[JayGee]

A couple of months ago I posted some negative comments on the 880s sound. The reason I did this was because I originally bought the 880s based on all the positive verbiage here at headfi. I read many times that they were
as good as the better Senns, etc. So I was very dissapointed when I actually bought a pair. They are not the worst headphones in the world, but they are in no way competitive with something like the Senn 650 or AKG 701. I also called attention to the HiFi+ review that seemed to agree completely with my listening experience.

I now see that there are actually very few people here who really take this phone seriously. But a few of the people who like it post so much that it distorts the issue for people looking for information.

Much as I like and admire the Senn 650 it is not my main headphone, that is currently the AGK 501. I don't think the 501 is really competitive with the 650 in terms of performance, but I enjoy it. For some reason the people here who like the Beyer 880 want people to beleive it is a top class headphone, not just a matter of personal taste.

Anyway, maybe the new version will be better...

Jaygee

 

[Cyrilix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayGee A couple of months ago I posted some negative comments on the 880s sound. The reason I did this was because I originally bought the 880s based on all the positive verbiage here at headfi. I read many times that they were as good as the better Senns, etc. So I was very dissapointed when I actually bought a pair. They are not the worst headphones in the world, but they are in no way competitive with something like the Senn 650 or AKG 701. I also called attention to the HiFi+ review that seemed to agree completely with my listening experience. I now see that there are actually very few people here who really take this phone seriously. But a few of the people who like it post so much that it distorts the issue for people looking for information. Much as I like and admire the Senn 650 it is not my main headphone, that is currently the AGK 501. I don't think the 501 is really competitive with the 650 in terms of performance, but I enjoy it. For some reason the people here who like the Beyer 880 want people to beleive it is a top class headphone, not just a matter of personal taste. Anyway, maybe the new version will be better... Jaygee

Jaygee, as much as I have to say that your opinion is accepted, it would be a far better thing to restructure your post in a way that doesn't sound like flame-bait. You ever wonder why people jump on you?

Let me comment on some of your arguments/quotes:

You said "all the positive verbiage at head-fi" --> Indeed, this is true, there is a great deal of positive talk, but there are also a lot of criticisms of the faults of the DT880s. By faults, I mean sonic signatures that are not appreciated by everyone such as the boosted treble. In my experience, I've read my fair share of criticism, maybe you have not. A lot of people posted in AdamCalifornia's DT880 negatives thread, and were quick to point out a lot of them, positive comments aside. If you're a good reader/researcher, the comments here are not misleading at all.

"They are not the worst headphones in the world, but they are in no way competitive with something like the Senn 650 or AKG 701." --> Maybe it's just that you're not very good with the English language and its many connotations, but that definitely sounds like something many people could take offensively. As well, you make no point at all of trying to put a scope or context on your description, just that they're not good enough. I don't think it would be wrong for anyone to start flaming you at this point, would it?

"I now see that there are actually very few people here who really take this phone seriously." --> That's the exact kind of thing that you would be expected to say, by just reading the poll, but for an educated person that reads comments, I'm sorry to say, but I think you're far off. A lot of people take the DT880 seriously, and just because they have other phone preferences, many would speak up or recommend them (from my personal experience in these forums). It's not just fewtch + 2 people, you do know that right? See some DT880-specific threads.

"But a few of the people who like it post so much that it distorts the issue for people looking for information." --> And you don't post a lot about its negatives? It looks like you're one of the opposite of the camp you just mentioned. Also, it is my belief that if you made better-phrased comments, you wouldn't get such a reaction and as many counter postings to your own.

"For some reason the people here who like the Beyer 880 want people to beleive it is a top class headphone, not just a matter of personal taste." --> Well, there you go telling people that they're wrong. What if they said you were wrong? Then we'd just have a pissing contest right?

 

[jagorev]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayGee I now see that there are actually very few people here who really take this phone seriously. But a few of the people who like it post so much that it distorts the issue for people looking for information.

That's a pretty serious misinterpretation of this poll.

Quote:

For some reason the people here who like the Beyer 880 want people to beleive it is a top class headphone, not just a matter of personal taste.

