[MusicLover]

Quote:

Originally posted by zoomin is it just my setup, or is his voice in the last 30 seconds or so of this track terribly distorted?(3:10 on) Sounds really bad on my Speaker setup, a little more forgiving via Melos->HD580...

It is definitely distorted, but too obvious to be unintentional. I believe it was done on purpose. Any other opinions?

Btw redshifter, your sig, Team Humungous...

 

[sno1man]

I think its absolutely intentional. The piano gets louder and distorted sounding too. Maybe the idea of a harsh sound is associated with death. I.E> neither is a pleasant experinence.

The video imagery gets darker at the same point as I watch it again. So this was definitely thought out. It makes me appreciate it all the more.
g

 

[redshifter]

some things to know about "the shining" (can i hijack my own thread?)

- it was filmed to be shown on a regular square t.v. (open matte). for the cinema the projectionist will "matte" or cover the image for a widescreen aspect ratio. kubrick filmed it so it would work both ways, and the dvd is "open matte", not "pan and scan" per kubrick's instructions. this is why the dvd is not "widescreen". and if you buy the dvd, get the remastered one (it will say on the back). aside from some picture jumpiness in the red bathroom scene (red takes up the most memory space on a dvd) it is a near perfect dvd.

- watch the little ghost girls. 1st, they are not twins. 2nd, and creepiest, is they always appear in the exact center of the screen.

- watch the scene where the camera slowly pans back from the t.v. set as danny plays in front of it. the tv is not plugged in anywhere.

there is a great deal of depth to this horror film. would you believe me if i told you the subtext of the film was a parable about the plight of the american indian?

 

[zoomin]

Quote:

Originally posted by redshifter there is a great deal of depth to this horror film. would you believe me if i told you the subtext of the film was a parable about the plight of the american indian? [/B]

- please expand on this...

 

[redshifter]

i'll try...

- the overlook was built on a sacred native american burial ground, and many native americans died trying to prevent it from being built. this is mentioned specifically in the movie: the white man taking the land from the native american--and is treated as a joke by the ullman character.

- alcoholism is a real problem in some native american communities. note when jack takes his drink he mutters "white-man's burden", a reference to that very issue. alcoholism is also what drives the horror in this movie.

- the walls of the overlook are covered in indian rugs and artifacts. in the main room where jack tries to write, you may notice a large rug with what looks like a line of native american spirits on it, as jack bounces a ball off of it.

- use of the axe (in the book it was a mallet) as the killing weapon in the movie could be a reference to the tomahawk.

- there are many little details, such as "indian head" logos on the boxes in the kitchen, etc.

keep in mind that everything in a kubrick movie is there for a reason. there is not a square inch of image on screen that kubrick did not intend. to me the native american subtext has slowly evolved over repeated viewings. think of it: why all the native merican imagery? why does a place have a special, spiritual meaning (the overlook hotel)--these are things that are part of some native american cultures.

now remember, this is what i call a "subtext", or a theme that runs beneath the main themes, which are (1) a place can be evil and (2) an abusive father/husband. it is not something that kubrick makes obvious, but that is why his movies are so wonderful. i always notice something different each time--a new level if you will.

this is my take on it, and i may be wrong, but watch the film again and see if you agree.

 

[chadbang]

Redshifter, my best friend (from England, BTW) and I are planning a trip to the Timberline Lodge (the exterior of The Overlook Hotel) in Oregon within the year. I'll make sure to steal you a souvenir. Me, I'm going for a doorknob.

 

[sno1man]

You forgot to mention Scatman Crothers charatcter. He was defintely and mystic- shaman type of character.

You are right about Kubrick. He planned every little detail in all of his movies. There is no random element. However he also was more than willing to take good ideas and incorporate them in to his own movies.

The Shining owes quite a lot to the film "Carnival of Souls".

Kubrick was big on "the language of the genre". So for the Shining he watched lots of horror movies. For 2001 lots of scifi.

This to me does not diminish him but makes him greater. The abilty to synthesize ideas is just as original.

