[frankclone]

I found a significant sonic improvement in upgrading
"Kind of Blue" & "Blue Train" CD's to newly remastered ones.
I'd like to upgrade more of my jazz collection as well as buy
new CDs that have been remastered using 20 or 24 bit
technologies. ("Art Pepper Meets the Rhythm Section"
& Mingus' "Ah Um" sound just beautiful as well)
Any recommendations for late '40's to early '60's jazz?

 

[porieux]

Check out the Rudy Van Gelder remaster series on Blue Note. The new Cannonball Adderly Somethin' Else for example is astounding.

 

[BenG]

I could give you a ton of recs if you be more specific(ie. style, label, musician, vocal vs. instrument, trio vs. small group vs. bigband, sound vs. performance, etc.)

The remastered HDCD of "Timeout" by Dave Brubeck is a must if you liked the sonic qualities of KOB or Ah Um(they were all recorded around the same time at the same studio).

If you need a good demo disc of high quality, early 60s trio music, the Verve Master Editions of "Night Train" or "We Get Requests" will blow you away at times. The VME of "Getz/Gilberto" is another easy rec.

I would also check out the other newer K2 or XRCD versions of Art Pepper on the Contemporary label. "Cookin'/Relaxin'/Workin' "by the Miles Davis Quintet in either the K2 or XRCD versions are all sure bets as well. The K2s of "Monk & Coltrane" or Monk "Brillant Corners" , both on Riverside, are stellar.

"Somethin' Else " is an awesome album but I don't like these Rudy Van Gelder Editions that much. The old Mofi edition is better. Rudy did a great job recording albums, but these new versions are not that great sounding - harsh & many poorly remixed imo. That being said, I own may of the Rudy Van Gelder Edition BN discs because they are classic recordings and on the cheap.

 

[frankclone]

Thanx--a good start. I have "Somethin' Else"( great album,Davis
overshadows Cannonball imo). Another great album: Grant
Green's "Idle Moments"
BenG: OK, I'll try to narrow it down:
--trio/quartet/quintet
--instrumental
--NO electric organ !
--late '40's bebop to early 60's (NO "avant garde/free jazz" !)
--Favorites: the usual suspects--Bird, Coltrane, Miles, Bill Evans,
Art Pepper, Chet Baker, T. Monk, Mingus, Jim Hall, Wes Montgomery, Max Roach, G. Mulligan, Freddie Hubbard, Getz,
Lee Konitz... & others yet to be discovered !

What's diff betwen K2 & XRCD ?

 

[BenG]

Quote:

Originally posted by frankclone What's diff betwen K2 & XRCD ?

They use the same K2 mastering process, while the XRCD has tighter manufactoring standards, costs twice as much, and is done by a different engineer. There are a few discs of both type out, and there have been debates on whether XRCD versions were always better or not.

There is a Wes Montgomery disc on both types called "Full House" and one only in K2 called "Incredible Jazz Guitar"

The Rhino Coltrane - "Giant Steps" & "My favorite Things"are musts primarily for the performances but are still better than the earlier releases.

Mingus - "Blues Roots", "Oh Yeah" on Rhino are great. Not as nicely recorded as Ah Um but musically comparable.

The new Miles releases of "Round about Midnight" and "Milestones" are in true stereo for the first time domestically.

The XRCDs of Bill Evans "Waltz for Debbie" & "Green Dolphin Street" are much better than the earlier OJC releases.

The VME of "Clifford Brown Max Roach" is killer mid 50s stuff, really impressive sound too. Getz/Byrd - "Jazz Samba" has really good sound on the latest release too.

The Paul Desmond featuring Jim Hall "Take Ten" & "Paul Desmond Gerry Mulligan" on RCA is some really nice stuff.

The closest alto player to bird had to be Sonny Stitt. And too of his classic albums "Constellation & Tune UP" were released on a comp called "Endgame Brillance" . They were recorded in in the early 70s, but trust me this is prime bebop, nicely recorded too. The re-issue label 32 Jazz went out of business so I would find this one quick.

As far as the BN RVGs (mainly for the performances) you should get:

Art Blakey & the Jazz Messengers - Moanin'
Horace Silver Quintet - Song for my Father & Blowin' the Blues Away
McCoy Tyner - The Real Mccoy
Hank Mobley - Soul Station
Kenny Burrell - Midnight Blue
Wayne Shorter - JuJu & Speak No Evil
Herbie Hancock - Maiden Voyage
Joe Henderson - Our Thing
Miles - Birth of Cool(This actually uses the orginal tapes for the first time)
Freddie Hubbard - Hubtones

Phew... Happy Listening

 

[frankclone]

Thanx BenG !!!--I'm going to go out on a mad shopping spree!
....once I find my credit card.
I have "Blues & Roots" & "Giant Steps" on Atlantic (WEA)--there
is audible room for improvement there. I'll look for Rhino, then.

Oh, one more thing...any real good remasterings of Django
Reinhardt ? Given that most recordings are from '30's, I wonder
how much engineering magic can be performed....
oh, & just one more thing --any fine remastrings of C. Parker's
Savoy & Dial sessions? Here again we're dealing with ancient
technology (late 40's)--judging from Verve Parker "Jazz Masters" CD, recording technology made a dramatic change around 1951.
Before that Bird's horn sounds thin & combos sound muddy.

 

[88Sound]

I guess this doesn't really qualify for the time period you've specified, but it's close, unfortunately expensive, but excellent.
Miles Davis Quintet 1965-68 Boxed Set (six CD's). This group of musicians is known as Miles 2nd great quintet. Herbie Hancock, Wayne Shorter, Ron Carter, and Tony Williams. This is a 20 bit remaster. The music is incredible. If you're not sure you like this type of jazz, you can go to Amazon.com and listen to samples.

