Keces DA-152
Oct 14, 2008 at 3:01 PM Post #2 of 26
x2 saw this and was intrigued. But it is USB input only and i really want optical. Also it is quite pricey at $475 esp with the exchange rate at the moment. I guess that's something us English folk are just going to have to get used to.
 
Oct 14, 2008 at 3:46 PM Post #3 of 26
I saw it today as well, also saw the high price. It must have some serious amping circuit in it. But, for a little more you can get a dedicated headphone amp (as in Littledot) and a Keces DA-151 or 2nd hand DAC.
I think the DA-152 is especially interesting for people who don't want too much hassle. It's quite convenient to only have one unit that's both a DAC and amp.
 
Oct 14, 2008 at 3:48 PM Post #4 of 26
My guess is that at a later date a DA-132 unit will appear to cover people who wish to use S/PDIF or Toslink instead. Perhaps David would like to comment on this at some point?
smily_headphones1.gif


Anyway, looks neat, and will certainly cut down on desktop space used (which is pretty much the only negative issue with my current setup). The big question is how does it perform compared to using a seperate headphone amp with a 151? (whilst keeping within a similar price bracket, obviously).
 
Oct 17, 2008 at 4:57 PM Post #11 of 26
Well, I didn't expect a post on DA-152 to be up here so soon, I thought it'd need a bit of time to brew before people will notice it. :p

Anyways, regarding the price of the unit, yes it is not a cheap unit, and we did not build it cheaply either. From the very first when I was discussing with KECES' owner about this, we had planned for something that can go head to head against other best in class products from competitors. To do that, we not only have to use quality parts, we also have to experiment with several different configurations and constant tweaks. In the end, we ended up with something that costs us more than twice of what DA-151 had costs us. However, we felt it is a good trade off to not cut the corners on our DA-152, and it performs very well in many of our real-world listening tests. I have personally tested it on ER-4P, HD650 and AKG 240DF, and it excels while clearly reflecting the differences between each headphone/IEM. (No, using ER-4P with DA-152 does not require ear-drum replacement... just turn the volume down, and you'd be surprised to hear how balanced it is even when turned down to very low volume.)


Another advantage that I've found during the pre-order phase is that one customer wanted something that he can use to monitor his recording on the fly, and he wants something small and neat with the ability to drive his active speaker or his headphone. Which is basically what DA-152 is designed to do, and I'd love to have the chance of a shootout against other stand-alone headphone amps+DAC that costs similar or somewhat more than DA-152, and see how DA-152 fairs in comparison.


As for one Head-Fier who is wondering how the bass is on DA-152, basically it is very controlled, with natural decay and not a hint of boomyness (whatever that's called). If you music/recording calls for a large KA-Boom, then that's what exactly you will hear with good speed, control and power. It will not over-exaggerate to something that is not what it is, nor will it skimp on what it should deliver.




As for DA-132, it is not in the plans yet. We are currently thinking about a stand alone headphone amp that is going to be similar in configuration to DA-152's headphone section. However, since there's no DAC circuit taking up precious room, the headphone amp will be overbuilt to house even more goodies. Some features were left out on DA-152 because it takes too much room, these will be the features that we will be implementing into the stand alone headphone amp
smily_headphones1.gif



When's the amp going to be released? I honestly don't know, but we are working on it.
 
Oct 18, 2008 at 12:23 AM Post #13 of 26
Quote:

Originally Posted by 1UP /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hey Maniac - can you tell us more about the particular IC you chose for the headamp circuit?


We use the combination of LME49710 op amp and LME49600 power buffer to make up the headphone amp circuit. We found the new series of chip from National Semiconductor is sounding really good, as we found out when we switch from OPA604 to LME49710 on DA-131 and DA-151. (Some earlier customers also did the switch themselves and like the result very much.) Which is why we decided to use their new power buffer chip in conjunction with the LME49710 op amp that we already use.

We set it up so that the op amp used for LPF stays as is, and headphone amp use another dedicated op amp. We had tried in experiment to use the LPF op amp to pull double duty, and found having a dedicated op amp for each duty will perform better, a lot better. Which is why we ended up with the current setup.
 
Oct 19, 2008 at 8:12 AM Post #15 of 26
Quote:

Originally Posted by 1UP /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Thanks for the info. Did you try putting a buffer chip after the lineout opamp?


Yup, and performance suffers...

DA-151's signal path is like this:
PCM2702 -> Bennic XPP Cap -> LM49710 LPF circuit -> output

DA-152 originally had a path like this:
PCM2702 -> LME49710 LPF & DC Cancel circuit -> Volume pot -> Buffer and the performance sucked....

We updated the DC canceling circuit, power supply, and redo the whole path...


The production units now have a path like this:
PCM2702 -> LME49710 LPF with improved DC Cancel circuit -> Volume pot -> LME49710 & LME49600 Voltage Gain & Current Buffer circuit.

The improvement that we had gained through various revisions and updates were quite significant, and we loved the results!
smily_headphones1.gif
 

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