Obviously, many head-fiers feel the 650 or 701 is more to their personal taste, and a few prefer the 880 according to their taste. Isn't it all a matter of personal taste? A popularity contest of people's preferences is not a measure of which one is objectively superior. Nor is it proof that one of these headphones is not a top-class headphone. Note the poll question: I've heard all three; my personal preference...

This poll is pretty good evidence that many head-fiers subjectively prefer the 701 or 650 to the 880. That's all. No need to hate on a very worthy headphone just because you don't like it.

 

[Rickio]

Well this is a noobs observation. I believe HD650 has so many votes because it's been around longer and people who would have heard it have time to hear the K701.

I have noticed many people prefer the HD600 because it is more neutral. I think many DT880 and K701 and HD600 users would not even venture into HD650 territory because of the admited fact it is colored darker. I tend to feel that audiophile purists would look towards a can that isn't colored so dark. So fans of those headphones cannot vote if they have not heard the HD650. I cannot vote so I won't as I won't try and tip the balance.

I have HD580 and have not gone up the ladder yet. But have K701 and DT880, both new and older versions. I tend to like the K701's right now and I really am not inspired to check out the HD650 by what I have read about them. I eventually will hear them but I honestly believe many who apreciate DT880's and K701's are not even interested in venturing toward HD650's.

The DT880 is a quality can in my humble opinon and my liking the k701 just a bit more is because I just got them. I need more time with both.

The people who claim to have heard all three are a minority I believe and I am not so certain if all who voted have owned all three for extended periods of time. I think having tested all 3 is really not qualifying but who really cares anyway.

If the k701 can get this much positive votes in this short time, I would venture to say it will beat HD650 in the long run. Just a guess

peace out!

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhythmdevils I dont understand why so many of you are running to the defense of the DT880's. Maybe the reason that they are "loosing" so badly in this poll is simply because most people prefer the 650/k701 over the DT880...

Of course. I was just giving some reasons why I think this may be so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bizkid I've been a huge DT880 fan since they came out a few years ago (not the 80s version). But today i got my k701 and i'm WOW IMHO these are clearly a step above the DT880. They're so natural and realistic, and can actually do rock which the DT880 failed sadly on due to missing mids.

Missing mids, What?

I also own the K501 (which is supposed to have among the best mids in the business) and don't feel that anything is missing with the DT880... not to mention graphs showing DT880 mids flat as a pancake. I guess everyone hears a bit differently, but this is really weird. To me, if anything DT880's issues with rock have to do with bass being on the airy side rather than something related to the mids.

 

[gordolindsay]

I don't know the reason for sure why the 880's aren't getting many votes but my experience tells me the 701 is an upgrade from the 880's. I think my favorites of the three are like this: 650=701>880.

The 701 and 880 are sort of similar in sound signitures, the brighter leaner sound. But the 701's have a more punchier bass and have better texture in the midrange. Both the phones upper regions are very good.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it!

 

[bizkid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fewtch Of course. I was just giving some reasons why I think this may be so. Missing mids, What? I also own the K501 (which is supposed to have among the best mids in the business) and don't feel that anything is missing with the DT880... not to mention graphs showing DT880 mids flat as a pancake. I guess everyone hears a bit differently, but this is really weird. To me, if anything DT880's issues with rock have to do with bass being on the airy side rather than something related to the mids.

Let me explain it a little better. Frequencywhise the mids are there for sure. But with electric guitars, especially guitars which were recorded and doubled (panned left and right, recording same guitar track many times and overlay it to achieve a "fat" sound) the guitars sound somehow veiled and a little distant on the DT880. It doesnt punch in your face like it should. The K701 does that better. Maybe its a soundstage thing more than a frequency thing.

 

[ddroit2005]

I have never listented to dt880. But I have both of HD650 and K701.

I think both belong to same league with different taste.

I like one of them in different music.

K701: Violin, and Piano (focused on clarity)
HD650: Cello and Vocal (focused on smoothness).

But I am not sure how blue dragon v2 or equinox would make hd650 better.

 

[EscaBoi]

i've only heard the K701 and HD600's but from what i heard from the 600's i liked, and think the HD650's would be even better.

