Saoshyant
Headphoneus Supremus
Well, technically the Senn Momentum can be bought at a Best Buy, altho it does require it to be one with a Magnolia dept., which I have no clue how common those are.
LOL at all the Beats bashers........
money4me247
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while Beats have their own little premium section at target, radioshack, bestbuy, walmart, brookstone, fry's, and apple stores..... I think I even saw beats at gamestop.
how are consumers supposed to know to buy other headphones when beats are being sold as premium at every store i go to??
i've already gave up on demo-ing headphones or even buying from a retail store location near me. it's now what websites have good return policies when I want to try new headphones.
in business terms, this is called market dominance. and the sad thing is that they've only been in the game for 5 years.
while Beats have their own little premium section at target, radioshack, bestbuy, walmart, brookstone, fry's, and apple stores..... I think I even saw beats at gamestop.
how are consumers supposed to know to buy other headphones when beats are being sold as premium at every store i go to??
i've already gave up on demo-ing headphones or even buying from a retail store location near me. it's now what websites have good return policies when I want to try new headphones.
in business terms, this is called market dominance. and the sad thing is that they've only been in the game for 5 years.
Saoshyant
Headphoneus Supremus
I understand you're upset by this, but there is such a thing as personal responsibility. It is the consumer's job to go out and actively seek information before making a purchase. I personally have a hard time feeling bad for someone that isn't willing to spend a little time researching before making a big purchase. Now, I fully admit it is not the consumer's fault if they are lead to believe something that isn't true because of advertising, but in this same respect, you could make the argument that ignorance is bliss. If someone is willing to go out and spend 300+ on headphones, and they are happy with the purchase they make, that is ultimately all that matters, even if others looking at them do not agree with the decision.
jake120
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"how are consumers supposed to know to buy other headphones when beats are being sold as premium at every store i go to??"
Well you know most consumers don't do research in the same way experienced researchers and those who already have a grab on the audio market do... their likely time spent looking is usually much less and more orientated on cost price.
I think it is likely,
you will find that those who have experience use non audio stores to get what they want if it is faster and the headphone is in stock.
most likely scenario:
The equipment most audio orientated audience uses is mature enough that it gets the needed attention or possibly there is no adequate set up for the price of the equipment used and the market would not benefit,
the return of sales from the cost plus of putting out the gear to stores is less than just having a selective group of stores that sell a limited quality.
Well you know most consumers don't do research in the same way experienced researchers and those who already have a grab on the audio market do... their likely time spent looking is usually much less and more orientated on cost price.
I think it is likely,
you will find that those who have experience use non audio stores to get what they want if it is faster and the headphone is in stock.
most likely scenario:
The equipment most audio orientated audience uses is mature enough that it gets the needed attention or possibly there is no adequate set up for the price of the equipment used and the market would not benefit,
the return of sales from the cost plus of putting out the gear to stores is less than just having a selective group of stores that sell a limited quality.
bareyb
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How does one unsubscribe from this thread? I think i'm done talking about "Beats"...
mbamg
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Guys, just get some decent headphones and listen to some music. Forget about Beats and be prepared to be amazed by what you have.
money4me247
Headphoneus Supremus
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hahah i'm not upset by this. i am honestly just amazed. Beats are able to completely dominate the market share & reap tons of profit with a product that has flimsy build quality & audio quality that everyone here says is inferior. I am sure there are people at Wharton business school studying how to replicate the Beats success in other markets.
In fact, I think it is really pathetic that the more established audiophile quality headphone brands are not doing more to try to steal some of the market-share away from Beats. Beats already demonstrated that normal people are willing to throw down $300 for perceived premium audio. Why are the companies that actually make premium audio still regulated to just to such the small niche? Why is it that headphones from 50 cent or Ludacris or Fany Wang are outselling headphones from established headphone manufacturers that have been doing this for the 50+yrs?
The fact is that the public perception is that Beats are the best and it's the fault of the Beats competitors from failing to challenge them. It would be amazing if more-established headphone brands focused more on targeting the general public & spread awareness about their products. The discrepancy in opinions I've experience from real-life vs these forums is pretty astonishing. I feel like most other market segments aren't so weird. Normal people say Rolexs are good, and watch enthusiasts think Rolexs are fine too. Normal people think Mercedes/Porsche are good, and car enthusiasts would agree. In headphones, normal people say Beats are good, and headphone enthusiasts all start dissing. That is really interesting to me.
