beaten track who may be worth a listen but I was mainly considering the OP who mentioned "The Mission" (Morricone) which is relatively conservative by C20th standards and indeed by the standards of Morricone's own stage works.

G

 

[mbhaub]

Ditto the Alex Ross book. I, too, went out and bought a lot of music I have overlooked and found some great stuff. Some real lemons, too. A lot of the avant garde especially from 1950 - 1970 is just noise. Worthless and pretentious. Stockhausen! UGH!

But for good news. I also picked up the new Da Capo 7 sacd set of symphonies by Rued Langgaard (1893 - 1952). Modern? You bet. And incredibly interesting, fun, beautifulm exciting. All the good stuff, none of the dry, ascetic, academic crap. He may have been a nut, but the music is sure enjoyable. This is the kind of 20th c music that should have been played and recorded.

 

[gregorio]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbhaub /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ditto the Alex Ross book. I, too, went out and bought a lot of music I have overlooked and found some great stuff. Some real lemons, too. A lot of the avant garde especially from 1950 - 1970 is just noise. Worthless and pretentious. Stockhausen! UGH!

We could open up a long debate on the "is this noise or is it music" question. Whether you like Stockhausen or not, he has been highly influential and the world of music today would be different without Stockhausen's contribution. Neither is the noise or music question a new one. The London Times review of the London premier of Beethoven's 9th stated something like: "It sounded like the dropping of a bag of spanners with the occasional hitting of a spanner". In other words, to many of the ears of the day, Beethoven sounded just like noise, presumably worthless and pretentious too!

We listen to classical music from 100, 200, 300 or more years ago and benefit from the passing of time filtering out the least successful compositions and glorifying those compositions which were either successful or in retrospect important to the development of music. With comtemporary classical music we do not have thee benefit of the time filter and it can be difficult to judge what is potential genius and what is pretentious. Maybe in 100 years time Stockhausen will be regarded far more highly than he is now or maybe he will be forgotten. You are entitled to your opinion of whether you like it or not but to call it worthless is more an indictment of your understanding of the evolution of music than it is of Stockhausen's importance to C20th music.

G

 

[kwitel]

All,

I am having a hard time with many of these suggestions.
Not sure if its my untrained ear or, just not what I am looking for.

For some reason, I cannot find classical music that I find as emotionally stirring or beautiful as many of the film scores i own. (I can just imagine all the classical lovers with their jaws on the ground right about now...)

How would you classify the type of classical found in scores by Glass, Nyman, Serra, Riley etc?

Ive tried Parts Tabula Rasa and Shosty's 5th. The former is nice but its a little sparse-if that makes any sense. The latter is good but I need a lot more time with it. I also tried Rileys "In C"-which is interesting but lacks the emotion I am looking for. It is simply too minimal/repetitive.

I am listening to "loreley" on the Nowhere in Africa soundtrack from Nike Reiser and its just a beautiful piece of music (albeit quite short). Its this type of music, although longer compositions, that I am looking for. What kind of classical is this?
(Other faves are Glass's "The Hours" and Nyman's "Gattaca" and Mansell's "The Fountain".)

 

[Zalithian]

I haven't read the entire thread but I would imagine some of it has to do with the music you like being tied to a moving scene from a movie or something that gives it a little extra "emotion" compared to a piece of music which isn't tied to anything. It's probably subconscious, but just something to keep in mind I think.

 

[tru blu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zalithian /img/forum/go_quote.gif …I would imagine some of it has to do with the music you like being tied to a moving scene from a movie or something that gives it a little extra "emotion" compared to a piece of music which isn't tied to anything. It's probably subconscious, but just something to keep in mind I think.

I was tempted to think this also, but my guess is that kwitel is enjoying listening to The Hours soundtrack without the film. It's true, however, that by virtue of function a film score probably works a bit differently than music composed solely for listening. I find that the sparseness of the 2nd movement of "Tabula Rasa" is incredibly emotive, but that's subjective.

Just recently I was inspired by Michael Nyman to revisit the piano music of Erik Satie. Nyman used the Aldo Ciccolini interpretation of "Trois Gymnopodies, Vol. 1" in the soundtrack to the film Man On Wire. I borrowed the LP it's on (Piano Music of Erik Satie, Vol 1.) from a friend, and have been playing it for weeks.

 

[kwitel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tru blu /img/forum/go_quote.gif I was tempted to think this also, but my guess is that kwitel is enjoying listening to The Hours soundtrack without the film. It's true, however, that by virtue of function a film score probably works a bit differently than music composed solely for listening. I find that the sparseness of the 2nd movement of "Tabula Rasa" is incredibly emotive, but that's subjective. Just recently I was inspired by Michael Nyman to revisit the piano music of Erik Satie. Nyman used the Aldo Ciccolini interpretation of "Trois Gymnopodies, Vol. 1" in the soundtrack to the film Man On Wire. I borrowed the LP it's on (Piano Music of Erik Satie, Vol 1.) from a friend, and have been playing it for weeks.

tru-blu-good call, I enjoy most of my "classical soundtracks" either without watching the movie or having even seen the movie prior. Didnt particularly enjoy The Hours as a film...

