[Hellacious D]

I recently read this article http://www.whathifi.com/newsMainTemp...ewssectionID=3 and now I'm wondering if I can even make an exact copy of a CD. Will any cd burner and the cd burning software that comes with it be capable of making exact copies? Are there any programs or burners that you guys can recommend to me for making exact copies? What format should I be using for any high end cd player? Will the type of disc I use make a difference?
Thanks ,
Jeff

 

[hempcamp]

This isn't the right forum, methinks. But anyway...

That article you linked is a very weak argument. The question at the top is "Why [copies of discs] can sound different than the original," but it never actually explains how. It just states the problem that there are complexities and corrections involved with reading digital data, then leaps to the conclusion that several improvements will "likely give a better sound." HOW do even spirals, etc solve the stated problem? NO iota of explanation is given.

And, farcically, it ends with the statement: "No, all digital equipment doesn't sound the same, however much logic might suggest otherwise." Is that to suggest that the writers are being illogical? Bingo.

--Chris

 

[Hellacious D]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hempcamp /img/forum/go_quote.gif This isn't the right forum, methinks. But anyway... That article you linked is a very weak argument. The question at the top is "Why [copies of discs] can sound different than the original," but it never actually explains how. It just states the problem that there are complexities and corrections involved with reading digital data, then leaps to the conclusion that several improvements will "likely give a better sound." HOW do even spirals, etc solve the stated problem? NO iota of explanation is given. And, farcically, it ends with the statement: "No, all digital equipment doesn't sound the same, however much logic might suggest otherwise." Is that to suggest that the writers are being illogical? Bingo. --Chris

I entirely agree with you, though my thread wouldn't lead you to belive that. I'm just wondering if there is any truth to this. Does it really matter what software one uses? Does the quality of the burner matter?

 

[hempcamp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellacious D /img/forum/go_quote.gif Does it really matter what software one uses? Does the quality of the burner matter?

It matters, but only to a degree. Error-prone software does exist, but most every reputable software package for ripping/burning is fine. If you rip/burn a CD using software that checks for errors, or better yet if you use a checksum of the CD against the original (a tad anal-retentive, but a good way to prove to non-believers), you will certainly never "hear" differences. Either the CD will be good or it will be bad, the checksum will verify or it will not.

A checksum works literally by "summing" the data of the original using an algorithm and "summing" the data of the copy using the same algorithm and comparing the two resultant values. If even one bit is off in the copy, the sum won't verify and you know there is a problem with the disc (or, more rarely, the drive or software). DISCLAIMER: It's not 100% foolproof because two different sets of data can, on extremely rare occasions, sum the same, but in that case you would more likely have a *completely* different set of data (perhaps one that wouldn't even play). It is a highly unlikely scenario -- errors like these usually happen on purpose, i.e. people fooling with the data to make the checksum work.

Unless, of course, our ears work in some other mathematical universe where 2 and 2 equals 7.

--Chris

 

[K2Grey]

It's indeed very much possible to make an exact (for all practical purposes) copy of a CD and it can be done without much hassle.

After all, a CD is digital, it stores 0's and 1's. Two CDs may be considered identical as long as, when they are read, they return the same bits in the same order. The exact encoding of the 0's and 1's isn't necessarily the same, but what matters is not the physical composition of the CD but rather whether the information that is obtained from them is identical.

 

[werdwerdus]

In making exact copies of a cd, both read and write offset are important, so keep that in mind. EAC can use both if they are know for your drive (or you can do some tests to figure them out for yourself). Accuraterip is a good tool for exact copies of tracks.

 

[puiah11]

If I remember it's actually difficult to get an exact copy of the CD since the CD vendors have special hardware.

http://www.cdfreaks.com/

looks like they changed their site a little bit. I'm sure you can find the info there, they are pretty good at everything CD.

 

[Laptopia]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellacious D /img/forum/go_quote.gif I recently read this article http://www.whathifi.com/newsMainTemp...ewssectionID=3 and now I'm wondering if I can even make an exact copy of a CD. Will any cd burner and the cd burning software that comes with it be capable of making exact copies? Are there any programs or burners that you guys can recommend to me for making exact copies? What format should I be using for any high end cd player? Will the type of disc I use make a difference? Thanks , Jeff

You can. Use Exact Audio Copy to burn a continuous FLAC file with cue sheet. Install Burrn (forgot how many r's). Open that cuesheet from Burrn, and burn to disc. Makes a bit-perfect copy.

This is good way to build a lossless digital library of all of your CDs. If you ever lose or break a CD, just go to your machine and burn another.

Peace.

 

[Nacher]

I just love those hifi-articles about copying CDs. All kinds of ideas from even spirals to black CDs to "improve the sound", in some cases even beyond the original. All these articles are about as scientific as voodoo magic. They may be good at fooling someone who really has a very limited knowledge about digital audio, but the amount of factual errors and cutted corners in those articles are just amusing.

If the CS holds same zeros and ones in same order, it will sound identical. The buffer of you cd-players memory really doesn't care about even spirals or uneven distances beetween the bits. It's like saying a copy of Microsoft Word is going to be different than the original. Have some extra features and work faster.

 

[steevc]

I've thought about this on and off. Assuming you use software like EAC that makes all the checks to ensure that you have the exact bits that were on the CD, you can have a perfect copy on your hard drive in your preferred lossless format. That process can take hours if necessary as you only do it once.

If you play that back from the drive you will always get exactly the same result. Any variation in the audio quality is down to the analogue circuitry etc.

So can a good, lossless rip ever sound worse than an expensive CD transport that has all the standard black magic? I know there are some premium systems that rip to a drive and play from there. Is there any need for mega expensive transports?