I think it is silly that certain people in this community would throw out personal insults for people who buy certain brands of headphones whether pro-beats or anti-beats. However, the Beats phenomena is really interesting and should have a positive effect on the headphones industry as it exposes more people to the idea of paying for nicer audio equipment. If companies step up to innovate and compete, this is be great for all of us. However, it would be bad if fashion become the focus of headphones rather than sound quality.
Just some of my own thoughts & observations on the matter. I don't mean anything offense. I really enjoy hearing different headphones and seeing the differences in sound signatures. I don't think there is one superior to another, but just different preferences. from a business perspective, the headphones industry is very very interesting though.
hahah i'm not upset by this. i am honestly just amazed. Beats are able to completely dominate the market share & reap tons of profit with a product that has flimsy build quality & audio quality that everyone here says is inferior. I am sure there are people at Wharton business school studying how to replicate the Beats success in other markets.
In fact, I think it is really pathetic that the more established audiophile quality headphone brands are not doing more to try to steal some of the market-share away from Beats. Beats already demonstrated that normal people are willing to throw down $300 for perceived premium audio. Why are the companies that actually make premium audio still regulated to just to such the small niche? Why is it that headphones from 50 cent or Ludacris or Fany Wang are outselling headphones from established headphone manufacturers that have been doing this for the 50+yrs?
The fact is that the public perception is that Beats are the best and it's the fault of the Beats competitors from failing to challenge them. It would be amazing if more-established headphone brands focused more on targeting the general public & spread awareness about their products. The discrepancy in opinions I've experience from real-life vs these forums is pretty astonishing. I feel like most other market segments aren't so weird. Normal people say Rolexs are good, and watch enthusiasts think Rolexs are fine too. Normal people think Mercedes/Porsche are good, and car enthusiasts would agree. In headphones, normal people say Beats are good, and headphone enthusiasts all start dissing. That is really interesting to me.
I think it is silly that certain people in this community would throw out personal insults for people who buy certain brands of headphones whether pro-beats or anti-beats. However, the Beats phenomena is really interesting and should have a positive effect on the headphones industry as it exposes more people to the idea of paying for nicer audio equipment. If companies step up to innovate and compete, this is be great for all of us. However, it would be bad if fashion become the focus of headphones rather than sound quality.
Just some of my own thoughts & observations on the matter. I don't mean anything offense. I really enjoy hearing different headphones and seeing the differences in sound signatures. I don't think there is one superior to another, but just different preferences. from a business perspective, the headphones industry is very very interesting though.
bareyb
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Not a fact at all... I was initially interested in getting a set for my daughter for Christmas last year. It was almost impossible to find a positive review on them anywhere. So no. the "public" doesn't think they are the best. They public and most of the educated world as far as I can tell, think they are crap. So don't kid yourself....
One thing that IS cool though, is that they have helped renew interest in full sized headphones. So for that I thank them...
Not a fact at all... I was initially interested in getting a set for my daughter for Christmas last year. It was almost impossible to find a positive review on them anywhere. So no. the "public" doesn't think they are the best. They public and most of the educated world as far as I can tell, think they are crap. So don't kid yourself....
One thing that IS cool though, is that they have helped renew interest in full sized headphones. So for that I thank them...
money4me247
Headphoneus Supremus
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Sure, that may be your opinion... but unfortunately, yes, the general public does think they are the best. You ask the check-out guy at the grocery store what is the best headphones brand. You ask the Best Buy guy. You ask the college-kids. You ask the parents. You ask the magazine writers. Ask the guy on the subway.
Why do you think Beats headphones commands over 64% of the over-$100-headphones market share in 2012? Their market share in the headphones industry is over 50%. That is a fact, not an opinion. Obviously, the general public does not think they suck. I am going to refrain from throwing out personal insults about your education like you did against me, but I am in medical school and the majority of my classmates think Beats/Bose are the best. Is that because of their lack of intelligence?
The fact that you happen to know more audiophiles and hang out around these forums more doesn't mean you have an accurate reflection of public opinion. Head-fi opinions is NOT reflected in the general public. Your daughter honestly probably would have preferred to get a pair of Beats. So rather than making opinion-based statements about the popularity of headphones, open your eyes, look at the statistics and see the amount of people wearing Beats... and there is your answer.
I understand there are better alternatives and I am not personally saying that I think Beats are the best. I am saying that public perception is that Beats are really good, because the majority of headphone-buyers are throwing down their $100+ on Beats. This is a fact, not an opinion.