BTW: Stephen King does not like this movie. He thought that it went a long way from what he had written

g

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally posted by chadbang Redshifter, my best friend (from England, BTW) and I are planning a trip to the Timberline Lodge (the exterior of The Overlook Hotel) in Oregon within the year. I'll make sure to steal you a souvenir. Me, I'm going for a doorknob.

thanks chadbang, but i wouldn't want you to do anything shady for my sake, like, say taking the door number from room 237 for me.

you are absolutely right sno1man, i forgot to mention crothers. i couldn't find the words to describe the image of crothers' face when he gets danny's psychic cry for help--he almost looks native american rather than african american. for me films are about two things: faces and emotions. i believe kubrick felt the same way.

i have read that king's views on kubrick's "the shining" have softened over time. but i could see how kubrick could alienate a writer with his changes, and wasn't it kirk douglas who called kubrick a "talented crap"?

i will definately check out "carnival of souls". i think it may have been remade recently, but i'll check the imdb.org.

 

[MusicLover]

Quote:

Originally posted by sno1man BTW: Stephen King does not like this movie. He thought that it went a long way from what he had written g

He also thought Rose Red was one of the best horror movies ever made. I honestly thought it was crap.

 

[mbriant]

THANK YOU REDSHIFTER !!!! I caught a bit of a Johnny Cash tribute concert on TV a couple of days after he died (it was done while he was still alive...the performers (Dave Matthews, Kris Kristopherson, Chris Isaac, etc. ) all wore black) and they played some of "Hurt" but I didn't catch the name of it. I'd heard the original a few times and again didn't catch the name or who did it. My attempts to hum/sing the little bit I knew to the sales kid at HMV only managed to draw a pained smile. Just stumbled on this thread and bingo...there it is. Thanks again. I was never really a Cash fan, but after visiting Sun Studios in Memphis a few months ago, started paying more attention.

PS: Do you know, is that JC tribute concert available on DVD?

 

[Dusty Chalk]

Quote:

Originally posted by grinch i have trouble separating hurt from the rest of the downward spiral. in my mind, it will always be the finish of an incredible album.

I don't know, I found it a little too happy-go-lucky compared to the rest of the album. I mean, that last line, "...I would keep myself, I would find a way." It's downright optimistic. You know, sort of like that last final major chord in an otherwise minor piece (there's a name for it, I'm forgetting).

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally posted by Dusty Chalk I don't know, I found it a little too happy-go-lucky compared to the rest of the album. I mean, that last line, "...I would keep myself, I would find a way." It's downright optimistic. You know, sort of like that last final major chord in an otherwise minor piece (there's a name for it, I'm forgetting).

i completely disagree. "t.d.s." is a concept album, what i'm hearing is someone who has had everything taken from him, love becomes animal sex, lost religion, etc., just like the title. the guy is circling the drain. then "hurt". "hurt" is about a suicide. he remembers all his regrets and realizes they do not offer even cold comfort, injects himself with a lethal dose of herion ("the needle tears a hole"), the waves of the drug start pounding harder and harder, until death: that last cataclysmic chord. the song starts with the quiet resolution of someone who has decided to kill themselves. often before a suicide the person may even seem optimistic, because they've found the solution to their problems. perhaps that is regret in the final line, "it's too late, i'm going to die, if i had chance to do it over i would save myself instead." i'm sure many suicides have that thought right after they jump. he even has a last will of sorts ("you can have it all"), and like some suicides part of the reason they do it is to hurt someone.

the last drawn out noise on the album is the oblivion of death. no heaven or hell, just gone.


-edit-
mbriant:
you're welcome! i'm glad i helped you find that music.

 

[chadbang]

Quote:

thanks chadbang, but i wouldn't want you to do anything shady for my sake, like, say taking the door number from room 237 for me

Fifty-to-one says the got rid of that room number at the hotel.

 

[redshifter]

Quote:

Originally posted by chadbang Fifty-to-one says the got rid of that room number at the hotel.

well, in the book the room number is 217. i understand it was changed in the film at the request of the timberline because they actually have a room 217 there.