 

[mypasswordis]

I don't think the DT880's are at the same pricepoint as the 650 and 701 anymore, so it wouldn't really be a fair comparison. The fact that people say they only slightly prefer the 650 and 701 to the DT880 should say something about how good a deal it is. I wish I could audition these cans right now, but alas, no money

 

[Cyrilix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypasswordis I don't think the DT880's are at the same pricepoint as the 650 and 701 anymore, so it wouldn't really be a fair comparison. The fact that people say they only slightly prefer the 650 and 701 to the DT880 should say something about how good a deal it is. I wish I could audition these cans right now, but alas, no money

Unfortunately, DT880s are now $60 more expensive than when I bought them. That's almost a 30% increase!

 

[mypasswordis]

How much did you pay? I checked Froogle and 2 sites had them for around $225. One of them actually looked respectable

but they were out of stock.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...ist&sku=280696

 

[Cyrilix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypasswordis How much did you pay? I checked Froogle and 2 sites had them for around $225. One of them actually looked respectable but they were out of stock. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...ist&sku=280696

$210 US. But, now, the older models are getting phased out and the newer ones will be expensive.. at least on Meier audio, they're $270.

 

[JayGee]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyrilix Jaygee, as much as I have to say that your opinion is accepted, it would be a far better thing to restructure your post in a way that doesn't sound like flame-bait. You ever wonder why people jump on you? Let me comment on some of your arguments/quotes: You said "all the positive verbiage at head-fi" --> Indeed, this is true, there is a great deal of positive talk, but there are also a lot of criticisms of the faults of the DT880s. By faults, I mean sonic signatures that are not appreciated by everyone such as the boosted treble. In my experience, I've read my fair share of criticism, maybe you have not. A lot of people posted in AdamCalifornia's DT880 negatives thread, and were quick to point out a lot of them, positive comments aside. If you're a good reader/researcher, the comments here are not misleading at all. "They are not the worst headphones in the world, but they are in no way competitive with something like the Senn 650 or AKG 701." --> Maybe it's just that you're not very good with the English language and its many connotations, but that definitely sounds like something many people could take offensively. As well, you make no point at all of trying to put a scope or context on your description, just that they're not good enough. I don't think it would be wrong for anyone to start flaming you at this point, would it? "I now see that there are actually very few people here who really take this phone seriously." --> That's the exact kind of thing that you would be expected to say, by just reading the poll, but for an educated person that reads comments, I'm sorry to say, but I think you're far off. A lot of people take the DT880 seriously, and just because they have other phone preferences, many would speak up or recommend them (from my personal experience in these forums). It's not just fewtch + 2 people, you do know that right? See some DT880-specific threads. "But a few of the people who like it post so much that it distorts the issue for people looking for information." --> And you don't post a lot about its negatives? It looks like you're one of the opposite of the camp you just mentioned. Also, it is my belief that if you made better-phrased comments, you wouldn't get such a reaction and as many counter postings to your own. "For some reason the people here who like the Beyer 880 want people to beleive it is a top class headphone, not just a matter of personal taste." --> Well, there you go telling people that they're wrong. What if they said you were wrong? Then we'd just have a pissing contest right?

Cyrllix,

I'm trying to understand the point of your post. I'm talking about headphones, you do a critique of what I've written. Why does my writing style concern you so much?

I don't particularly care if I get "flamed" or not. It's hard for me to even consider the subject seriously. I'm writing my thoughts regarding the subject at hand in a fairly direct manner. I'm not trying to be popular.

Jaygee

 

[warpdriver]

It's pretty clear to me that the OLD 880's are outclassed by the 701's and 650's by a notch. That doesn't mean they are bad headphones at all, I still enjoy mine, but everything the 880 does well, I think the K701 does better. Keep in mind that this poll only reflects that the 880 is beaten, but not by how much. I think if I were to rate all three headphones, I'd say something like:

1) K701 84%
2) HD650 82%
3) old DT880 78%

The difference is not huge, but the 880's are definitely the tail end of the three

I'd really like to hear these new 880's, as it's pretty clear they be better in the ways that the old one fell down on.