Not a fact at all... I was initially interested in getting a set for my daughter for Christmas last year. It was almost impossible to find a positive review on them anywhere. So no. the "public" doesn't think they are the best. They public and most of the educated world as far as I can tell, think they are crap. So don't kid yourself....
One thing that IS cool though, is that they have helped renew interest in full sized headphones. So for that I thank them...
Sure, that may be your opinion... but unfortunately, yes, the general public does think they are the best. You ask the check-out guy at the grocery store what is the best headphones brand. You ask the Best Buy guy. You ask the college-kids. You ask the parents. You ask the magazine writers. Ask the guy on the subway.
Why do you think Beats headphones commands over 64% of the over-$100-headphones market share in 2012? Their market share in the headphones industry is over 50%. That is a fact, not an opinion. Obviously, the general public does not think they suck. I am going to refrain from throwing out personal insults about your education like you did against me, but I am in medical school and the majority of my classmates think Beats/Bose are the best. Is that because of their lack of intelligence?
The fact that you happen to know more audiophiles and hang out around these forums more doesn't mean you have an accurate reflection of public opinion. Head-fi opinions is NOT reflected in the general public. Your daughter honestly probably would have preferred to get a pair of Beats. So rather than making opinion-based statements about the popularity of headphones, open your eyes, look at the statistics and see the amount of people wearing Beats... and there is your answer.
I understand there are better alternatives and I am not personally saying that I think Beats are the best. I am saying that public perception is that Beats are really good, because the majority of headphone-buyers are throwing down their $100+ on Beats. This is a fact, not an opinion.
lebomb
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Seriously??? Numbers dont lie. As shown earlier......look at which cans sell the most. So I guess even though Beats outsell all other headphones the public believes they are the 5th or 6th best headphones available?
Not a fact at all... I was initially interested in getting a set for my daughter for Christmas last year. It was almost impossible to find a positive review on them anywhere. So no. the "public" doesn't think they are the best. They public and most of the educated world as far as I can tell, think they are crap. So don't kid yourself....
One thing that IS cool though, is that they have helped renew interest in full sized headphones. So for that I thank them...
Seriously??? Numbers dont lie. As shown earlier......look at which cans sell the most. So I guess even though Beats outsell all other headphones the public believes they are the 5th or 6th best headphones available?
BetaWolf
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In response to this, the Best Buy I've seen with a Magnolia section, in addition to having Sennheiser Momentum, also has the Sennheiser HD 558, Audio Technica ATH-A900x, AKG K550, and even the Denon AH-D600. The PROBLEM with them is that they're in the Magnolia section, tucked away for nobody to see. I visited the Bose, Beats, and Skullcandy section of the store on three different visits before even knowing that section existed. I told a friend about it, and he went to look, and had trouble finding it despite me telling him EXACTLY where it was. It's hidden in a quite literally eerie, dark corner of the store that very people know exists.
The other problem is that people who do their research ultimately end up buying online, so these stores cannot be entirely to blame for not stocking these headphones.
In response to this, the Best Buy I've seen with a Magnolia section, in addition to having Sennheiser Momentum, also has the Sennheiser HD 558, Audio Technica ATH-A900x, AKG K550, and even the Denon AH-D600. The PROBLEM with them is that they're in the Magnolia section, tucked away for nobody to see. I visited the Bose, Beats, and Skullcandy section of the store on three different visits before even knowing that section existed. I told a friend about it, and he went to look, and had trouble finding it despite me telling him EXACTLY where it was. It's hidden in a quite literally eerie, dark corner of the store that very people know exists.
The other problem is that people who do their research ultimately end up buying online, so these stores cannot be entirely to blame for not stocking these headphones.
jake120
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The avg consumer buys their product not expecting to have to get chains of equipment to get performance.
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The avg headphones at the price beats demands, could be tailored for professional use and might not well integrate with mainstream audiences.
Lack of interest in researching more than anything, i suffered from the same when i went for a guitar and a guitar amp and got offered acoustic instead when i started out... cant say i regret it.
most of the public expect it to 'fall into their lap' so to speak and headphones at $300+ demand attention not flippant purchasers with no understanding there's more than just the headphone involved.
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Public perception isn't really at it for a lot of people actually,
there are plenty who prefer Triton, sennheiser, turtle beach and other phones marketed around mainstream with minimal equipment required to get decent output.
in fact some would go as far as thinking gaming headphones were 'it' for quality...
The avg consumer buys their product not expecting to have to get chains of equipment to get performance.