 

[BenG]

Some other recent K2s(limited to 10,000 pressings) -

Monk's Music
Thelonious Himself

Sonny Rollins -
Way Out West(from Contemporary label, great sound like the Art Pepper)
Saxophone Colossus
Sound of Sonny

Red Garland- Groovy

Cannonball Adderley in San Francisco

Milt Jakson/Wes Montgomery - Bag meets Wes

Bill Evans - Portrait in Jazz
Sunday at the Village Vanguard

Chet Baker - Chet
In New York

Coltrane - Coltrane(Prestige)
Soultrane

Miles Davis - Walkin'
Bag's Groove
And Modern Jazz Giants

Eric Dolphy - Outward Bound

Joe Pass - Virtuoso

Coltrane Rhinos - Trane plays the Blues
Ole Coltrane
Coltrane Jazz
Coltrane's Sound

on Impulse(more conservative sets) -
Africa Brass Sessions
Ballads
Trane & Ellington(one of my favs)
Trane & Johnny Hartman
Live at Birdland
Best of Live at the Village Vanguard

Mingus - Mingus, Mingus, Mingus, Mingus, Mingus
Tijuana Moods
The Clown

 

[Milestones]

Frankclone:

You asked about a good remastering of Django Rheinhardt's music.

What you need to get to start with Django's music is a 5 cd box set by a British label called JSP that is titled "The Classic Early Recordings in Chronolgical Order". In this case it is Ted Kendall who has done the remastering and the JSP Django box set is widely acknowledged as the best sounding remastering of Django's material available.

JSP is a label that specializes in taking classic jazz recordings (they also have done the best re-mastering of Louis Armstrong's seminal "Hot Fives and Sevens" IMO) and doing pain staking remasterings of the material from the original sources if at all possible.

The best news is that not only is this Django box set the best sounding version of Django's most important music, but they also have made this box set available at the budget price of $25.00 for five cds!

If you are at all intersted in Django's music you should pick up this set.

I would also recommend the JSP "Hot Fives and Sevens" box set which IMO is better than the recent Sony/Columbia box set which sells for over $50.00. The JSP "Hot Fives and Sevens" box set is also available for only $25.00.

For remasterings of 50s and 60s jazz recordings, in addition to the RVG and K2/XRCDs that have been mentioned, I would point out that the recent Impulse remasterings, of Coltranes "A Love Supreme" and Oliver Nelson's "Blues and the Abstract Truth", for example, are very fine remasterings. Also Rhino has done some good remasterings of classic jazz material. The Rhinos are in annoying carboard cases instead of the typical and durable jewel case - but they generally sound great. An example of a Rhino remastering would be Coltrane's "Giant Steps", or Art Blakey and the Jazz Messengers with Thelonious Monk on an album by the same name.

Enjoy these great re-masterings of this absolutely phenomenal jazz music - I sure do.

 

[BenG]

I can't believe I forgot that one! - this is one of the best sounding Impulse jobs. Anyone with a passing interest in the genre, should try this one.

A Love Supreme speaks for its self too.

The Art Blakey & the Jazz Messengers from the 80s on Concord is stuff you should check out at some point too - no contemporary slickness here, just some good old barn burning.

 

[frankclone]

a wealth of info !
I'm still debating Giant Steps upgrade--sells at CD store for
almost $30 Cdn.!!! (about $20 U.S.) while RVG's sell for $17 Cdn.
the Django price sounds definitely doable !

 

[BenG]

Here's an idea, why don't you sell your older copies at some point. That was a way I could justify upgrading some of my older copies.

It also pays to have used record shops in your area - I found a promo copy of a $20 dollar 2-CD set for $5.99 at a local store recently.

 

[Old Pa]

BenG had all my suggestions and gave me quite a few extra. Thanks! It seems like this is a really good time to get into this kind of collecting. I have had good price luck at AllDirect.com for hi-bit jazz remasters. You just need to be able to identify the recording you want by label and issue date as well as artist and title, as their product descriptions do not include much recording information.

 

[BenG]

A re-issue label that went out business called "32 Jazz" re-issued some generally decent to high quality music at a very low price(starting at $9.99 for single CDs). A few of these recordings could be considered classic. These are some of my fav CDs:

Sonny Stitt - Endgame Brillance(albums Tune-Up & Constellation)
Grant Green - Iron City
20 Special Fingers - Les McCann - Much Les & Mitchell Ruff Trio.
Charlie Rouse(from Monk's group) - Epistrophy

Do a label search and find these while you can. Other artists like Kenny Burrell, Pat Martino, Hank Jones, Woody Shaw, Rasaan Roland Kirk, Kenny Barron, are all lurking in the cataloge.

 

[SEK]

I have really enjoyed the Legacy reissues of Miles Davis sessions. The sound is quite improved from the first cd issues and the original vinyl.

A caveat concerning the RVG reissues:

For those of us who started with the original vinyl and have grown to love the music over the years with what I considered to be Blue Note's trademark stereo separation (ie. Wayne Shorter's sax emanating from one speaker and Lee Morgan's trumpet emanating from the other on a Blakey recording), the new RVGs may be disappointing or, at least, take a little while to get used to. Everything is moved towards the middle, semi-monaural. Also, sometimes the overall sound is clearer for some instruments, while other instruments are, overall, unimproved or degraded. So it's a matter of tradeoffs. When extra tracks are offered, that can help tip the balance in favor of an upgrade.

For those who are getting acquainted with classic Blue Note recordings for the first time, of course, these reissues are great opportunities to get some of the best music ever produced on planet Earth.