As to your Tabula Rasa statement, I couldnt agree more; the 2nd movement is beautiful but still not exactly what I am looking for.

My question however still remains: What style classical music is found in most movie soundtracks? Whatever it is, thats what I need to research.

 

[scytheavatar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif All, I am having a hard time with many of these suggestions. Not sure if its my untrained ear or, just not what I am looking for. For some reason, I cannot find classical music that I find as emotionally stirring or beautiful as many of the film scores i own. (I can just imagine all the classical lovers with their jaws on the ground right about now...) How would you classify the type of classical found in scores by Glass, Nyman, Serra, Riley etc? Ive tried Parts Tabula Rasa and Shosty's 5th. The former is nice but its a little sparse-if that makes any sense. The latter is good but I need a lot more time with it. I also tried Rileys "In C"-which is interesting but lacks the emotion I am looking for. It is simply too minimal/repetitive. I am listening to "loreley" on the Nowhere in Africa soundtrack from Nike Reiser and its just a beautiful piece of music (albeit quite short). Its this type of music, although longer compositions, that I am looking for. What kind of classical is this? (Other faves are Glass's "The Hours" and Nyman's "Gattaca" and Mansell's "The Fountain".)

Is your problem with 20th century classical music or classical music in general? Most of the 20th century classical music is highly experimental, highly intellectual and a love it/hate it affair. It's highly influenced by dissonance and the avant-garde movement, and not really accessible. If you are looking for something emotionally stirring or beautiful, have you looked at the romantic period stuff from Tchaikovsky, Dvořák, Wagner and gang?

Check out Yann Tiersen - Amélie. Is that what you are looking for?

 

[kwitel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scytheavatar /img/forum/go_quote.gif Is your problem with 20th century classical music or classical music in general? Most of the 20th century classical music is highly experimental, highly intellectual and a love it/hate it affair. It's highly influenced by dissonance and the avant-garde movement, and not really accessible. If you are looking for something emotionally stirring or beautiful, have you looked at the romantic period stuff from Tchaikovsky, Dvořák, Wagner and gang? Check out Yann Tiersen - Amélie. Is that what you are looking for?

Im looking for music that is in the same vein as the movie scores that I have already mentioned, albeit longer length compositions.
I will look into Yann Tiersen.

As for classical music in general-I love alot of it, dislike some of it.
Its just that the genre is so daunting due to its size that it literally stresses me out every time I make a go of getting into some new material.
I have heard some Tchai (symphony #4) and Dvorak (serenade for strings) but wasnt blown away.

Thtas the main issue I have with alot of these composers. Their music tends to vary so greatly from piece to piece; its possible I just havent heard the "right" material first or, the music that would be first most accessible to me.

Most importantly, everyone seems to be avoiding the one question I keep asking:

The movie scores by Nyman, Riley, Glass, Serra, Reiser, Mansell...what style of classical is this??
I find almost all of their scores to be incredibly emotionally stirring; whatever sub genre of classical they play-thats what im looking for.

 

[tru blu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Most importantly, everyone seems to be avoiding the one question I keep asking: The movie scores by Nyman, Riley, Glass, Serra, Reiser, Mansell...what style of classical is this?? I find almost all of their scores to be incredibly emotionally stirring; whatever sub genre of classical they play-thats what im looking for.

I'm not saying this to be flip, but the subgenre you're looking for is probably best called "film scores." As far as nuts-and-bolts classifications go, the composers you mention all fit into a genre; Philip Glass and Terry Riley, say, are minimalists, while Nyman is more of a romantic, I think (someone please correct me if I'm wrong). You may have already found what you're looking, and just need to go deeper into that.

I can't help but be curious about whether you've sampled that Le Cinema disc by Gidon Kremer that I originally recommended. It's actually interpretations of film music rather than what was heard in actual films, but I've been listening to it more since I mentioned it, and I think the compositions stand on their own.

 

[gregorio]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif tru-blu-good call, I enjoy most of my "classical soundtracks" either without watching the movie or having even seen the movie prior. Didnt particularly enjoy The Hours as a film... As to your Tabula Rasa statement, I couldnt agree more; the 2nd movement is beautiful but still not exactly what I am looking for. My question however still remains: What style classical music is found in most movie soundtracks? Whatever it is, thats what I need to research.

Movie music varies in style considerably. Beauty in music was mainly a "classical period" concept, which to a large extent carried over into the romantic period. C20th music was more influenced by experimentation of sound and the breaking of the concept that music had to be beautiful to be good.

For many of the big orchestral film scores (Williams, Shore, Horner, Goldsmith, Zimmer, etc.) the style could probably best be described as post-romantic with influences from impressionism. These scores are similar in style to Tchaikovsky, Rimsky-Korsakov, Mahler, Bruckner, Wagner, Rachmaninov, R Strauss, Vaughan-Williams and even Beethoven and Brahms, amongst many others.

As mentioned before, Glass and Riley are generally classified as minimalists along with the composer generally regarded as the inventor of minimalism; Steve Reich, you could also try another minimalist John Adams.

G