Quote:
The avg headphones at the price beats demands, could be tailored for professional use and might not well integrate with mainstream audiences.
Lack of interest in researching more than anything, i suffered from the same when i went for a guitar and a guitar amp and got offered acoustic instead when i started out... cant say i regret it.
most of the public expect it to 'fall into their lap' so to speak and headphones at $300+ demand attention not flippant purchasers with no understanding there's more than just the headphone involved.
Quote:
Public perception isn't really at it for a lot of people actually,
there are plenty who prefer Triton, sennheiser, turtle beach and other phones marketed around mainstream with minimal equipment required to get decent output.
in fact some would go as far as thinking gaming headphones were 'it' for quality...
money4me247
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lol... obviously, if you look at the numbers, the public does indeed believe Beats are one of the best headphones.
However, that does NOT mean the public is correct. If you look at opinions of industry-experts/enthusiasts, Beats often rank quite low when compared to other competitors.
There is obviously a big discrepancy between public perception and headphone enthusiasts' opinions, and I personally believe that this is due to the fact that the more highly-recommended headphones simply cannot be easily found in stores and are not well-advertised so the average consumer has no idea about them.
I just find it silly that, for some reason, some people on this site seem to think there is a correlation between intelligence and buying Beats, and always resort to personal attacks based on headphone purchases. Buying a pair of headphones does not reflect anyone's personality/intelligence level. They either did not know/did not have access to alternatives that may have been better or were satisfied with the product they received or purposely choose their product due to factors beyond sound quality (which is perfectly acceptable as well). Audiophiles buy bluetooth/wireless, noise-canceling, sweat-resistant, in-ears, and closed headphones due to features beyond sound quality per dollar. Also, it makes perfect sense that people buy Beats considering how hard it is to find quality alternatives in-store/retail locations.
lol... obviously, if you look at the numbers, the public does indeed believe Beats are one of the best headphones.
However, that does NOT mean the public is correct. If you look at opinions of industry-experts/enthusiasts, Beats often rank quite low when compared to other competitors.
There is obviously a big discrepancy between public perception and headphone enthusiasts' opinions, and I personally believe that this is due to the fact that the more highly-recommended headphones simply cannot be easily found in stores and are not well-advertised so the average consumer has no idea about them.
I just find it silly that, for some reason, some people on this site seem to think there is a correlation between intelligence and buying Beats, and always resort to personal attacks based on headphone purchases. Buying a pair of headphones does not reflect anyone's personality/intelligence level. They either did not know/did not have access to alternatives that may have been better or were satisfied with the product they received or purposely choose their product due to factors beyond sound quality (which is perfectly acceptable as well). Audiophiles buy bluetooth/wireless, noise-canceling, sweat-resistant, in-ears, and closed headphones due to features beyond sound quality per dollar. Also, it makes perfect sense that people buy Beats considering how hard it is to find quality alternatives in-store/retail locations.
soundstige
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lol, does someone here actually think marketing is free and lets you put all your money towards R&D? Come on, no one is this naive.
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Saoshyant
Headphoneus Supremus
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Generally, watches would not be a good parallel example for this kind of argument. There are quite a few people that could make the argument that a $20 dollar digital timex keeps more accurate time than a $25k Rolex due to the way a mechanical watch functions compared to digital. The arguments that seem to be made against Beats is that they underperform for their cost, maybe 3-5x depending who you ask, you're basically paying a premium for the name and the looks. So, "technically", most of the cost of the Rolex is the name and looks/materials as well.
But honestly, as a watch lover, I understand the heart of the argument you're trying to make, and would NEVER honestly try to argue that a Timex is a better watch than a Rolex. Watches, while functional, are primarily a form of jewelry, which the aesthetic quality is the main indication of value.
Heh, my 100th post is me being kind of a punk... sorry about that.
Generally, watches would not be a good parallel example for this kind of argument. There are quite a few people that could make the argument that a $20 dollar digital timex keeps more accurate time than a $25k Rolex due to the way a mechanical watch functions compared to digital. The arguments that seem to be made against Beats is that they underperform for their cost, maybe 3-5x depending who you ask, you're basically paying a premium for the name and the looks. So, "technically", most of the cost of the Rolex is the name and looks/materials as well.
But honestly, as a watch lover, I understand the heart of the argument you're trying to make, and would NEVER honestly try to argue that a Timex is a better watch than a Rolex. Watches, while functional, are primarily a form of jewelry, which the aesthetic quality is the main indication of value.
Heh, my 100th post is me being kind of a punk... sorry about that.
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